# Invasion - is NOT FUN **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [April 7, 2020, 8:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533 "2020-04-07T08:06:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2020, 4:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/263 "2020-06-01T16:31:03Z")
> [@James\_Cannon\_Fodder](#): > > You can only realistically make enough ISK ratting if you play all day. Enough ISK for what? If you aren’t doing PvP you will never lose anything except ammo, and every combat PvE activity pays more than enough to cover the cost of the ammo you spend to do it. So where is this mandatory expense they’re ratting for? The simple fact here is that the people buying PLEX are PvP players who want to skip the PvE part of the game, and the people who need to make “enough ISK ratting” are the ones who can’t afford $15/month and need to PvE to pay for omega status. ---
**Author:** ![xDeadMasterx](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xdeadmasterx/32/186259_2.png) [@xDeadMasterx](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/xDeadMasterx)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2020, 4:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/264 "2020-06-01T16:49:21Z")
Then do the basics in a different system? He could become a “refugee” and live in a different system. How hard could that be for him? Why would he limit himself to only 1 system out of thousands he could live in? ---
**Author:** ![Induce\_Deadline](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/induce_deadline/32/418955_2.png) [@Induce\_Deadline](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Induce_Deadline)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2020, 5:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/265 "2020-06-01T17:29:01Z")
> [@Syn\_Shi](#): > > Black out was great. Unfortunately many in null talk about content but ran and took their toys out of the sandbox when earning isk in null started to be risky. > Same with the invasion, as soon as the Trig Support Force saw that they would have to deal with groups who shoot back they ran for the comfort of hi-sec. > > CCP can only do so much to create content. Anymore effort on their part and you may as well stop calling it a sandbox. I disagree, null didn’t run, we were at the front of the queue the day Blackout hit ready to go hunting people… Problem is everyone else had the same idea… It’s not people “running”, it’s way more nuanced than that, players are not exclusively pve or pvp minded, they’re typically both. You need a balance that keeps both hunter and prey in space. Blackout was too skewed towards pvp, so most null players logged in their pvp accounts rather than pve… Which left nothing to hunt! Most of the pvp in game takes place between null players, you know that right? We’re the ones taking part in 500vs500 subcap fights or roaming in blingy ■■■■ for you to watch on YT. ---
**Author:** ![Vals\_Loeder](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vals_loeder/32/192416_2.png) [@Vals\_Loeder](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vals_Loeder)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2020, 6:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/266 "2020-06-01T18:33:41Z")
> [@James\_Cannon\_Fodder](#): > > You can only realistically make enough ISK ratting if you play all day What do you consider enough? ---
**Author:** ![darkestkhan\_Eriker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darkestkhan_eriker/32/390091_2.png) [@darkestkhan\_Eriker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/darkestkhan_Eriker)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2020, 11:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/267 "2020-06-01T23:30:41Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > No, they don’t know that. They are mostly just terrible at accounting and understanding opportunity cost. Or maybe more kindly, they classify the grind as “fun”, not a cost that needs to be placed in their books to figure out if they made a profit. While I can understand grind being fun at times one should still do some basic accounting - after all if you are gonna grind may as well be properly rewarded for doing instead of basically wasting time. > [@Merin\_Ryskin](#): > > Counter-point: EVE has survived for much longer than that, and had its best growth at a time when PvP threats were even harsher in highsec. Didn’t eve survive longer than WOW? > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > PvPers don’t generally head out to PvP with the sole intent of losing ships to each other Sometimes this happens… _sometimes_ > [@Merin\_Ryskin](#): > > Enough ISK for what? If you aren’t doing PvP you will never lose anything except ammo, and every combat PvE activity pays more than enough to cover the cost of the ammo you spend to do it. So where is this mandatory expense they’re ratting for? It gets even better - tag farming in hisec L4 missions can make you 200M/h in not blinged T3C… that should be pretty much more than enough for most activities. > [@Vals\_Loeder](#): > > What do you consier enough? Tag farming is ~200M/h… in hisec - only downside is losing standing with one faction (the one whose tags you choose to farm). ---
**Author:** ![Vals\_Loeder](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vals_loeder/32/192416_2.png) [@Vals\_Loeder](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vals_Loeder)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2020, 4:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/268 "2020-06-02T16:44:20Z")
> [@darkestkhan\_Eriker](#): > > > [@Vals\_Loeder](#): > > > > What do you consier enough? > > Tag farming is ~200M/h… in hisec - only downside is losing standing with one faction (the one whose tags you choose to farm). I am afraid it is not an answer to the question. EDIT: apologies … I know see you are not james cannon fodder whom I asked the question. ---
**Author:** ![Mikkir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mikkir/32/293746_2.png) [@Mikkir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mikkir)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 4:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/269 "2020-06-03T04:44:09Z")
My problem is that they removed content I was enjoying. When I was feeling lazy I would fly around and do some emerging conduits solo. Run 6 or so and call it a night. When I wanted to put the effort into multi-boxing I would do a small fleet of nestors and run a few minor conduits in perimeter systems. Now I don’t have those options available. The closest thing out there is scout invasions, but multi-boxing with jamming enemies just isn’t fun. Been thinking about using a marauder to do them instead, but that leaves me with a few accounts I should let fall out of omega because they don’t open up additional enjoyable opportunities. Might just be time to pack it up. I don’t have the time to play like I use to, and it seems like they’re trashing the game for people who don’t want to play N+1 content. ---
**Author:** ![Vals\_Loeder](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vals_loeder/32/192416_2.png) [@Vals\_Loeder](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vals_Loeder)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 7:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/270 "2020-06-03T07:02:11Z")
> [@Mikkir](#): > > The closest thing out there is scout invasions, but multi-boxing with jamming enemies just isn’t fun. Is that perhaps because it takes actual effort? ---
**Author:** ![Mikkir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mikkir/32/293746_2.png) [@Mikkir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mikkir)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 7:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/271 "2020-06-03T07:15:54Z")
> Is that perhaps because it takes actual effort? Is playing against jammers ever fun? Having to constantly relock to damage and/or spider tank is just an obnoxious annoyance. ---
**Author:** ![Vals\_Loeder](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vals_loeder/32/192416_2.png) [@Vals\_Loeder](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vals_Loeder)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 7:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/272 "2020-06-03T07:17:00Z")
> [@Mikkir](#): > > Is playing against jammers ever fun? Answering a question with a question is bad form. Let me try again. > [@Vals\_Loeder](#): > > > [@Mikkir](#): > > > > The closest thing out there is scout invasions, but multi-boxing with jamming enemies just isn’t fun. > > Is that perhaps because it takes actual effort? ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 7:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/273 "2020-06-03T07:21:13Z")
> [@Mikkir](#): > > marauder Basically, unless they let you afk, you arent interested. Another big loss to the game ---
**Author:** ![Mikkir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mikkir/32/293746_2.png) [@Mikkir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mikkir)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 8:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/274 "2020-06-03T08:08:25Z")
> [@Vals\_Loeder](#): > > > [@Mikkir](#): > > > > Is playing against jammers ever fun? > > Answering a question with a question is bad form. > > Let me try again. > > > [@Vals\_Loeder](#): > > > > > [@Mikkir](#): > > > > > > The closest thing out there is scout invasions, but multi-boxing with jamming enemies just isn’t fun. > > > > Is that perhaps because it takes actual effort? Very well then. No, it’s not because it takes effort. It’s just an annoyance to multibox against jammers because jammers are simply unfun to play against. > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > > [@Mikkir](#): > > > > marauder > > Basically, unless they let you afk, you arent interested. > > Another big loss to the game To reiterate what I said above, jammers aren’t fun to play against. Playing a marauder removes the unfun part of the game. I’m also unsure why you think marauders are afk, as that designation is usually for mining ships and cap steady local repped drone boats. Regardless if you like my opinion or not, it’s just another data point for them to look at. They removed content I was engaging with and replaced it with content I’m not engaging with, and I’m unlikely to do so because I don’t have the long stretches of time to play like I previously did. ---
**Author:** ![Vals\_Loeder](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vals_loeder/32/192416_2.png) [@Vals\_Loeder](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vals_Loeder)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 10:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/275 "2020-06-03T10:08:57Z")
> [@Mikkir](#): > > No, it’s not because it takes effort. It’s just an annoyance to multibox against jammers because jammers are simply unfun to play against. What is not fun about it? It’s quite a challenge and isn’t that why we play this game? ---
**Author:** ![Maximilian\_Wulffe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/maximilian_wulffe/32/210326_2.png) [@Maximilian\_Wulffe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Maximilian_Wulffe)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 11:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/276 "2020-06-03T11:06:18Z")
It’s a bold move Loeder, let’s see if it pays off. ---
**Author:** ![Mikkir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mikkir/32/293746_2.png) [@Mikkir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mikkir)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 2:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/277 "2020-06-03T14:42:20Z")
> [@Vals\_Loeder](#): > > > [@Mikkir](#): > > > > No, it’s not because it takes effort. It’s just an annoyance to multibox against jammers because jammers are simply unfun to play against. > > What is not fun about it? It’s quite a challenge and isn’t that why we play this game? Being disingenuous with your replies is bad form. ---
**Author:** ![Syn\_Shi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syn_shi/32/242535_2.png) [@Syn\_Shi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syn_Shi)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 8:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/278 "2020-06-03T20:30:00Z")
The only ones who think jammers are ok are the ones who show up with every ewar and a bunch of friends against one person. Those that don’t want to make an effort to actually pvp. They just want to shoot people who cannot shoot back. I don’t understand the mentality…“I’m gonna play a pvp game but remove any chance of the other person fighting back.” ---
**Author:** ![Ka\_Vin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ka_vin/32/350926_2.png) [@Ka\_Vin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ka_Vin)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 8:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/279 "2020-06-03T20:31:21Z")
I like it. It’s fun. Can I have your stuff? ---
**Author:** ![Gergoran\_Moussou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gergoran_moussou/32/381607_2.png) [@Gergoran\_Moussou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gergoran_Moussou)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2020, 8:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/280 "2020-06-03T20:40:06Z")
HTFU. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2020, 9:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/281 "2020-06-04T09:26:38Z")
> [@Syn\_Shi](#): > > The only ones who think jammers are ok are the ones who show up with every ewar and a bunch of friends against one person. Lies. Your competitors also think its ok ---
**Author:** ![Nordak\_Balrem](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nordak_balrem/32/200160_2.png) [@Nordak\_Balrem](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nordak_Balrem)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2020, 1:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533/282 "2020-06-04T13:05:49Z")
Don’t worry all of my accounts say that too. CCP is ■■■■■■■ up regularly. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533.md?page=12) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/invasion-is-not-fun/230533.md?page=14)