# It is time to disband EDENCOM **URL:** \ **Category:** Intergalactic Summit\ **Created:** [January 5, 2021, 7:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755 "2021-01-05T19:17:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 5:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/41 "2021-01-10T05:39:57Z")
> [@Jurok\_Harr](#): > > an external threat is always lends itself to unification Unification is another word for submitting to the Empire. > [@Makshima\_Shogo](#): > > Better to find out facts before getting angry about something. Better to get a clue who you’re gettin’ snooty at before you go lecturing people. > [@Kamorra\_Umyr](#): > > Noone stands to gain more from the fall of Niarja than the Minmatar Republic, forcing Amarr traders into a longer route. This is just damned stupid. You wanna blame Goons, that’s totally reasonable, since, you know, Goons made sure the system fell to spite TEST. But trying to paint it as a Republic action is just… insane. Really. > [@Bravo\_Atruin](#): > > I also feel that too much emphasis was placed on optimization at the expense of versatility; my use of the Praxis model battleship was often ridiculed to some degree, with detractors insisting other vessels would be much better at certain roles. From an offensive standpoint this was undoubtedly true, but I often found a Praxis would outlast several other ships, and was more accessible in terms of both training and financial investment. While the Praxis is definitely more accessible in terms of skill training, uniform doctrines provide more reliable and predictable performance, which means the FC needs t ospend less time wondering if they have the tools to do the job they’re presented with—be that the Trigs, or the sudden appearance of Kybers. While I can appreciate your perception that add survivability makes a case for flying a non-doctrinaire ship, what I see is exactly the opposite: your fleets needed more specialized, doctrine ships. Specifically, you needed more logistics. Logi makes the math real simple: if you bring enough, _nobody_ dies (unless they’re off being stupid in ways they shouldn’t). If somebody dies, and they weren’t being stupid? You didn’t bring enough logi. Bring enough logi, and there’s no issue of ‘outlasting’. Kitchen sinks lose wars. ---
**Author:** ![Jurok\_Harr](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jurok_harr/32/397690_2.png) [@Jurok\_Harr](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jurok_Harr)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 7:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/42 "2021-01-10T07:10:22Z")
> [@Kamorra\_Umyr](#): > > Noone > [@Arrendis](#): > > Unification is another word for submitting to the Empire. This is out of context to spirit of my original post, we all submit to something, if not the empires then the triglavians, the republic/federation over the amarr/safari state, an alliance or corporation, it’s these decisions that define us not just as capsuleers but as human beings. The empires are far from perfect, but I would fight for the defence of the people in the systems torn apart by war and cut off by the triglavians. ---
**Author:** ![Khlaa\_Sor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/khlaa_sor/32/434528_2.png) [@Khlaa\_Sor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Khlaa_Sor)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 9:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/44 "2021-01-10T09:19:57Z")
> [@Elsebeth\_Rhiannon](#): > > but we actually _are_ in a war and it never stopped for the triglavian invasions, either. This is probably the root of all troubles prompting the emergence of seemingly lame EDENCOM among other things. Is not reconciliation an option to consider, albeit the tiniest one? ---
**Author:** ![Khlaa\_Sor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/khlaa_sor/32/434528_2.png) [@Khlaa\_Sor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Khlaa_Sor)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 9:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/45 "2021-01-10T09:35:32Z")
> [@Jurok\_Harr](#): > > an external threat is always lends itself to unification In many a case it does, although can also be used as an excuse by those seeking establishment of universal new order under their sole total control disregarding sentiments, interests, and long-standing aspirations of any local entities, which is what @Elsebeth_Rhiannon appears to be concerned about, drawing the public attention to deeply alarming developments. In this context, EDENCOM might be even a greater threat to true freedom, independence, and cultural diversity than the Triglavians who could just end up in their own niche among the core powers of New Eden, ultimately to mutual enrichment, both material and spiritual ---
**Author:** ![Elsebeth\_Rhiannon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elsebeth_rhiannon/32/418836_2.png) [@Elsebeth\_Rhiannon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elsebeth_Rhiannon)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 10:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/46 "2021-01-10T10:06:22Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Kitchen sinks lose wars. While this is true, I have to ask people bug off to Off-topic or a new thread if they want to continue the EDI non-ending and as thus no doubt fascinating to some debate about “is doctrine actually a good thing”. This post is _not_ about EDI, it is about Edencom, international politics, and the best way to ensure the survival of the tribes. ---
**Author:** ![Elsebeth\_Rhiannon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elsebeth_rhiannon/32/418836_2.png) [@Elsebeth\_Rhiannon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elsebeth_Rhiannon)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 10:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/47 "2021-01-10T10:09:29Z")
> [@Khlaa\_Sor](#): > > Is not reconciliation an option to consider, albeit the tiniest one? Huge steps of reconciliation have already been taken. Tiny steps won’t stop the war. At the moment, we have experts stating Sarum is preparing for another assault of ground war. It’s pretty hard to “reconciliate” with that. And don’t even get me started on “a religion that wants yours to cease existing is never by nature peaceful”. ---
**Author:** ![Marco11](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/marco11/32/359992_2.png) [@Marco11](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Marco11)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 11:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/48 "2021-01-10T11:48:06Z")
Rise against the traitors, rise against the Triglavian hive. Unite and stand as one. ---
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 11:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/49 "2021-01-10T11:57:04Z")
I think most people in this thread are all for shooting Triglavians. It’s just that platitudes aren’t going to stop the empires from fighting with one another. I feel like some people (understandably) hyper-focused on the Triglavian invasions and assumed EDENCOM’s existence means that the empires have been “playing nice” with one another. But… they haven’t. Floseswin was still going on at the start on the invasions and it’ll probably be time for round 2 soon. Not much room to “unite and stand as one.” ---
**Author:** ![Khlaa\_Sor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/khlaa_sor/32/434528_2.png) [@Khlaa\_Sor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Khlaa_Sor)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 11:59am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/50 "2021-01-10T11:59:59Z")
> [@Elsebeth\_Rhiannon](#): > > At the moment, we have experts stating Sarum is preparing for another assault of ground war. It’s pretty hard to “reconciliate” with that. Sad to hear, hope won’t prove as coordinated effort as it might seem… > [@Elsebeth\_Rhiannon](#): > > And don’t even get me started on “a religion that wants yours to cease existing is never by nature peaceful”. Surely not a desired course of the discussion. Rather, someone viewing the latest events from the vantage point of autonomous tribal territory peacefully and beneficially confederated with the Empire, might come up with the following general suggestions regarding the matters so appropriately pointed out in the opening post: 1. Have EDENCOM focus on what they appear to be most productive and successful at - R&D. Their technologies are nowhere near worthless. 2. National militias, instead of wastefully fighting each other to no avail, could turn on the Triglavians in a bid to retake their respective systems. Local navies should be ready to provide support in case any major threats to national security arise from the fighting. EDENCOM on their part could monitor the situation providing incentives in form of payouts/technology access for greater number of independent pilots to join the fight in most threatened sectors. However, this should by no means be a war of extermination against the Trigs. There is no more vicious beast than a cornered one… Thus, 3. Attention of the Trigs could be directed to the regions like Delve, Stain, Curse, etc. currently in the hands of rogue groups. They could try and take a few systems as their new home there. Those sympathizing with them (which is not unreasonable given the new technological and cultural opportunities they brought to the New Eden with their invasion) could join the fight on their side in those very regions. Some people would even be able to fight against the Trigs on one front and pro them on the other, in a sort of win-win option. On the other hand, those with vested interests in the said regions might consider helping the current holders defend their turf. All-in-all, this would provide some interesting opportunities for productive destruction and epic feats which ultimately won’t hurt the well-being of the cluster (hopefully). ---
**Author:** ![Marco11](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/marco11/32/359992_2.png) [@Marco11](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Marco11)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 12:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/51 "2021-01-10T12:12:22Z")
This is true, but instead of calls to disband EDENCOM while I hear the valid argument. We need a statement from them on the next steps and what they are planning to do. I feel a counter-offensive should enter into the planning phase (if not already). Defensive fleets mobilized and resourced to push the Triglavian’s back from Empire Space. Once the internal systems of Pochven become under constant fire it paves the way for EDENCOM to make the push. In turn lowering the pressure on the empires. Having said that, I agree with the opinions on this thread but we do need to hear from EDENCOM soon. I refuse to believe that they will just give up on those systems. ---
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 12:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/52 "2021-01-10T12:30:21Z")
> [@Marco11](#): > > I refuse to believe that they will just give up on those systems. Triglavians run rampant in systems that were never invaded such as Perimeter and even in EDENCOM victory systems like Bei from time to time. If EDENCOM is going to focus on being offensive in Pochven (which I have no problem with in and of itself), they need to change the rules of engagement for systems that _weren’t_ taken away to allow the local navies _not_ under the EDENCOM banner to engage the Triglavians. Basically, defense against hunting Triglavians should not be left solely up to masochistic capsuleers. ---
**Author:** ![Marco11](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/marco11/32/359992_2.png) [@Marco11](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Marco11)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 12:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/53 "2021-01-10T12:34:10Z")
I understand and valid point 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 4:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/54 "2021-01-10T16:48:37Z")
> [@Jurok\_Harr](#): > > I would fight for the defence of the people in the systems torn apart by war and cut off by the triglavians. Cooperation is fine. Unification is _not_. > [@Khlaa\_Sor](#): > > Is not reconciliation an option to consider, albeit the tiniest one? Ask the gilded murderers who invade our planets because they’re mad about _Amarr capsuleers_ cutting deals with TLF members. > [@Khlaa\_Sor](#): > > Have EDENCOM focus on what they appear to be most productive and successful at - R&D. Their technologies are nowhere near worthless. EDENCOM’s made no real leaps that I’ve seen. Upwell had the full scale Vorton projector running for years. You can be damned sure it was them, not the added layer of CONCORD bureucracy, that developed the ship-scale versions. > [@Khlaa\_Sor](#): > > National militias, instead of wastefully fighting each other to no avail, could turn on the Triglavians in a bid to retake their respective systems. Good luck. Not only do we have perfectly valid reasons for destroying the ships that come to enslave whole planets, CONCORD makes too much money off of the warzones for _that_ to stop. > [@Khlaa\_Sor](#): > > Attention of the Trigs could be directed to the regions like Delve, Stain, Curse, etc. currently in the hands of rogue groups. They could try and take a few systems as their new home there. Those sympathizing with them (which is not unreasonable given the new technological and cultural opportunities they brought to the New Eden with their invasion) could join the fight on their side in those very regions. Some people would even be able to fight against the Trigs on one front and pro them on the other, in a sort of win-win option. On the other hand, those with vested interests in the said regions might consider helping the current holders defend their turf. Sure, we’ll just tell the Trigs ‘hey, those systems you specifically wanted because of the type of star in them? Yeah, go look for different ones over in these other regions that don’t have those stars for no apparent reason’. Oh, wait, that’d require being able to actually negotiate with the Trigs, wouldn’t it? I mean, don’t get me wrong, I’d love to see the Trigs come out here. We wouldn’t be fighting with one hand tied behind our backs. Proper doctrines, full range of supercapital assets (Well, not from papi… heh.), it would’ve been _much_ easier than the hoops that had to be jumped through in Highsec. But see, in order to do that, there would have needed to be something the Trigs wanted out here. And what they wanted was _those specific stars_. They didn’t get all of what they wanted, but they weren’t about to attack things they _didn’t_ want. ---
**Author:** ![Jamal\_Frederick](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jamal_frederick/32/374132_2.png) [@Jamal\_Frederick](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jamal_Frederick)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 5:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/55 "2021-01-10T17:17:09Z")
> [@Hamish\_Grayson](#): > > Nonni Thanks for a good laugh remembering that system. EDENCOM tried so many times to take the system…even had help from Fraternity once. Wasn’t enough. Very fun ensuring KK’s HQ got raided. ---
**Author:** ![Jamal\_Frederick](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jamal_frederick/32/374132_2.png) [@Jamal\_Frederick](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jamal_Frederick)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2021, 5:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/56 "2021-01-10T17:36:45Z")
> [@Marco11](#): > > counter-offensive should enter into the planning phase (if not already). The counter-offensives already exist, we blow them up. ---
**Author:** ![Bravo\_Atruin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bravo_atruin/32/256799_2.png) [@Bravo\_Atruin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bravo_Atruin)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2021, 8:16am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/57 "2021-01-11T08:16:55Z")
> [@Jamal\_Frederick](#): > > counter-offensives already exist This thread is about taking a completely different approach, you utter dolt. ---
**Author:** ![Jurok\_Harr](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jurok_harr/32/397690_2.png) [@Jurok\_Harr](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jurok_Harr)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2021, 12:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/58 "2021-01-12T00:28:12Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Cooperation is fine. Unification is _not_. That’s fine with me I’m against the Triglavians as long as they take space and attack baseliners, heck, in the spirit of it I would help Amarrian asserts as well, and I got no love for them, after its all over its back to business as usual. ---
**Author:** ![Khlaa\_Sor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/khlaa_sor/32/434528_2.png) [@Khlaa\_Sor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Khlaa_Sor)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2021, 3:13am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/59 "2021-01-12T03:13:11Z")
> [@Jurok\_Harr](#): > > after its all over its back to business as usual. what if it’s not ever going to be all over but escalates? ---
**Author:** ![Cain\_Aloga](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cain_aloga/32/457080_2.png) [@Cain\_Aloga](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cain_Aloga)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2021, 3:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/60 "2021-01-12T03:54:47Z")
> [@Khlaa\_Sor](#): > > Is not reconciliation an option to consider, albeit the tiniest one? No. > [@Jurok\_Harr](#): > > Would help Amarrian asserts as well Let them burn. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2021, 3:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755/61 "2021-01-12T15:14:48Z")
> [@Cain\_Aloga](#): > > Let them burn. Tempting as that is, weakening the cluster’s industrial base that much while the Trigs are still attacking is… not a great move. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/it-is-time-to-disband-edencom/288755.md?page=4)