# Is Nullsec too large? Is it time we started to trim the game? **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [August 20, 2018, 2:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369 "2018-08-20T14:01:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Fluffy\_Moe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fluffy_moe/32/11132_2.png) [@Fluffy\_Moe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fluffy_Moe)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 6:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/21 "2018-08-20T18:40:45Z")
> [@Caleb\_Seremshur](#): > > I was talking a bit with some people today about the size of nullsec and it occurred to me that maybe Nullsec at this stage of the games lifespan is too large for the population within it. > > Astute members of the community will remember that years ago there was debate among the devs and CSM to condense players in to less systems by doubling anomalies and other pve activities within sov null so that players in an alliance had more face to face interaction with each other instead of being spread out. Well this was a fine idea and made its way in to the current game however a problem has emerged that by condensing activity it now increases the amount of empty space in the game. Empty space that for years now has gone unused due to factors like poor location, poor connectivity to other systems, too much connectivity and low value of native resources and/or too similar to other systems better situated. > > Years ago I said I wanted to have a wholistic view of EVE, that necessitated living in highsec (where I did wars), lowsec (3 years of FW) and nullsec (several years split between sovnull and npc null). I have also spent a year within WH primarily living solo in a c3 and using a YURT as my base of operations. I think by now I might have seen enough to have a qualified opinion on the universe and I genuinely believe EVE is too large for the quite meager population it has, that adding more space via triglavian sites was unnecessary and that nullsec has a lot of redundant/obsolete systems that Just Don’t Need To Exist Anymore. > > That’s my 2c, give me your thoughts and opinions. Personally, before making changes such as removing or changing NS regions entirely, I would like the space to simply become somewhat dynamic when it comes to rats and resources. It makes perfect sense, that if you keep exterminating rats for example in a ceirtain system or region, they would start thinning out and eventually relocate elsewhere. Likewise with mining, explo sites, everything. They should remain in the region as long as it makes sense for them lore wise and not encroach on regions that they shouldn’t, but should relocate. Even mission targets, they can stay in general region but could jump over by a couple systems this way or that way. This would lead to a lot more overall dynamic gameplay. Then once it gets to the point where even this fails, thats when NS could shrink a bit. And I think it could do so via NPC NS becoming LS, some LS becoming HS. Some unoccupied systems meant for SOV becoming NPC Null. But, like I said, I do not think we are at the stage of shrinking NS just yet, but we definetly are past due for dynamic space instead of the static we have now. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 8:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/22 "2018-08-20T20:37:16Z")
I don’t think so, -1. I think that trying to level the population makes no sense because ns has to be somewhat lower population to work and to provide the gaming it provides. If anything I would go beyond that with a new outer ring of systems that don’t even have gates, everything would have to be built out by corps. ---
**Author:** ![Zachri](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zachri/32/69948_2.png) [@Zachri](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zachri)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 9:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/23 "2018-08-20T21:23:43Z")
> [@zluq\_zabaa](#): > > It is known because we have pre-installed Stargates and the “luck” of temporary Wormholes that make all systems known, because travel from A to B is not a problem. We don’t currently have exploration as in finding new solar systems or anything of the likes. > > Then again, even if we found them, I wonder if they’d just be like any other solar systems in EVE: one sun, a bunch of planets and “asteroid belts” aka a bunch of stones orbiting a planet. No dangers from the environment, the only unpredictable thing are other players (to a certain extent) and the servers. > > I kind of wish all Stargates would suddenly disappear, Wormholes would be much more rare and everyone who wants to move around has to build their own Stargate. It’s actually much more simple than that. Connectivity and current static nature of it really isn’t a problem, nor is it an actually big variable. I’m pretty sure that CCP has figured that one out, considering they moved away from the whole player built gates concept transforming that into just an iteration of jump bridges based on Upwell structures in an attempt to make those function as conflict generators. Sure, there’s that other grand plan, but it does not change the foundation elements. We know the regions. We know the belts. We know the distances. We know the objects in space. We know the moons. We know the planets. We know the remnants of old stuff. We know the ratios and timers of anomalies. We know everything. There isn’t a single surprise. In truth, there isn’t a single incentive to even contemplate to go looking for something new. One might argue that w-space interacting with proper (!) space can be seen as something that shakes things up. But does it really? I’d argue it doesn’t. There’s vested routines now of scanning by default and rolling every hole people can find while tracking everything found in the process. It is conservative behaviour, people shun away from the interaction. They may claim otherwise, but it is conservative behaviour. Sure, stuff happens, but it’s hardly cataclysmic or a real trend. Sure, it’s part of strategems en considerations for such, but so is every type of connection anywhere. It’s been years since CCP added regions, and one might very well argue that this wasn’t an ideal approach. Ever since CCP has been introducing mechanisms to make space bigger from the inside out (see The Doctor reference hurray). Think of this in terms of economic behaviour, aka feeding. More room per system for people and their alts to make ISK concurrently. ---
**Author:** ![Geo\_Eclipse\_Oksaras](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/geo_eclipse_oksaras/32/500781_2.png) [@Geo\_Eclipse\_Oksaras](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 9:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/24 "2018-08-20T21:35:59Z")
Why not just do like Thanos and" snap" ---
**Author:** ![DrysonBennington](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/drysonbennington/32/501369_2.png) [@DrysonBennington](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DrysonBennington)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 9:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/25 "2018-08-20T21:41:23Z")
> [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > Seriously, has no one payd any attention that those things don’t work. Changing something like this will have absolutely unexpected effects. That’s the whole premise behind the Butterfly Effect which will throw things into chaos and generate swimming pools full of tear content. ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 10:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/26 "2018-08-20T22:00:08Z")
We should probably remove Provi. ---
**Author:** ![Cletus\_Graeme](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cletus_graeme/32/97017_2.png) [@Cletus\_Graeme](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cletus_Graeme)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 11:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/27 "2018-08-20T23:39:36Z")
They could maybe incorporate such a nullsec space reduction into the lore to justify it in-game so it isn’t perceived oog as a “cutback”. E.g. Gates to certain systems mysteriously go offline and after capsuleers do some exploring and intel gathering, it’s discovered this is being done by NPCs (Sleepers?) who want to use this space for their own nefarious purposes so are trying to cut it off from the rest of NE… ---
**Author:** ![Caleb\_Seremshur](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/caleb_seremshur/32/399348_2.png) [@Caleb\_Seremshur](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Caleb_Seremshur)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 11:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/28 "2018-08-20T23:41:31Z")
Yep, it could be this simple. Just take systems that are fly-over and remove them sublimely by redirecting the gates. You can probably cut 1% of the games systems outright by just looking at how much they have been used the last 24 months and if its below a given amount, kill it. ---
**Author:** ![Crash\_888](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/crash_888/32/357008_2.png) [@Crash\_888](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Crash_888)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 12:18am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/29 "2018-08-21T00:18:40Z")
No, you just need to scrap truesec (another wonderful CCP Greyscale idea) which caused this problem of condensing in the first place. The anomoly changes were just fuel on the fire, but no one ever spread out before them since if the alliance’s only upgraded -0.9 ratting system was busy they just logged a highsec alt on to run incursions. ---
**Author:** ![erg\_cz](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/erg_cz/32/392645_2.png) [@erg\_cz](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/erg_cz)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 8:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/30 "2018-08-21T08:25:49Z")
I am sure, that there is a ton of players in this game, who value solitude. Sweet feeling, that you make a difference in the place you live in. Not only a row on killboard, but real king of small part of new eden. Even if no one else wants that part, because logistic is crap and PVE opportunities are meh there… It is still your home and yours only. So - no , big no for reducing of space to live. Big yes for more advertising to lure more players into the game. Feel lonely = spend a day in Jita and you will value the calm. Eve offers place for everyone, any activity or life style. Wast emptiness is a part of it. You want more interaction? Put low sec systems between gallente high sec space , minmatar, caldari and amarr. Add them for FW for lore sake. People will have to focus on their local markets. Pirats will replace gankers. Make Jita low sec and content is there for months, or even years… ---
**Author:** ![Zachri](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zachri/32/69948_2.png) [@Zachri](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zachri)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 9:16am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/31 "2018-08-21T09:16:49Z")
> [@DrysonBennington](#): > > That’s the whole premise behind the Butterfly Effect which will throw things into chaos and generate swimming pools full of tear content. CCP fired the Butterfly quite a while ago. It traumatised some important people who wanted to be awesome while bored with EVE. It’s long story. ---
**Author:** ![Dyver\_Phycad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dyver_phycad/32/358575_2.png) [@Dyver\_Phycad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dyver_Phycad)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 10:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/32 "2018-08-21T10:54:13Z")
> [@Caleb\_Seremshur](#): > > You can probably cut 1% of the games systems outright by just looking at how much they have been used the last 24 months and if its below a given amount, kill it. Thanks, but no thanks. I like my deserted, ignored backwater NPC null sec systems where I can do what I want and do not have to bother with other individuals whenever they feel like it. ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 2:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/33 "2018-08-21T14:11:27Z")
> [@Caleb\_Seremshur](#): > > Just take systems that are fly-over and remove them sublimely by redirecting the gates. You can probably cut 1% of the games systems outright by just looking at how much they have been used the last 24 months and if its below a given amount, kill it. And why should there not be deserted systems in the game? ---
**Author:** ![Rexxar\_Santaro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rexxar_santaro/32/420075_2.png) [@Rexxar\_Santaro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rexxar_Santaro)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 7:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/34 "2018-08-21T19:09:00Z")
> [@Caleb\_Seremshur](#): > > I was talking a bit with some people today about the size of nullsec and it occurred to me that maybe Nullsec at this stage of the games lifespan is too large for the population within it. The lack of population is easily compensated by the amount of Supers. Supers needs some space. ![main-qimg-8cc4553183a30422c56809973a561087-c](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/b/0/b0205b75c2ed3ce81a49768230c239b0cf7fdb25.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Caleb\_Seremshur](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/caleb_seremshur/32/399348_2.png) [@Caleb\_Seremshur](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Caleb_Seremshur)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 9:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/35 "2018-08-21T21:21:14Z")
How many do you really need? Vague question to answer a question but you know how hard this is to deal with. ---
**Author:** ![P3ps1\_Max](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/p3ps1_max/32/390560_2.png) [@P3ps1\_Max](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/P3ps1_Max)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 9:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/36 "2018-08-21T21:38:46Z")
Living solo in a c3. Love when players say that. It tickles me. ---
**Author:** ![Old\_Pervert](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/old_pervert/32/149708_2.png) [@Old\_Pervert](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Old_Pervert)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 9:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/37 "2018-08-21T21:40:47Z")
> [@erg\_cz](#): > > Put low sec systems between I’d love the ■■■■ out of this. Highsec space divided by the main factions, lowsec systems along the border. A DMZ. That said, it’d probably murder the game. Jump routes cutting straight through highsec space would alone brutalize things. ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 9:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/38 "2018-08-21T21:51:41Z")
> [@Caleb\_Seremshur](#): > > How many do you really need? Vague question to answer a question but you know how hard this is to deal with. I don’t “need” them. But that is no reason to remove them. ---
**Author:** ![Caleb\_Seremshur](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/caleb_seremshur/32/399348_2.png) [@Caleb\_Seremshur](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Caleb_Seremshur)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 10:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/39 "2018-08-21T22:38:21Z")
maintaining the status quo isn’t an argument ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 11:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369/40 "2018-08-21T23:10:48Z")
> [@Old\_Pervert](#): > > That said, it’d probably murder the game. Jump routes cutting straight through highsec space would alone brutalize things. The bears would just trade locally within their own faction, which is also not a bad thing. It would give some more meaning to resources that are area specific. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/is-nullsec-too-large-is-it-time-we-started-to-trim-the-game/99369.md?page=3)