# If the number of players on the server is not higher by this time next year **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [August 16, 2023, 9:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161 "2023-08-16T09:32:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2023, 8:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/327 "2023-08-29T20:19:56Z")
You don’t get to read all my evemail! We are not afraid! ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 12:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/328 "2023-08-30T00:51:01Z")
> [@Ciryc\_Lagrej](#): > > Except that pool of people willing to be behind gets smaller and smaller as the game ages and new players start further and further behind. That assumes that all the players from 20 years ago are still in the game or haven’t died in the mean time. Its all an equally fair conveyor belt…and you have to be on it to move forward. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 1:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/329 "2023-08-30T01:34:58Z")
> [@Io\_Koval](#): > > People who complain about catching up don’t understand the game, and their kind are better suited endlessly roleplaying a robot by grinding out levels and items in WoW or Guild Wars 2 or FFFFFXIVXIVX. That’s not why people play those games. Not only can you not “endlessly” grind levels and items there, but the main driver for doing anything to begin with (aside maybe for the very casual subset) is _prestige._ I’ve played those other games a lot too, and can absolutely guarantee that the average player in a game like WoW is actually more _competitive_ than the average player in EVE. EVE players seem to have this particular take on the Dunning-Kruger effect where they think that they’re the “elites” of the gaming world, yet people consistently forget that this game is like 75% people mining and running missions in high-sec and complaining on the forums about gankers and the price of minerals when they’re not logged in. It is this intuitive drive to avoid the discomfort caused by such cognitive dissonance that makes so many EVE players so presumptuous and complacent. In reality, most of them are _nowhere_ near as proficient in comparison to other gamers as they believe themselves to be. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 2:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/330 "2023-08-30T02:51:32Z")
> [@betoli](#): > > Its difficult to imagine a new player warm to the idea that they have to wait 2+ years to compete on an even playing field with an established player This is carebear nonsense. You don’t need 2 years to do well in this game. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 2:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/331 "2023-08-30T02:56:21Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > I’ve played those other games a lot too, and can absolutely guarantee that the average player in a game like WoW is actually more _competitive_ than the average player in EVE. Never played WoW…but surely the difference is that stats in that are current and though you can have negative status items most people are in the positive. Unlike in Eve where a person can have 56943 ship losses and 1 kill and that is a permanent record. Eve player cannot do anything to remove their ‘negative stats’. ---
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 4:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/332 "2023-08-30T04:19:53Z")
Let’s make skills instant learning via the NES store! Why not just skip the skill injectors? ---
**Author:** ![Kaj\_A\_Beardhat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kaj_a_beardhat/32/449367_2.png) [@Kaj\_A\_Beardhat](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kaj_A_Beardhat)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 5:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/333 "2023-08-30T05:35:45Z")
I doubt players, let alone CSM has the power to make fundamental changes one way or another these days. The current state of the game is in such a bad way that if everyone who did care about it quit tomorrow all that would happen is that Tranqulity would become Serenity 2 as all the bots and mass skillpoint buyers would simply take over, all while CCP continues to make money from them buying more skills to replaced banned accounts. We will never be able to have a summer of rage 2, it just won’t do anything, we let it boil like a frog, and its too late to jump out. ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 5:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/334 "2023-08-30T05:37:49Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > That’s not why people play those games. Which is not the point I’m trying to make. It is possible for the following to be true… - “Catching up” doesn’t make sense in Eve Online - “Catching up” does make sense in other games …_and_ for the following to be true… - Some players are highly motivated to be proficient in Eve Online - Some players are highly motivated to be proficient in other games …in some relative proportion. I tell people to go to different games because it matches their expectations better of what they want out of a game and signals that they don’t understand the different gaming cultural meta-mindset that Eve Online requires. Eve has its roots going back 20 years to UO and that lineage of answering “what is a game” with “a sandbox in which you can thrive with whatever goal you want” is very small compared to the modern gamer answer of “on-rails experience completing the checklist that the game gives you”. There is nothing to “catch up” on in the former. The latter has a big bulleted list to “catch up” on. ---
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 6:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/335 "2023-08-30T06:42:25Z")
I read over your negativity and then started thinking do they cut the legs off of the frogs before you boil them? How can a frog jump out with out any legs? ---
**Author:** ![betoli](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/betoli/32/384273_2.png) [@betoli](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/betoli)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 7:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/336 "2023-08-30T07:23:40Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > This is carebear nonsense. > > You don’t need 2 years to do well in this game. Am well aware. My point was that the mechanic of buying (with time or $) skills is a poor one. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 7:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/337 "2023-08-30T07:25:15Z")
You don’t need to buy anything. Stop whining, and start trying. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 7:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/338 "2023-08-30T07:26:00Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > You don’t need to buy anything. Except a mining permit. ---
**Author:** ![Dyver\_Phycad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dyver_phycad/32/358575_2.png) [@Dyver\_Phycad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dyver_Phycad)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 7:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/339 "2023-08-30T07:49:45Z")
> [@betoli](#): > > Its difficult to imagine a new player warm to the idea that they have to wait 2+ years to compete on an even playing field with an established player > **[Dramiel | Caligula's Horse | Killmail](https://zkillboard.com/kill/67725360/)** > > Caligula's Horse (Yarrbear Inc.) lost their Dramiel in Nikkishina (The Citadel) Total Value: 169,078,684.79 ISK You don’t need to wait for years to compete with established players. You only need to learn how to fly the ships you are available to you. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 7:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/340 "2023-08-30T07:57:12Z")
It’s kind of sad to see how many people defeat themselves with their own negativity and erroneous assumptions about how to succeed. ---
**Author:** ![Aramatheia](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aramatheia/32/383412_2.png) [@Aramatheia](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aramatheia)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 8:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/341 "2023-08-30T08:43:48Z")
i’d see it more akin to say, a drivers license. You dont need to read a book for a month to learn how to drive a car. You dont need to read anything. The only way to learn how to do the task is to grab the wheel and start pushing pedals. Through time you grow better. usually the first period of time you are doing the task under supervision. They dont need “hand holding” as such in the game. > [@betoli](#): > > Its difficult to imagine a new player warm to the idea that they have to wait 2+ years to compete on an even playing field with an established player - even if it’s 2 years of active experience (sitting in a hull) rather than watching the calendar. Being able to pay to win just makes that even harder to swallow. My idea i proposed earlier would be more akin to the stages after supervision. Where by being on the road you improve your skills. Skill book is the supervision mode, further levels come by engaging in content. By playing content in the ship of choice is how you’d level it. If you “no lifed” a given ship type you would “level” it faster than if you didnt use it, or only used it sporadically. But it would be faster than the current system of waiting for ages with no actual interaction with the system. Currently eve operates on a matrix teach me kung fu method, but the file transfer rate is in bits per hour ---
**Author:** ![Akkar\_Kardashev](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/akkar_kardashev/32/514189_2.png) [@Akkar\_Kardashev](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Akkar_Kardashev)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 11:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/342 "2023-08-30T11:48:24Z")
Two players could join on the exact same time and date and still end up entirely disparate in terms their skills and effectiveness. A 2 month old alt could skill up on a Hecate and get there before an old character like mine. Due to the wide and varied nature of the skills table, it’s rare to have two perfectly equally matched players, and i’ve never heard of it happening outside of a situation where a guy trains two characters identically (one to use, one to sell? wear one wash one?) The skilling in eve is probably responsible for the fact that people aren’t getting insta-ganked by titans every 10 minutes, and should be appreciated imho. ---
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 12:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/343 "2023-08-30T12:56:21Z")
The whole scarcity patch going forward has been a success. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 1:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/344 "2023-08-30T13:09:03Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > You don’t need 2 years to do well in this game. I have a 4 month old account that’s already flying Phantasm, Augoror, Vedmak, Retribution and is just days away from Apoc skills. Not bad for just 8m skill points. ---
**Author:** ![Pete\_Tensi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pete_tensi/32/385037_2.png) [@Pete\_Tensi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pete_Tensi)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2023, 7:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/345 "2023-09-02T07:15:48Z")
Read the thread during downtime. FWIW I think CCP is right to focus on the needs of large alliances because Eve’s survival basically depend on retaining the whales. “Whales” - players with money and ambition - have an outsized role in keep the servers going. Every whale that quits Eve for whatever reasons, lost a war, politics, boredom, takes with them a part of the ecosystem resulting in price inflation for PLEX and more grinding required for plexers, which leads to burnout etc. Until such a time when the ecosystem is diminished past the tipping point. So yeah, this thread is pertinent. About the NFTs, sure it will gratify certain individuals who want flashy in-game things to distinguish their asset from all other assets, so if it keeps the whales happy then fine. Although I think they should have explored the VR aspect because I thought the first person camera (the “+” button left of cap meter) was really cool though impractical for combat. But imagine the vastness of space filling your entire field of vision instead of a flat panel monitor! The beautiful updated graphics can be better appreciated too. As for how to actually select objects and push buttons, I have absolutely no effing clue 😆 ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2023, 1:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161/346 "2023-09-03T01:23:05Z")
> [@Pete\_Tensi](#): > > I have absolutely no effing clue We know. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161.md?page=16) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/if-the-number-of-players-on-the-server-is-not-higher-by-this-time-next-year/416161.md?page=18)