# Is going subscription only the best way to save EVE? **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [May 19, 2021, 9:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379 "2021-05-19T09:55:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mkikaden_tiragen/32/243913_2.png) [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mkikaden_Tiragen)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2021, 2:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/61 "2021-05-19T14:05:14Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > Just because they do some tricky record keeping to keep taxes low by claiming that PLEX isn’t revenue unless it’s used in-game, it’s still money in their bank. Uh, that’s not tricky record keeping, that standard accounting. PLEX is basically an EVE gift card - you cannot count the sale as profit until the value is redeemed, because until the value is redeemed you have a liability for goods to the holder of the gift card. ---
**Author:** ![Lenetra](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lenetra/32/271741_2.png) [@Lenetra](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lenetra)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2021, 2:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/62 "2021-05-19T14:30:45Z")
if there was something worth spending few bucks on i might support the game, but unless CQ(and the potential of station cities on foot activities) is restored, meh. easy answer:buy out and merge anarchy online(or any older-ish futuristic game) with eve. ---
**Author:** ![Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wombat_4_combat/32/273063_2.png) [@Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wombat_4_Combat)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2021, 2:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/63 "2021-05-19T14:56:17Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > > [@Zoiie](#): > > > > Alpha helps retain customers, it also helps bring in new customers. > > Of all the FTP versions of games atm, Alpha is one of the weakest and most limited. Do you not think CCP might retain more with either a more expansive Alpha programme, or a cheaper more generous sub?? Perhaps an extra shift at mcdonalds can get you over the hump for the monthly omega sub? ---
**Author:** ![Zoiie](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zoiie/32/292363_2.png) [@Zoiie](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zoiie)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2021, 2:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/64 "2021-05-19T14:57:22Z")
Get PLEX vouchers via an agent/store we can buy with crypto. I bet they would get more sales. Let Bitrefill sell them, let them be a reseller/agent for PLEX vouchers we can redeem. It’s been done before for GTC’s. Until then, I won’t be using a single CC payment for CCP, that means lost sales. Up to them, my money my rules. They can sell me PLEX voucher codes, or they can do without money. I already made my decision. I will wait. Given that I am on Linux with ZERO official support, it’s not big loss to me. So that means I wait for Eve Anywhere to release for all, and PLEX vouchers to buy with crypto. You can twiddle yoru thumbs, I will twiddle mine too, I hold the money they want. They either want my money or they do not. ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2021, 7:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/65 "2021-05-19T19:57:51Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > Just because they do some tricky record keeping to keep taxes low by claiming that PLEX isn’t revenue unless it’s used in-game, it’s still money in their bank. It’s a liability on the balance sheet, just like coupons, vouchers, gift cards, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 7:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/66 "2021-05-20T07:53:21Z")
I dont have a problem with a sub? I think thats tge OP you are meaning to reply to ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 10:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/67 "2021-05-20T10:26:14Z")
> [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > > > Just because they do some tricky record keeping to keep taxes low by claiming that PLEX isn’t revenue unless it’s used in-game, it’s still money in their bank. > > Uh, that’s not tricky record keeping, that standard accounting. PLEX is basically an EVE gift card - you cannot count the sale as profit until the value is redeemed, because until the value is redeemed you have a liability for goods to the holder of the gift card. BS, regardless if that PLEX is used or not, it was bought with real money which is sitting in their bank. Their tricky book-keeping cuts off tax on money made from unused PLEX which they can then use to invest into other stuff. Also CCP has no liability to the buyer of PLEX, there is no ‘Refund’ if the PLEX isn’t used. If CCP were to shut down the servers tomorrow, all the PLEX in-game wouldn’t be redeemed but CCP would still have x amount of money in their bank from it. ---
**Author:** ![Aesir\_Valtari](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aesir_valtari/32/488282_2.png) [@Aesir\_Valtari](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aesir_Valtari)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 10:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/68 "2021-05-20T10:33:57Z")
> [@Argel\_OTF2](#): > > Is going subscription only the best way to save EVE? In my opinion, this game cannot return to a paid subscription model for three simple reasons: 1. players playing as alpha and keeping it that way for very specific reasons (lack of funds to buy Omega, occasional play that doesn’t require the benefits of Omega, or a conscious user choice not to financially support CCP for their mistakes and arrogance), if they lost access to the game and the only way to continue access would be to pay an arguably exorbitant price every month - they will simply abandon EVE. And it wouldn’t be 100 or 1000 accounts, oh no. It would probably be a large, noticeable drop in population, and such an event would by no means improve the already poor situation with player exodus and player numbers (an even more desolate New Eden? that won’t serve anyone). 2. by demanding money for access to the game, CCP would be obliged to provide a good quality of gameplay - which means, among other things, appointing QA with experienced professionals who will really do a good job of testing new features and catching bugs before a new content hits the live server. Implementation of standards in communication between players and game developers, because what is currently there doesn’t meet these standards, unfortunately. Paying players have the right to be treated seriously, so a blunder like the last one with releasing an update about nullification and WCS on Tranquility after 3 days of testing on Singularity without informing about the exact date of implementation of this important change on Tranquility not only should not happen at all, but in the situation of a paid subscription it would be immediately withdrawn from TQ, in addition CCP would formally apologize to their customers and give compensation for such a failure. I don’t think CCP is mentally ready to change their approach to players to full professionalism from the current disarray and arrogance they are very comfortable in. 3. Any new player, before they would pay money for a subscription, would first probably discern what they would be paying for in the first place - i.e. read reviews of EVE online. He’ll look on Reddit, maybe read reviews on Steam or gaming-related websites … then CCP should be known as a publisher that meets the standards of professionalism, has good communication with its customers, provides diverse and balanced gameplay, and finally enjoys a good reputation and respect. Especially after an entity that has been in the industry for 18 years. The problem is that CCP has been losing respect and esteem among its players for quite a few years now, which is clearly evident from reading Reddit or this forum. I’ll just say this: if I was interested in creating an EVE account today and spent an hour reading Reddit or pinned topics-discussions on the EVE forum, I would give up the idea and look for another game. The disappointment and anger at CCP is palpable everywhere, the negative feedback is overwhelmingly numerous and pervasive. So I doubt that EVE will return to a paid subscription model. To demand cash for access to a game, you first have to offer something to convince a potential customer to pay for access. There are currently too many problems and controversies surrounding the publisher’s decision for such a dramatic change to the game’s access model to have any chance of success. ---
**Author:** ![Rekindle](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rekindle/32/382332_2.png) [@Rekindle](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rekindle)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 10:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/69 "2021-05-20T10:37:23Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Im just sick of people saying “CCP IS MAKING ME BUY PLEX” and Im like, no, you are letting them think this strategy is a good one if you do. I think what they are saying is the game is being designed to encourage buying plex more than it used to. In the old people would buy plex to cut some corners. Now people are beginning to personally feel the message that seems to be delivered to them that buying plex is the new mode of operation. While you could say just dont buy plex – thats not really the point here. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 12:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/70 "2021-05-20T12:01:11Z")
> [@Rekindle](#): > > you could say just dont buy plex – thats not really the point here. Yes it is. If you dont like the situation, dont do what they want. Seems easy enough ---
**Author:** ![Argel\_OTF2](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/argel_otf2/32/388676_2.png) [@Argel\_OTF2](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Argel_OTF2)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 12:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/71 "2021-05-20T12:22:36Z")
> [@Aesir\_Valtari](#): > > Paying players have the right to be treated seriously, so a blunder like the last one with releasing an update about nullification and WCS on Tranquility after 3 days of testing on Singularity without informing about the exact date of implementation of this important change on Tranquility not only should not happen at all, but in the situation of a paid subscription it would be immediately withdrawn from TQ, in addition CCP would formally apologize to their customers and give compensation for such a failure. I don’t think CCP is mentally ready to change their approach to players to full professionalism from the current disarray and arrogance they are very comfortable in. But is that just where we are indefinitely? Because I agree with your general assessment. 100%, but it’s depressing to think that it simply can’t get better because they can’t be trusted. The more I think about it, the more I think that’s likely true - even if they got subs, would they still continue down this path that is clearly heading slowly, inexorably towards the end of the game? Yeah, probably. The culture is broken and the null/stab dumping onto live with a different set of values to what had been on singularity is just the latest in a complete endemic of failure. So what happens now? ---
**Author:** ![Adm\_Malkaviano](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adm_malkaviano/32/496610_2.png) [@Adm\_Malkaviano](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adm_Malkaviano)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 12:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/72 "2021-05-20T12:38:56Z")
Disclaimer: BY NO MEANS I LIKED THE NULLIFICATION STUFF, AND I DON’T EVEN DO INTERCEPTORS. > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Because they havent wrecked enough to chase me away and the current “scarcity” phase is making me around 1b min per day. After a fast reading, this is the only good stuff around here. **Adapt or gtfo** , nobody is holding anybody in here. **If you are playing EVE under duress, please send me a mail in game and I’ll help you!** Otherwise, I could really avoid all the BS while drinking my coffee trying to get some entertainment. Now let’s talk business, my dear poster your assumption is flawed by a very simple FACT: CCP introduced alpha to avoid EVE death, reverting to old state will only make the game worse again. I mean, you got the right cause, but you forgot all the stuff that revolves around it: - RMT; - BOTTING; - AKF GAMEPLAY; - POWERPLAY DOUCHBAGERY; (should I quote stuff I invented in my head? hum) - SCRIPTING; - MULTIBOXING; I mean, this is almost like themed park game forums, I expect much more from all of you. Got salt? Sent it my way. My mailbox needs action baby! Fly safe o7 ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 12:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/73 "2021-05-20T12:41:12Z")
This guy knows the score. Cheers, bud 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Argel\_OTF2](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/argel_otf2/32/388676_2.png) [@Argel\_OTF2](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Argel_OTF2)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 1:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/74 "2021-05-20T13:03:20Z")
It’s easy to just bury your head in the sand and say that we just have to accept the situation. It’s even tempting, especially if you don’t care about any of the recent changes. But a lot of people do. Why should they be silent? Nothing changes without people being somewhat unified in their opposition. I could well say that if you don’t want to read gripes about CCP, then this forum isn’t for you, and certainly threads like this you should avoid. **If you are being forced to read this thread under duress, please message me in game and I will be happy to help**. The traditional ‘if you don’t like it leave’ answer is just a lazy trope. The fractures between CCP and the playerbase are widening by the month and look like getting worse in future, not better. The same people who say they’re above complaining seem to take the most gratification from telling other people to stop complaining, even when there are reasonable grounds. ---
**Author:** ![Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mkikaden_tiragen/32/243913_2.png) [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mkikaden_Tiragen)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2021, 1:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/75 "2021-05-20T13:43:05Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > BS, regardless if that PLEX is used or not, it was bought with real money which is sitting in their bank. Their tricky book-keeping cuts off tax on money made from unused PLEX which they can then use to invest into other stuff. And it is a liability on their books until redeemed. Literally every company that issues gift cards/certificates/etc that can be redeemed for value, and is subject to regulatory filings for accounting, follows the same rules for declaring income in relation to sales of service via delayed redemption methods. > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > Also CCP has no liability to the buyer of PLEX, there is no ‘Refund’ if the PLEX isn’t used I never said they hd to assign it a refundable value - neither do the majority of gift cards. But the holder of the PLEX has a claim on CCP for services, including the option to redeem it for subscription time. The fact that closing would terminate that liability doesn’t mean that until CCP closes and this ends their contracts with everyone, they don’t have outstanding contracts for service with every PLEX holder. ---
**Author:** ![Herzog\_Wolfhammer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/herzog_wolfhammer/32/452132_2.png) [@Herzog\_Wolfhammer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Herzog_Wolfhammer)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2021, 3:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/76 "2021-05-21T03:05:07Z")
Subscription only was better. People can gank on alphas, and gank omegas. Lots of people won’t sub to be a chump like that. ---
**Author:** ![Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wombat_4_combat/32/273063_2.png) [@Wombat\_4\_Combat](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wombat_4_Combat)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2021, 3:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/77 "2021-05-21T03:32:42Z")
sub price raise to 24.95 would help alot ---
**Author:** ![Paris](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/paris/32/262200_2.png) [@Paris](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Paris)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2021, 5:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/78 "2021-05-21T05:57:09Z")
> [@Herzog\_Wolfhammer](#): > > Subscription only was better. > People can gank on alphas, and gank omegas. Lots of people won’t sub to be a chump like that. As far as I remember, eve has almost never been “Subscription only”. Back in 2008 you could buy 60 days eve times codes and sell them. They even existed before that. ---
**Author:** ![zazzmatazz\_Xu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zazzmatazz_xu/32/451037_2.png) [@zazzmatazz\_Xu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zazzmatazz_Xu)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2021, 6:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/79 "2021-05-21T06:50:42Z")
> [@Argel\_OTF2](#): > > nerfing everything constantly This is the player side problem, many people have put suggestions in that sounded good but instead of debate about it players just hated on everything that seemed like a convenience or a slight buff. Those same players consistently kept asking for nerfs to everything and I’d say they get them often. ---
**Author:** ![Scarlet\_Starfire](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scarlet_starfire/32/244125_2.png) [@Scarlet\_Starfire](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scarlet_Starfire)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2021, 8:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379/80 "2021-05-21T08:27:00Z")
> [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > > > BS, regardless if that PLEX is used or not, it was bought with real money which is sitting in their bank. Their tricky book-keeping cuts off tax on money made from unused PLEX which they can then use to invest into other stuff. > > And it is a liability on their books until redeemed. Literally every company that issues gift cards/certificates/etc that can be redeemed for value, and is subject to regulatory filings for accounting, follows the same rules for declaring income in relation to sales of service via delayed redemption methods. > > > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > > > Also CCP has no liability to the buyer of PLEX, there is no ‘Refund’ if the PLEX isn’t used > > I never said they hd to assign it a refundable value - neither do the majority of gift cards. But the holder of the PLEX has a claim on CCP for services, including the option to redeem it for subscription time. The fact that closing would terminate that liability doesn’t mean that until CCP closes and this ends their contracts with everyone, they don’t have outstanding contracts for service with every PLEX holder. I’m not so sure they are the same. Gift cards are a liability as when you redeem them you are reducing the company’s assets. PLEX, I don’t really see those as a liability as Pixels don’t have any value and nor does a subscription. In the case of a subscription no company assets are being used. Also as they’ve already been paid for more than the cost of a subscription they’re not losing anything. So if they do treat them as liabilities it does sound more like creative accounting. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379.md?page=3) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-going-subscription-only-the-best-way-to-save-eve/312379.md?page=5)