# Is Hisec ganking good for the game? **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [September 9, 2021, 1:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997 "2021-09-09T01:51:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 35
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/711 "2021-09-30T15:08:02Z")
Do you understand the concept of examples? ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/712 "2021-09-30T15:08:23Z")
You have to give proper examples ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/713 "2021-09-30T15:09:20Z")
My bad, this example was too hard for some people. Let me try again: > [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > You know what would make flying freighters enjoyable? A **10** second align time. > > Would it be good for the game? No. > > Enjoyable != good game design ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/714 "2021-09-30T15:10:17Z")
I think that would improve the game. But that is just a difference of opinion between us, nothing to get uptight about. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/715 "2021-09-30T15:10:31Z")
Well I strongly disagree. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/716 "2021-09-30T15:12:45Z")
I can see that, but moving stuff with my Bowheads is so much more fun and better as in more options as compared to my freighters. And fun is something to bear in mind especially if it is currently slow, boring and tedious and makes you an easy kill. ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/717 "2021-09-30T15:12:47Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > So sarcastic No, I was being quite literal. I do not believe anything I say will change your mind which is – you yourself admit – based on your experiences and observations. The fact that you keep projecting my replies as “insulting” and “sarcastic” is an additional cue that I should bow out of this before you start flagging my posts. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/718 "2021-09-30T15:14:48Z")
So many people make these little digs like this, it is rather pathetic, is it such a major issue for you that I explained my observations and experience and suggested that you are wrong, I could be wrong, but when people are not doing this I suggest that I am very likely to be right, but if I am wrong and this happens then I will hold my hand up to it… And no I do not misuse the flag system, that is the behaviour of the people who make little digs and then get upset when it does not work in my forum experience that is. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/719 "2021-09-30T15:16:29Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > I can see that, but moving stuff with my Bowheads is so much more fun and better as in more options as compared to my freighters. Well of course it’s more fun to fly a freighter that aligns as quick as a deep space transport rather than a capital sized ship. That doesn’t make it good game design. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/720 "2021-09-30T15:16:57Z")
You do know that fitting the MWD reduces tank? ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/721 "2021-09-30T15:17:30Z")
Barely, are you not hull tanking it? ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/722 "2021-09-30T15:19:52Z")
I am, but am also fitting a shield tank too from memory. The important thing is that having decent resists help if you have a logistics fleet on you. I think I showed you my fit a while back. Your fit had a higher EHP, but I liked having the ability to have Eskati rep me effectively. ---
**Author:** ![Tarsas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tarsas/32/289693_2.png) [@Tarsas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tarsas)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/723 "2021-09-30T15:46:12Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > > [@Rroff](#): > > > > Aside from people being lazy one of the problems there is you often get a small number or just 1 person who sets themselves up in the role - usually someone who is fairly high up/founding member and it kind of becomes their turf so to speak - they often end up getting resentful that other people don’t pull their weight while the other people often find it difficult to get involved. > > I agree to both comments, for nullsec the most important being the JF and alt to do the cyno’s. > > > [@Rroff](#): > > > > People talk about escorts but in high-sec that is largely useless unless you are at war, etc. with the gankers, it is a drop in the ocean vs a swarm of destroyers and useless against stuff like Tornados. > > This is the issue, it has been improved a little by the ending of unlimited bumping, so winning the DPS vs tank race may enable you to get away but it is rather trivial to re-set the bump timer with a suicide Ibis for example. > > > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > > > Break cargo into loads for ships. > > You cannot do that with courier contracts. > > > [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > > > There’s no isk in Highseck hauling, for two reasons: > > > > 1. other players don’t value it, and don’t care > > 2. lots of people do it for trivial amounts of isk > > > > This is pure market economics. > > You missed a third reason, people can do it for themselves if the cost is too high. But I am glad you agreed with me for once. > > > [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > > > Funny how people keep offering solutions/tactics and people’s excuse for not using them is “CCP caters to gankers”. Or maybe, just maybe by not using said tactics, you are catering to the gankers? > > People should make it more difficult for gankers within the game, still it is not a trivial thing to organise, whereas a ganker can log on all his accounts and get to it, not so much for the escorts. Excessive multi-boxing will always be an issue. > > > [@Tarsas](#): > > > > I agree; just pay attention, I dodged many camps just by paying attention. > > > > Otherwise, PoP. > > However as I was focussing on solo hisec haulers as the issue more than anything else it is not quite as easy as that, at least for them. I must agree, cloaky ships can take it for granted. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 3:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/724 "2021-09-30T15:50:04Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > I am, but am also fitting a shield tank too from memory. The important thing is that having decent resists help if you have a logistics fleet on you. I think I showed you my fit a while back. Your fit had a higher EHP, but I liked having the ability to have Eskati rep me effectively. If you have an escort fleet, wouldn’t their ships be significantly more effective in dps or ewar ships rather than logi? EHP of a freighter is huge and the amount one logi ship can repair counters only part of one catalyst. A griffin can counter multiple catalysts at the same time. A dps ship that takes out a few catalysts also accomplishes more than your logistics ship. So if you’re bringing an escort fleet, I wouldn’t let them fly logistics. So extra shield resists for more effective remote repairs is not really relevant, unless it directly adds a singificant EHP which it doesn’t when you’re adding shield resists on a hull tanked ship. Also, when did the discussion move on from the **solo freighter** that requires to more tools to a **freighter with escort fleet**? (Not that I mind, but the discussion previously was specifically about solo freighters if I recall.) ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 4:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/725 "2021-09-30T16:20:22Z")
Oh dear, I am going to come across badly again, as if I am some sort of know it all. For a bulkhead fitted freighter logi is not great, so if one is aware of a fleet of AG Ospreys hanging around as I was, moving through with a ship with decent shield resists is a damn good thing because the shield is so much more efficient when being repped by shield reppers. You should sit back and do the maths, it is interesting, because it is a major impact in the DPS/rep race. There are some armour resistance modules that can be fit to freighters that do this for armour fits though you always end up with one hole. And makes an armour repping fleet so much better. Bluntly hull tanks are rubbish because hull repping is unbonused…, this is a major issue. We found that repping a freighter with bulkheads was not that effective, and you are thinking about that. I think my Bowhead had shield rigs too, yours had bulkhead rigs. The issue about DPS is that you do not take out multiple Catalysts often you take out one per escort and not that effective if multi boxing, it also manages to get most of its DPS on the freighter sadly. Ewar works well and some AG are using burst jammers but just putting a couple of sensor boosters on the Catalysts really reduces the effectiveness. Ended up being a side conversation on bowhead fits as your one was focussed on hull from memory. I did like your fit, but as I could get reps for my Bowhead. ---
**Author:** ![Kestrix](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kestrix/32/420684_2.png) [@Kestrix](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kestrix)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 4:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/726 "2021-09-30T16:27:40Z")
# [Is Hisec ganking good for the game?](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997) Yes and no. To some it’s a challenge to be overcome and to others it’s a barrier they won’t or can’t tackle. To me ganking is part of the game thats not going to go away and I believe I have through the school of hard knocks learnt to cope with the risks. Learn and adapt. To end my post I have this to say. If ganking went away another aspect of EVE would become boring and routine. I don’t like the gankers, I don’t like losing expensive ships and cargos but it keeps me awake and active and eve feeling fresh and alive. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 5:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/727 "2021-09-30T17:03:53Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > We found that repping a freighter with bulkheads was not that effective, and you are thinking about that. I think my Bowhead had shield rigs too, yours had bulkhead rigs. I don’t recall your fit, did you use shield resist rigs or shield extention rigs? Either way, a quick Pyfa shows that a hull tanked bowhead has about 40% more EHP than a shield tanked bowhead (~700k vs ~500k). At 60% bowhead resists and a CONCORD response of 19 seconds, you would need 461 Scimitars repping at 257 HP/s for 19 seconds to make up that difference. Even if my hull tanked bowhead has slightly lower resists, which makes the remote repairs a bit less effective, I’m not sure if you can bring enough logi to make up the difference. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 5:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/728 "2021-09-30T17:50:02Z")
Shield extension rigs. You need to think about the resistance based value of that 257 HP/s based on increased resistance against incoming damage. Also hull remote reppers are unbonused. The objective is to negate the incoming DPS which is far better. I don’t have access to the numbers as I am not able to do the maths as I am not Omega but I will do them when I re-sub, I will send you a mail ingame when I do. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 5:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/729 "2021-09-30T17:54:18Z")
You’re allowed to use shield repairs on a hull tanked bowhead. And remote shield repairs on a hull tanked bowhead are just as effective as on a shield extention rig bowhead. The only risk you have is that the shield repairs ‘overheal’ or that you bleed into armour/hull in between repairs and hits, but at 70k EHP shield buffer on a hull tanked bowhead I don’t think that’s a big issue. For maths you can use Pyfa. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 5:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/730 "2021-09-30T17:55:33Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > You’re allowed to use shield repairs on a hull tanked bowhead. Of course but without the higher resists that shield rep is worth less than it should be. > [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > And remote shield repairs on a hull tanked bowhead are just as effective as on a shield extention rig bowhead. No it is not, definitely not. Because it blows through the base level shield a lot faster than the resistance level shield. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997.md?page=34) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997.md?page=36)