# Is Hisec ganking good for the game? **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [September 9, 2021, 1:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997 "2021-09-09T01:51:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 76
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 8:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1534 "2021-10-08T08:44:43Z")
What I’m trying to achieve here, is discover if there is any point at which you will acknowledge a possibility, that not playing a game for 6 years might undermine your understanding of the game. What do you think? Are you possibly just not that knowledgeable about EVE Online? ---
**Author:** ![Rroff](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rroff/32/509119_2.png) [@Rroff](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rroff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 8:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1535 "2021-10-08T08:47:00Z")
I also played the game for ~6 years - to imply I’m clueless about the game is just silly. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 8:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1536 "2021-10-08T08:51:23Z")
That’s great. Can you acknowledge that your lack of current experience perhaps means that you no longer understand the game as it is played today? ---
**Author:** ![Rroff](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rroff/32/509119_2.png) [@Rroff](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rroff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 8:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1537 "2021-10-08T08:58:11Z")
There are areas that my experience of how it is now is limited such as the new Upwell structures, but not so much has changed which would put it outside of my knowledge. Even much of the rebalancing of null and stuff like scarcity I can understand the impact it has on the game. That is beside the point though - as I mentioned what made me post in this thread was interacting with people who have played and quit the game recently and their reasoning. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 8:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1538 "2021-10-08T08:58:45Z")
> [@Rroff](#): > > not so much has changed which would put it outside of my knowledge That’s very impressive, but how do you know? If you don’t play the game, how would you actually know what has changed? Are you psychic? ---
**Author:** ![Rroff](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rroff/32/509119_2.png) [@Rroff](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rroff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1539 "2021-10-08T09:02:44Z")
Eve hasn’t changed fundamentally as a game. There have been new ships and rebalances, new opportunities such as the Abyssal stuff but very little introduced which truly shakes things up - I still frequently watch streamers like BjornBee play. ---
**Author:** ![Etch\_Masuka](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/etch_masuka/32/468743_2.png) [@Etch\_Masuka](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Etch_Masuka)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:04am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1540 "2021-10-08T09:04:27Z")
You know the points you are trying to make would be so much more effective if you didn’t constantly use the crutch of “faceless alts”. Its like all the nutters running around dead sheep screaming “it was the chupacabra” when you know…it was just a wolf. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:04am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1541 "2021-10-08T09:04:28Z")
> [@Rroff](#): > > Eve hasn’t changed fundamentally Ah, but how would you know? If you don’t play the game, you can’t possible know - you might have faith, but you lack personal experience or knowledge. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:04am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1542 "2021-10-08T09:04:31Z")
> [@Rroff](#): > > I was referring to the use of data driven analysis. Yes I know, but what strikes me as unusual is you don’t seem to be an irrational person, yet you’ve decided that your anecdotal experience (which is based on datapoints in the form of posts) is valid, but CCP’s much broader analysis, including of ganking (not just the NPE) is not valid. That isn’t a rational decision, which suggests that the underlying reason to want change is value based, and the feedback of others isn’t really all that important. In which case, like thread after thread in the forum, it will ultimately be “nerf ganking”, even if you say it isn’t. The way to actually know would be to propose (even to yourself) what a “shake up” of ganking would involve and then predict what the effects would be. There’s only 3 options: 1. no change - in which case it’s change just for variety 2. less ganking - in which case it’s just a nerf 3. more ganking - but I’ve never seen someone raise issues about ganking and propose increasing it. ---
**Author:** ![Rroff](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rroff/32/509119_2.png) [@Rroff](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rroff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1543 "2021-10-08T09:05:31Z")
I started using it in quotations as it was quicker than fully explaining what I meant each time. ---
**Author:** ![Etch\_Masuka](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/etch_masuka/32/468743_2.png) [@Etch\_Masuka](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Etch_Masuka)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1544 "2021-10-08T09:08:57Z")
using something you cant cant prove exists to the degree you are asserting it does, undermines the valid points you do raise. There is no empirical evidence that Eve is plagued by faceless alts. ---
**Author:** ![Rroff](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rroff/32/509119_2.png) [@Rroff](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rroff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1545 "2021-10-08T09:10:05Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > Yes I know, but what strikes me as unusual is you don’t seem to be an irrational person, yet you’ve decided that your anecdotal experience (which is based on datapoints in the form of posts) is valid, but CCP’s much broader analysis, including of ganking (not just the NPE) is not valid. There are two aspects to that - interpretation of data - especially discriminating what it is actually telling you - I often see developers approach it with an idea of what they want the data to tell them. But ultimately for many years I’ve seen then talk about the same things when it comes to the NPE and retention yet it never leads to the result they are talking about which makes me think they are looking at the data wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Rroff](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rroff/32/509119_2.png) [@Rroff](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rroff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:13am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1546 "2021-10-08T09:13:37Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > he way to actually know would be to propose (even to yourself) what a “shake up” of ganking would involve and then predict what the effects would be. There’s only 3 options: What I’ve been talking about isn’t about more or less ganking, but the persistence of cause and effect after a player gets ganked - the natural reaction for most is to want to get revenge and it is often where that path takes them which decides if someone quits or becomes more involved in the game because they got ganked. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:16am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1547 "2021-10-08T09:16:10Z")
> [@Rroff](#): > > that path takes them which decides if someone quits Is this just theorycrafting, based on assumptions about a game you don’t play, or do you have any actual evidence to support your claims? ---
**Author:** ![Rroff](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rroff/32/509119_2.png) [@Rroff](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rroff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1548 "2021-10-08T09:23:03Z")
If there wasn’t something to it I doubt people would be getting so upset about the suggestion of it… ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:24am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1549 "2021-10-08T09:24:19Z")
So you feel your arguments must be correct, based on the fact that people disagree with you? Is that rational? ---
**Author:** ![Xucca](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xucca/32/373499_2.png) [@Xucca](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xucca)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1550 "2021-10-08T09:30:47Z")
Being ganked was a recurrent complain I heard from newbies. I think I did not say it was culprit as major reason for leaving the game. The other complain was abuse from “Newbie Friendly” Corporations… a thing I implied that was part of what I aligned to --back then–. On the other hand, I’m curious about what others say regarding CCP’s findings as reasons for newbies leaving the game. I believe that retention, if a directive, should also consider tasks at hand like the influx of multiple experienced toons disguised as new. I rekon I never pondered the difference of criteria about what-makes-a-newbie. I imply --or try to-- that there is new players ( never touched EVE ) and the rest ( alts, troll toons, ganker alts… but most important, abusive/exploit players that have taken advantage of EVE’s “welcoming” features for newborn ), which I consider weigh more as reasons to abandon. A poll can go just as far. You can arrange a series of questions but it can still mislead the facts as those questions are usually conductive. Hisec Ganking is a necessary evil. It’s good for the game. I’ll be thinking about your elaboration regarding the naive 1-2mo old. > [@Etch\_Masuka](#): > > the perceived problem with new players is probably related to players who have been around 1 or 2 months. These players have been going about their business without a care For now, I guess it’s too long ago for me to recall my feelings about scenarios on which I blamed game mechanics so far to consider leaving. In fact, I don’t think it ever happened. But that’s just me. What I can tell you for certain is that I see peeps compelled to leave when they “failed” EVE under the assumption that a newborn his age is as inexperienced. When they feel left behind. --like in WOWrcrft, you see the newbie arenas plagued with peeps vomiting frustration on true newborns–. I guess a question summarizing such concept must be hard to put in a short poll. But I also recognize that I have no clue where CCP gets those conclusions from and simply assume it’s some poll I might have discarded as well. ---
**Author:** ![Rroff](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rroff/32/509119_2.png) [@Rroff](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rroff)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1551 "2021-10-08T09:31:10Z")
If I was wrong why would people get upset enough to post \*\*\*\* post after childish \*\*\*\* post in response? you’d have nothing to worry about and it would make no difference to the game. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1552 "2021-10-08T09:33:37Z")
So you are doubling down on the theory that you can gauge the correctness of an argument, based on whether people disagree with it? ---
**Author:** ![Etch\_Masuka](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/etch_masuka/32/468743_2.png) [@Etch\_Masuka](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Etch_Masuka)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2021, 9:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997/1553 "2021-10-08T09:34:10Z")
> [@Rroff](#): > > If I was wrong why would people get upset enough to post \*\*\*\* post after childish \*\*\*\* post in response? How about to point out you are wrong and stop the spread of disinformation regarding ganking in the game. Just a thought. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997.md?page=75) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-hisec-ganking-good-for-the-game/326997.md?page=77)