# Imbalance ships or why I play money for? And few more problems **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Tags:** pve, pvp\ **Created:** [April 12, 2020, 7:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020 "2020-04-12T19:48:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Shipwreck\_Jones](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shipwreck_jones/32/274382_2.png) [@Shipwreck\_Jones](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shipwreck_Jones)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/21 "2020-04-13T01:26:35Z")
Dog, I’m willing to bet that the kikimora could be deleted from the game and you’d still be having problems. Like, your killboard isn’t exactly all green with a few kiki losses. Look, there are levels of competency, and based on your attitude and killboard, I’m willing to bet that you’re in the Advanced beginner stage on the Dreyfus Model of Skill Acquisition. It’s a good start, but you are going to lock yourself into that level if you don’t start asking yourself what you can do differently to avoid losses and secure kills. ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/4/9/49eafe0f3e996ebbac70f04fb52743c88d314632.jpeg) Also, I was going to just look for Assault Frigate kills of Kiki’s, but here are all the solo kills against a PvP fit kiki by a hull that cost less 156mil jita sell price on April 12th (one day only). I ignored PvE fit kikimora losses, multiple pilot kills, kills made by ships that that cost even one isk more than the kiki, and, of course, kills by other kikimoras. [Enyo](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83288171/) (which is particularly noteworthy for being a single Assault Frigate) [Thrasher](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83278805/) (Notable for being the cheapest ship on this list) [Vexor Navy Issue](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83275032/) [Sentinel](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83274549/) [Vexor Navy Issue](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83274545/) [Caracal](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83272055/) [Fed Navy Commet](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83265554/) [Harpy](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83258782/) (Oh look, another assault frigate) [Omen Navy Issue](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83258503/) [Hecate](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83252748/) ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/22 "2020-04-13T01:27:11Z")
Really funny, ppl think that I never play EvE. Guys, I’m not Neeebie, and I understand game mechanics well. I remember imbalance twice, now 3d. ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/23 "2020-04-13T01:28:30Z")
Why do people even attempt to game on a Mac? A Mac is good for two things. Video production, and being used as a boat anchor… ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/24 "2020-04-13T01:32:10Z")
> [@Shipwreck\_Jones](#): > > Look, there are levels of competency, and based on your attitude and killboard, I’m willing to bet that you’re in the Advanced beginner stage Please, read and pay attentino to the my start-topic. I started from 2007 or 2008, don’t remember. 2015 I leave from game. Now, after 4 year brake return. With new character. So please, do not talk like this. Game mechanics works by the game is built on counterweights, counterarguments. Kiki, as any triglaves have a problems. But this problems weak. And again: read the topic again. Try understand first of all what is about. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/25 "2020-04-13T01:33:19Z")
> [@QuakeGod](#): > > Why do people even attempt to game on a Mac? A Mac is good for two things. Video production, and being used as a boat anchor… Cause product provider declare that it’s will be working. I agree with taht, pay money and play. Product doesn’t work as expected. Why ppl don’t like macs? ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/26 "2020-04-13T01:35:27Z")
> [@Shipwreck\_Jones](#): > > [Enyo](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83288171/) (which is particularly noteworthy for being a single Assault Frigate) > [Thrasher](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83278805/) (Notable for being the cheapest ship on this list) > [Vexor Navy Issue](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83275032/) > [Sentinel](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83274549/) > [Vexor Navy Issue](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83274545/) > [Caracal](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83272055/) > [Fed Navy Commet](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83265554/) > [Harpy](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83258782/) (Oh look, another assault frigate) > [Omen Navy Issue](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83258503/) > [Hecate](https://zkillboard.com/kill/83252748/) Kiki 293,286 kills vs 29,096 loses… according to zkill, also price in game. So, yes, you can link single kills for next morning, up to you 😉 I trust numbers. ---
**Author:** ![Shipwreck\_Jones](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shipwreck_jones/32/274382_2.png) [@Shipwreck\_Jones](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shipwreck_Jones)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/27 "2020-04-13T01:47:31Z")
Dog, I said earlier that the Kiki was op. The point I was trying to make is that there is no I-Win button in Eve, and that player skill is still the biggest determining factor in fight outcomes. But, I’m pretty sure I’m wasting my breath. Anyway, I probably could have phrased my argument more tactfully, but I’m not trying to talk down to you. So, sorry about that. Alright, I’m out. Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/28 "2020-04-13T01:51:47Z")
> [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > first thing first: Your manner of communicating is unpleasant, offensive. Your lack of thought in your post was also unpleasant and offensive to me, so I guess we are even, then. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Kill on enyo, yes I see the same. Wha’s this shows? It shows you are wrong. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Mac? Why Mac? Why CCP delivery this content on mac? Company declare a product works on Mac? Ok. No? Company problem. It works on Mac. No one said it will work perfectly and without issue. Even PC users have issues with EVE sometimes. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > I starded early, and I know about game something. Even that Worm and Gila and, meyba rattle, is a drone boat. Tnx CO! Yes. And yet you rattled on about Missiles. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Hm… what I’m doing wrong if I do the same? Any char whih I ever had in this game did the same. Or I said something about it? Or I even said something that I’ve get Temperst and after rifter? You went on and on about MIssiles. Drone boats are just as popular. You were wrong there. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Again, even for you. Explain a bit. BPC od kiki very expensive\< why? Overpriced for a reason? Just in case? No. No. Kikimora Blueprints are essentially the same as Pirate BPCs, and unlike Pirate BPCs, are only available as drops so far, and not available in any LP store. The components needed are also specialized and are not just regular T2 components or minerals, that also only drop and cannot be mined. This is one of the reason for the high prices. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > If you really want understand trust numbers, they don’t lie. Kiki 293,286 kills vs 29,096 loses… 293,286 / 29,096 is around 10% losses versus 90% kills. Cynabal: 2,122,930 / 117,562 or 5% loss, 95% kills. 140 million isk Orthrus: 947,143 / 51,273 or 5% loss, 95% kills. 240 million isk. Phantasm: 356,194 / 31,214 or 8% loss, 92% kills. 100 million isk. Stratios: 799,515 / 99,229 or 12% loss, 88% kills. 268 million isk. What do these numbers mean? Nothing. Phatnasm is 100 million isk, and yet has more kills and less deaths, percentage wise, than Stratios. Looking at these numbers are meaningless without more information and context behind them. Numbers Dont lie. But you are being dishonest. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > So please, do not tell me that imbalace in my head. I understand game mechanics very well. Clearly you do not. ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/29 "2020-04-13T01:56:14Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > You went on and on about MIssiles. Where I said that Gila is a missiles boat? Qoute please 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/30 "2020-04-13T01:56:38Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > Clearly you do not. Ok, super expert! ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/31 "2020-04-13T01:57:55Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > What do these numbers mean? Nothing? Ok, you are super expert! ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/32 "2020-04-13T01:58:43Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > Your lack of thought in your post was also unpleasant and offensive to me, But you are write to me, but ok, If you like think like that – you right! ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 1:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/33 "2020-04-13T01:58:48Z")
> [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Where I said that Gila is a missiles boat? Qoute please 🙂 I didnt say you said the Gila is a missile boat. But let me quote you on Missiles: > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > For PVE, you need **missiles** , other options is not relevant. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Do not learn Galente ships, Matarian and even Amarian. **Missiles for PvE** > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > For PvE missiles boats. ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 2:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/34 "2020-04-13T02:00:36Z")
> [@Shipwreck\_Jones](#): > > Dog, I said earlier that the Kiki was op. The point I was trying to make is that there is no I-Win button in Eve, and that player skill is still the biggest determining factor in fight outcomes. But, I’m pretty sure I’m wasting my breath. > > Anyway, I probably could have phrased my argument more tactfully, but I’m not trying to talk down to you. So, sorry about that. > > Alright, I’m out. Good luck. Oh… one more… ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 2:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/35 "2020-04-13T02:01:09Z")
> [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Ok, super expert! Yes, I am. Thank you. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Nothing? Ok, you are super expert! Again, thanks. I am the expert. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > But you are write to me, but ok, If you like think like that – you right! Of course I write back. I am a nice guy. Sometimes I help the less fortunate who dont have a lot of ISK. Sometimes I help the less fortunate who dont have a lot of brain cells. Im a nice guy, you see. ---
**Author:** ![Xuxe\_Xu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuxe_xu/32/464660_2.png) [@Xuxe\_Xu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuxe_Xu)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 2:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/36 "2020-04-13T02:12:32Z")
> [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > So could you please compensate my time, and Skill points… [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/a/c/aca9849dc31a94180fce7b0c36dafad2e5bfb7f0.gif "source: imgur.com")](https://imgur.com/78us42S) ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 2:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/37 "2020-04-13T02:43:07Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > Of course I write back. I am a nice guy. Sometimes I help the less fortunate who dont have a lot of ISK. Sometimes I help the less fortunate who dont have a lot of brain cells. Im a nice guy, you see. Not back, You start first 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 2:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/38 "2020-04-13T02:44:41Z")
> [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > Not back, You start first You made a public thread. Therefore, everyone wrote back to you. ---
**Author:** ![Madzuko\_Aretama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madzuko_aretama/32/424732_2.png) [@Madzuko\_Aretama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Madzuko_Aretama)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 2:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/39 "2020-04-13T02:56:42Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > You made a public thread. Therefore, everyone wrote back to you. But I’m talking about another stuff. You don’t have enough informatino about me but made some conclusions. As I can see now not only you 😕 ok. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2020, 3:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020/41 "2020-04-13T03:10:59Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > Of course I write back. I am a nice guy. Actually most of the time you’re not a nice guy and the tone of your replies are usually condescending and pretentious. Most importantly, you or anybody else posting here in these forums are not experts, none of you are experts even though quite a few of you constantly claim it. In fact all the self-claimed experts will hate hearing this but if you people were indeed experts, CCP would have presented a Capsuleer Spotlight on you a long time ago. > [@Shipwreck\_Jones](#): > > Anyway, I probably could have phrased my argument more tactfully, but I’m not trying to talk down to you. So, sorry about that. Yeah definitely should have. Reading your replies in this thread gave me the impression of being completely opposite to what you stated. Their context was demeaning and gave the impression of trying to shame the OP, starting first by referring to him as Dog. Come on man, Dog? * * * @Madzuko_Aretama, don’t bother wasting your time replying here, these forums have become very toxic, all because CCP made the mistake of not enforcing their Forum Rules a long time ago. > [@Madzuko\_Aretama](#): > > But I will call them next week 🙂 just want speak with some GM’s or somebody from sales. Cause this is a product, I pay for it 🙂 I want understand a few things. There’s a few different ways to communicate with CCP. They seem to be very active on their Facebook and Twitter pages but I doubt those will help. Could file a Support Ticket and ask for info on the correct media platform to use but that will take time for them to reply. Probably the best course of action would be contacting [communityteam@ccpgames.com](mailto:communityteam@ccpgames.com) from the verified email address connected to your EVE Online account. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/imbalance-ships-or-why-i-play-money-for-and-few-more-problems/232020.md?page=3)