# Insurgencies unfair to care bears **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 16, 2024, 10:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188 "2024-03-16T22:12:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Done25](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/done25/32/494511_2.png) [@Done25](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Done25)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2024, 3:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/22 "2024-03-17T15:35:34Z")
The fact that pirates keep repeatedly winning does indicate to me that the empire needs SOMETHING. Better Suppression bonuses. A buff to Suppression speed (again). Just, _something_ so that it’s not always an automatic pirate win. ---
**Author:** ![Yuzima](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yuzima/32/416395_2.png) [@Yuzima](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Yuzima)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2024, 3:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/23 "2024-03-17T15:59:14Z")
> [@Dchill](#): > > So i dont know how the game designers at CCP come up with this stuff ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/c/b/8/cb844439258e69a05fa8516a392cb338d416b97b.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2024, 11:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/24 "2024-03-17T23:48:46Z")
> [@Theodyval\_Kinging1](#): > > But it’s not just the one mission; it’s the waiting more than a week to do some simple missioning A bit puzzled here… Why not simply look up agents of the same type and npc corp that are at least 4-5 jumps aways from any systems that could get affected by what goes on in FW ? Or did I miss something ? Dotlan has all the agents, so it’s quite easy to do. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 12:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/25 "2024-03-18T00:38:40Z")
Went through these said systems today, full of bot fleets milking LP ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 1:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/26 "2024-03-18T01:36:47Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > The rules’ goal here is to create (more) player conflict, and Havoc delivered on this. For almost as long as I’ve been playing this game, Null Sec has been the center point for player conflict. Unfortunately over the past few years that hasn’t been happening. As such, CCP should be concentrating their efforts there instead of constantly implementing content with the intent of chasing players out of High Sec space. ---
**Author:** ![Malak\_Starfire](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/malak_starfire/32/501915_2.png) [@Malak\_Starfire](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Malak_Starfire)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 2:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/27 "2024-03-18T02:21:40Z")
Null sec is where the big fights are happening still. The larger powers have been fighting each other despite everyone calling it a blue donut. Most of the destruction is happening in Null. Faction Warfare changes have been testing grounds for a new system to implement in null, which will be coming within the next year. CCP isn’t chasing people out of Hi sec, the addition of Homefronts should be evidence enough of that. There is only a small fraction of hi sec that can even be affected by Havoc content. Trig invasions could only happen in select systems. There are HUNDREDS of other systems where players can be and still be in hi sec. ---
**Author:** ![Kanavaisto\_Askiras](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kanavaisto_askiras/32/387775_2.png) [@Kanavaisto\_Askiras](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kanavaisto_Askiras)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 12:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/28 "2024-03-18T12:33:48Z")
This whole crap has to go… Alongside with its origin incursions. Insurgencies is just copy and paste of incursions only edited by a fw component anyways. It’s neither something new nor something intersting. It can go into the trashbin without even a slight bother… ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 1:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/29 "2024-03-18T13:25:11Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > As such, CCP should be concentrating their efforts there instead of constantly implementing content with the intent of chasing players out of High Sec space. I’m not sure why highsec should be treated differently, it’s just one type of space not better or worse than others. Players are constantly being chased out of their comfort zones everywhere by various patches. The “trick” is to be open to change, temporarily or permanently. This is certainly something you may and can learn. And hey, there is nothing at stake, it’s just a game. I learned it in 10 years of EvE, and everybody can do it together with the progress of accumulated SP and experience. Example for an opportunity: Did you know that in corrupted 2-3-4-5 systems (highsec 2-4 still under highsec rules) you can hunt valuable insurgency rats which give you loot you can redeem for items worth 30-\>150-\>300M? I made a few B with that back then still “obscure” knowledge at the start of the patch (hint read the patch notes carefully). ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 2:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/30 "2024-03-18T14:05:35Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > The “trick” is to be open to change, temporarily or permanently. This is nonsense. A general statement that could apply as well to Eve shutting down, to CCP removing red safety from HS, to station seizing your assets at random, etc. > [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > Players are constantly being chased out of their comfort zones everywhere by various patches. This generalization is abusive. Patches by definition change, and player can adapt to them. Some patches add content, some remove content, some make content less interesting without forcing players out of it. The issue is the patches that FORCE players to adapt to them. For example, abyssal PVE made players able to opt in a specific PVE type. A later patch reduced the loot, but did not prevent players from doing it. However a patch that removed the usage of filaments from specific systems prevented those players from doing it. CCP could have done something like reducing the loot dropped from higher security systems, something like -0% in 0.5 and -50% in 1.0. The issue is that forcing people out with patches makes the game unreliable. This is a problem when the game requires that much investment. If you could change activities in the second, without any requirement such as isk or SP, then it would not be a problem. In the present state of the game, it’s just unacceptable. You can’t expect people to “stick to the game” when the game does not stick to itself in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 2:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/31 "2024-03-18T14:13:43Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > The issue is that forcing people out with patches makes the game unreliable. As you like to talk in extremes, yes, and as the saying is: adapt or die. What else can you do? Complain for zero effect (unless you have the backing of the vocal “celebrities”), or accept/embrace the change, your choice what makes you happier. 🙂 EDIT: BTW, looking forward to nullsec getting the FW micromanagement treatment, this will be fun one way or the other. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 2:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/32 "2024-03-18T14:27:54Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > As you like to talk in extremes, yes, and as the saying is: adapt or die. And this “saying” is stupid. It just says nothing but try to force the culpability onto people who are wronged by the devs. Which is wrong, since it’s not people’s fault if they can’t adapt, or don’t want because the cost is more than the game provides them. Promoting such a stupid saying as a rule in the game also is. To be open to _any_ change is not a “trick”. It is, to not be invested in the game. But for the same reason, people will leave. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 2:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/33 "2024-03-18T14:41:46Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > It is, to not be invested in the game. To some degree this is indeed part of the recommendation. In a bit more gentle version, have a plan B, so that a change in EvE or RL doesn’t reset you to square 0 while you are offline or can’t invest time, which happened to players in the past. Just look at abandoned structures, Pochven formation, big corp thefts, space friends leaving the game for example. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 2:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/34 "2024-03-18T14:48:16Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > In a bit more gentle version, have a plan B, Which will also be removed. So in the end you have nothing. “Adapt or die” still ? If CCP accepts to remove plan A, then they also accept to remove plan B. You can’t say it’s okay to remove A but not B - you can but they won’t listen to you. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 2:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/35 "2024-03-18T14:54:27Z")
Don’t be silly, nothing is 100%, it’s all probability, just some events are very unlikely to happen in the next couple years, like EvE shutting down, EvE universe is wiped, you lose all your ISK/PLEX/SP, etc. Stashing away some funds for rainy days and have assets in Jita 4-4 I consider a valid plan B. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 3:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/36 "2024-03-18T15:10:15Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > just some events are very unlikely to happen in the next couple years, like EvE shutting down, EvE universe is wiped, you lose all your ISK/PLEX/SP, etc. You can’t predict the future. Stop making arguments based on an skill you don’t master. > [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > Stashing away some funds for rainy days and have assets in Jita 4-4 I consider a valid plan B. CCP already made asset safety go away, and already made stations move (to pochven). Expecting anything consistent from them, besides their lack of respect, is now delusional. What’s more whatever you do with those can also be removed without a notice. Nothing of that plan is valid. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 3:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/37 "2024-03-18T15:17:25Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > You can’t predict the future. Right, the world can end tomorrow. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Nothing of that plan is valid. What should I reply here? What do you want to do about it? I hope the discussion so far can help other players to get new insights. Don’t think this will lead any further now. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 3:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/38 "2024-03-18T15:19:39Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > What do you want to do about it? Nothing. I remind you my point : “adapt or die” is a stupid argument. So is “be open to change”. Some patches are good, some are bad, discussing about them requires to not use fallacious blanket statements such as those. ---
**Author:** ![Spacetramp\_Drago](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/spacetramp_drago/32/480922_2.png) [@Spacetramp\_Drago](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Spacetramp_Drago)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 4:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/39 "2024-03-18T16:48:15Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > The issue is the patches that FORCE players to adapt to them. I don’t know anyone that is adapting to them, like me a lot just ignore it all. ---
**Author:** ![Eternus8lux8lucis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/eternus8lux8lucis/32/385152_2.png) [@Eternus8lux8lucis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Eternus8lux8lucis)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 9:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/40 "2024-03-18T21:02:18Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > The issue is the patches that FORCE players to adapt to them. Having played this game for 20 years you see a fair bit of change in the areas of space. The longer you play a game and the bigger your sandcastle is, that footprint within the ecosystem, the more likely you will run into a change that doesnt agree with your ideals, hopes, dreams and personal desires. This is true in real life too and something I think the game represents very well, not just in the interpersonal conflicts such as wars but also in the universe itself. So I think the issue isnt that it forces players to adapt, and that noone likes being forced yet like I stated above it mimics real life in this, its that YOU dont like the changes at hand and YOU cant think of a way to maximize it or gain from it. Because it affects YOUR gameplay and hurts YOU specifically. Well Id have to say welcome to the club as I have heard so many people lament about this over the 20 years of playing and being on the forums. People skilling up several years of skills JUST in time to get the nerf bat. People seeing entire industries slashed and burned by patches. People seeing their entire life blood gone in an instant. This is a constant of the system that is Eve. One you should understand and learn to accept in the fact that the longer you spend in Eve and the more you grow the greater the likelihood will be you will run into a brick wall at high speed and “change” will have finally come for you as it appears it finally has. Whining about change wont change things, not unless you can get enough people on board like the riots in Jita, or changing it through the CSM elections, or even getting a job with CCP. Another way is to find a way to game the system till CCP is forced to change something from the inside out, spreading knowledge or awareness of a broken feature or wealth faucet till it becomes necessary to change. AKA BE the change you want to see. Noone is forcing you out but yourself. You stated > Blockquote[quote=“stefnia Freir, post:30, topic:443188, username:stefnia\_Freir”] > The issue is that forcing people out with patches makes the game unreliable > [/quote] This is ironically what makes the game the same and reliable for me, seeing these changes over time and understanding them even if they directly affect me or the people I know. Its always easy to giggle and joke about others misfortunes but it seems to get personal when its your own misfortune. ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 9:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188/41 "2024-03-18T21:11:41Z")
+1 That is as level-headed and sensible a retort as I’ve seen on here. Dripping with experience and objectivity. Thanks, Eternus. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/insurgencies-unfair-to-care-bears/443188.md?page=3)