# I regret to inform that we still don't die enough **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Tags:** pvp\ **Created:** [November 15, 2021, 4:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984 "2021-11-15T16:34:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 35
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2021, 9:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/702 "2021-12-11T21:17:10Z")
Sometimes its corp or alliance driven, as in they don’t wanna bring negative attention. Other times, its because they want to be two faced and be able to pop their mouth off without offending people or having people treat them different. As for me? This me main and only main. If you’re sore about what I say to you on the forums, find me in game and let the anti matter talk 😃 For all this “hate” I get on here, rarely do people try to kill me based on the forums. Of course I do practice the gamall vegur so, if I do get caught its because I was slipping. ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2021, 10:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/703 "2021-12-11T22:53:55Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > Botane has a huge gank fleet docked up there Sadly “docked up” are the key words here. They sit in complete safely while waiting for a hapless victim to come along. I’m not anti gank by any means but I do believe it is too “safe” for the gankers. It needs to have more “risk” attached to it. Ganking is possibly the only pvp activity you can do in Eve that has fixed outcomes. You either kill your target and die to Concord or you fail the gank and die to Concord, either way you simply redock with complete safety and wait for your next victim. Thanks to CCP ganking has become even “safer” over the years thanks to the new improved wardec system. The “anti gank” movement has grown over the years but thanks to CCP they are all but impotent. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2021, 10:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/704 "2021-12-11T22:55:59Z")
> [@Sgt\_Ocker](#): > > Thanks to CCP ganking has become even “safer” over the years thanks to the new improved wardec system. LOL What do you think would happen to the AGs if they weren’t war-exempt? ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2021, 10:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/705 "2021-12-11T22:56:19Z")
Yea, as is anyone else who is docked up. But when you jump into local, you see them in local 😃 If I jump into local and see 20 gankers somewhere in system, and I’m like oh cool I’m so gonna mine here, I fully deserve the death that is coming. And no, ganking isn’t safer due to war deccing. If anything lack of actual war deccs have made newbies grow into an EVE that they think is safe. They put that victim hat on proudly and then die screaming. ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2021, 11:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/706 "2021-12-11T23:25:01Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > it won’t be a healthy one if people approach it solely from a “■■■■ you, got mine” perspective. That right there, IS 90% of Eve. From the Bloks to the highsec mining corps, from mission runners to gankers, “Fuk you, got mine” is the mantra shouted from the hilltops. And damn anyone who says they are wrong, the “game” isn’t “A” community as much as it is many small communities working in the same place to reach their own agendas. So working EXACTLY as CCP designed it. > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > there’s no longer an economy and everything is meaningless. There are two sides to that. I used to enjoy taking a T1 battleship to lowsec for a bit of solo pvp fun. I very rarely took that ship home but it was fun. Now with the way the economy is in the game, I don’t even undock battleships. Not because I can’t afford the loss but because the loss isn’t fun anymore. Losing a 200mil isk battleship to a bunch of frigates and destroyers was “fun”, losing a 500+mil isk ship in the same way, just isn’t as much fun. Same with capitals, throwing dreads around like some toss around T1 frigates was fun, when they were easliy replaced but thanks to CCP’s screwup 5 or 6 years ago the whole capital meta has been removed for all but the biggest groups (which quite frankly are as boring as watching grass grow). One of CCP’s statd goals with “scarcity” was to curb super proliferation, sadly they broke capital game play for all but the major/mega groups. If CCP “really” want to see destruction in game they need to rethink theindustry changes that broke many aspects of destruction. IE; want to “fix” super proliferation - Make SUPERS harder to build, not everything battleship and above. Breaking/changing many things in an attempt to fix ONE issue never works out well. Sorry for the rant Destiny, needed to get it out. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2021, 11:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/707 "2021-12-11T23:27:55Z")
I, for one, am liking the smaller fleets out there now. I always felt battleships are most effective vs cruisers and up. For fleet use, they need smaller ships to run tackle/interference. You can take the mega out for a spin, just know you got some limitations solo. If you take the mega out for a spin with an inty friend and a curse/arby friend well, then you got some real fun. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2021, 11:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/708 "2021-12-11T23:46:55Z")
> [@Sgt\_Ocker](#): > > Losing a 200mil isk battleship to a bunch of frigates and destroyers was “fun”, losing a 500+mil isk ship in the same way, just isn’t as much fun. Why would it be any less fun? If it’s merely an affordability issue, all you have to do is perform the activity 2.5x times less often, but it shouldn’t be any less “fun” because the act itself is fundamentally the same. Also, are you adjusting for the fact that ISK itself is now more common and easy to make? I’m not entirely sure that making 200 million 10 years ago was more difficult than making 500 million today. Before incursions were released, battleships cost around ~130 million, but the upper range of income limits was around 40 million ISK per hour. Today, it is 10 times that amount, and “reasonable” incomes for older players are around 200 million an hour. ---
**Author:** ![Jin\_Endares](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jin_endares/32/413291_2.png) [@Jin\_Endares](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jin_Endares)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 12:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/709 "2021-12-12T00:57:38Z")
> [@Duella\_Cre\_Vil](#): > > Why do people post in alts? Are they afraid they’ll lose their space streed cred or some sort of bs? These forums are **vicious**! Need to hide your true main toon. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 1:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/710 "2021-12-12T01:21:17Z")
Oh? Why? ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 1:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/711 "2021-12-12T01:42:45Z")
Yeah, this is why I only post on a character that’s in a war-ineligible corporation. The forums are pretty brutal, and I don’t want someone like Dracvlad/Kezrai/Epeen to be able to grief me in-game too. ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 2:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/712 "2021-12-12T02:30:59Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Also, are you adjusting for the fact that ISK itself is now more common and easy to make? That depends entirely on how far CCP nerfed your play style. Personally my income has goe down in recent years and without putting in far more effort than I’m prepared to I don’t see that changing > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > all you have to do is perform the activity 2.5x times less often So I should just play the game less? > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > upper range of income limits was around 40 million ISK per hour Not with 15 accounts it wasn’t. I’d make 5 or 6 hundred mil in a couple of hours then spend the rest of my time “enjoying” the game. > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > battleships cost around ~130 million Yep they did and building your own made them even cheaper to use as throw away ships in situations where you knew going in your ship was going to die and that was pretty much right up till the industry changes. T1 Battleships have never really been in a good place for pvp and tripling their price didn’t help that situation. It just means they don’t get used. > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Today, it is 10 times that amount, and “reasonable” incomes for older players are around 200 million an hour. I’m yet to find a way to make 200 mil p/h with a single character since leaving nulsec in disgust. About 60 is my average but I’ll admit to not being anywhere near as committed to Eve as I used to be. It really doesn’t have much going for it anymore. The alliance I was in for years disolved and my old corp joined Goons, that wasn’t an option for me so currently residing in lowsec/highsec looking at options, which seem pretty limited. ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 2:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/713 "2021-12-12T02:32:46Z")
> [@Duella\_Cre\_Vil](#): > > Why do people post in alts Some time ago there were alliances that didn’t allow line members to post on their mains. Which is how my forum alt came about. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 8:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/714 "2021-12-12T08:42:36Z")
LOL, It sucks being griefed, I can tell you that from experience. I wouldn’t have thought forum exchanges would have caused fights in game though. Is this common? ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 8:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/715 "2021-12-12T08:44:37Z")
> [@Sgt\_Ocker](#): > > That depends entirely on how far CCP nerfed your play style. Personally my income has goe down in recent years and without putting in far more effort than I’m prepared to I don’t see that changing Was you the dude with 60 characters before the massive capital jump changes hit? ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 8:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/716 "2021-12-12T08:56:55Z")
Nah, I used to run 15 accounts but only 5 of those flew caps/supers. I usually only fielded 2 at a time though. Down to 2 Omega accts now and can’t see that changing any time soon ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 9:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/717 "2021-12-12T09:02:18Z")
Ah, I can see how it would be too much running 15 accounts, I’m glad you’re still part of the game. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 9:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/718 "2021-12-12T09:10:54Z")
I still hold out hope CCP will do something to get me excited about playing again. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 9:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/719 "2021-12-12T09:19:11Z")
After playing my game solo for so long I’m more excited about making new friends more than any change CCP could ever make. I try to keep eve simple, as long as I can pve and pvp i’ll be reasonably happy. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 9:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/720 "2021-12-12T09:42:28Z")
Maybe some day Ill “play” the game as everyone else seems to do. Thats a lot of Omegas to activate so maybe Ill wait till the next stimulus cheque. ---
**Author:** ![Xucca](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xucca/32/373499_2.png) [@Xucca](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xucca)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2021, 3:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984/721 "2021-12-12T15:35:53Z")
I never wanted to bring PVP statistics. I find it useless and I have no clue about the data gathering methods. For example, in most of what’s considered PVP, one part of such encounters had zero plans to engage. I would like to erase this “EVE is PVP blah blah” bull$hit from everywhere. EVE is not a PVP game. Those statistics plus my perspective --right or wrong-- lead me to reject that pseudofact. If only the destruction came 5 - 10% from players, I wouldn’t have tried on this discussion. I see peeps defending PVP from narrow scoped, biased postures because they are trying to defend a decaying gaming style they’ve chosen to adopt. This doesn’t make them right or wrong, but for the particular case, the game is wrong for not having more choices. I guess eventually, I’ll create a “Sorry folks, EVE is not a PVP game anymore” post. Those mentioned Statistics are a sad picture of a game portrayed as PVP oriented. Something must be done. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984.md?page=34) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/i-regret-to-inform-that-we-still-dont-die-enough/336984.md?page=36)