# July Release - Strategic Cruisers **URL:** \ **Category:** Upcoming Features & Changes\ **Tags:** july, ships\ **Created:** [July 3, 2017, 11:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414 "2017-07-03T11:21:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 22
**Author:** ![Dior\_Ambraelle](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dior_ambraelle/32/393685_2.png) [@Dior\_Ambraelle](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dior_Ambraelle)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 2:20am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/427 "2017-07-07T02:20:57Z")
The spreadsheet is only about the visual changes. We will lose 1 of the art assets for each current subsystems and there is a mild… disagreement about which they should be. You can check the new functions and visuals on SISI. ---
**Author:** ![Fiona\_Marquise](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fiona_marquise/32/6449_2.png) [@Fiona\_Marquise](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fiona_Marquise)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 2:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/429 "2017-07-07T02:51:38Z")
Well SISI confirmed what you said and confirmed my fears as well, my ship doesnt have the capacitor recharge rate, the CPU capacity OR the powergrid to handle my build anymore along with losing a low slot. So it is still functionally docked and useless, and thats with faction gear reducing cpu and powergrid costs . . . . ---
**Author:** ![Sterling\_Blades](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sterling_blades/32/323876_2.png) [@Sterling\_Blades](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sterling_Blades)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 6:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/430 "2017-07-07T06:17:40Z")
After doing some testing with the Loki, I find the new setups adequate. Hell, even with a stupid roleplay only fit I cooked up for it, it still was volleying most cruiser and below rats at anything below 30 klicks with appropriate max damage ammo. And this was in a primarily t2/meta fit withoutbdamage mods or rigs setup mind you all. No word on how it actually fairs PVP-wise yet, but I plan to do a basic test of that later today against NPC mining response fleets, and then move on to the 6CZ combat areas, where it will surely die in a fire. Edit: Additionally, I’m enjoying my Loki being 563 meters long with my current subsystem sets, not sure why. Just feels right. ---
**Author:** ![Jallukola](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jallukola/32/184701_2.png) [@Jallukola](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jallukola)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 7:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/431 "2017-07-07T07:48:28Z")
> [@Cade\_Windstalker](#): > > Lol, you’re getting exactly none of that. I’ve worked in software well long enough not to give out any personal information. Especially not to demanding idiots on game forums. So you wish to play Hitchens’ Razor then. Fine I’ll play one too the and say you are not a developer and that’s that. Try again without resorting to ad homs. > [@Cade\_Windstalker](#): > > Ah, the old “it works on my machine” defense. Classic. Has seldom worked when someone’s checked in broken code in my experience though. > > Try searching for things like “Invisible T3s eve” or “eve broken T3 model” and you’ll get plenty of hits. Doesen’t matter, never had those issues, some google image search doesen’t change that. And again with the ad homs, you’re not really good at this. > [@Cade\_Windstalker](#): > > Because I feel this is a waste of dev time that would be better spent elsewhere on something with more game impact that affects more players and doesn’t revolve around someone’s personal aesthetic tastes. That’s too bad. I feel it would be worthwile addon for the game. It’s not like CCP doesn’t have multiple teams working different aspects of the game right, right? > [@Cade\_Windstalker](#): > > SKINs aren’t actually uniformly rendered. The game picks the default SKIN for the ship until you either get close enough or some other conditions are met at which point it loads the SKIN into memory and renders it. > > I understand client vs server perfectly well, but as I said I was responding to your original suggestion which was decidedly server-side. Well okay, ‘rendered to everyone on grid’ since you wanna ■■■■ the dot, but it’s still a _bigger_ load than a client side change would be. I haven’t talked about my original version for a while now, why are you? Scraping the bottom of the barrel maybe? But whatever floats your boat, no pun intended. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Floydy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mr_floydy/32/220816_2.png) [@Mr\_Floydy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mr_Floydy)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 7:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/432 "2017-07-07T07:53:08Z")
Oh my, no wonder your getting such terrible stats with that fit. That’s wrong on so many levels. Based on what you are saying you should seriously up your SP before considering flying a Tengu for a start, you’ll see it improve hugely from level 5s in subsystem skills, not to mention fit some more appropriate mods… Looks like you are after a cloaky pve ship with fairly acceptable dps and tank… Try something like this as a starter point. 600+ dps heavy missiles, get’s rid of your range issue and will apply damage better, can tank significantly more. I’m sure with some time spent tweaking it could be made better too, I’ve just thrown this together in a minute! [Tengu, cloaky pve thing] Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II 10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner Thukker Large Cap Battery Caldari Navy Large Shield Booster Adaptive Invulnerability Field II EM Ward Amplifier II Target Painter II Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Covert Ops Cloaking Device II Expanded Probe Launcher II, Core Scanner Probe I Medium Core Defense Operational Solidifier II Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I Tengu Defensive - Covert Reconfiguration Tengu Core - Augmented Graviton Reactor Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Chassis Optimization ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 8:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/433 "2017-07-07T08:01:42Z")
> [@Mr\_Floydy](#): > > Add 5x HAM. Add 3x BCUs and drones. There you go, 800dps Loki. You neglect to mention that is only with the whole rack overheated. Without overheating, its roughly half of that. However, that does raise a crucial point: **-T3Cs are now basically Overheat specialists.** ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Floydy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mr_floydy/32/220816_2.png) [@Mr\_Floydy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mr_Floydy)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 8:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/434 "2017-07-07T08:22:52Z")
Nope. T2 rage missiles and drones take you over 800 without overheating. I don’t believe any of the T3s have overheat related damage bonuses unless something changed since I was looking last night… ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 8:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/435 "2017-07-07T08:25:39Z")
> [@Mr\_Floydy](#): > > Nope. T2 rage missiles and drones take you over 800 without overheating. I don’t believe any of the T3s have overheat related damage bonuses unless something changed since I was looking last night… HAM Rage also only reaches 800 when overheated. Your HAM build only reaches 800 when fully overheated. I never claimed there is a damage bonus to overheating weapons on T3Cs, but they only perform at the dps levels you mention when fully overheated. ---
**Author:** ![zluq\_zabaa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zluq_zabaa/32/19011_2.png) [@zluq\_zabaa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zluq_zabaa)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 9:11am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/436 "2017-07-07T09:11:07Z")
> [@Rumi\_Shanti](#): > > i can’t fly a drake yet, i am a brand new player hehe. I can fly pirate faction only, rook, falcon, Purifier, and Tengu. My skills with tengu or only L3. But the problems skilling higher will be that when you are blown up you go back down. Unless you never die you will always be fighting your way trying to make the ship useable again. Welcome to EVE 🙂 If you can fly rook, falcon and tengu it means you can already train for a caldari Battlecruiser, namely the Drake. The whole issue with Skill Point loss was intended. While risking to train/inject again, your T3C really started to shine with certain subsystem skills to 5. I guess with the upcoming changes this is even more the case. So yeah, as you say, taking frigs into FW is a great path for the newer player. Exploration is great too in my opinion, as you will learn a load of important things and it is fun to move around. In both activities you will probably lose a bunch of ships, but also meet people who are willing to help you learn. Manyn corps like the self-driven player who goes out there and plays, not waiting for someone else to tell them what to do. You are on a good path, I’d say 🙂 > [@Rumi\_Shanti](#): > > when PVP comes knocking -which in inevitably does. I am horrible at it, hit the panic button and freeze til im podded You’ll get there, don’t worry. Most people freeze or forget doing basic things while in a fight, it even happens to really good players from time to time. Try undocking with the intent to lose your ship, like a Gladiator, already dead. That gives you a certain kind of freedom and calmness. You try to choose where and how your ship goes down, try to decide against which ship/s, in the best case you take someone down with you. Repeat with a different ship, maybe a cheap T1 ship for a change. And, just a suggestion, it really helps if you join a PVP corp. Playing in a nice group will be more fun and you will learn faster. ---
**Author:** ![Dior\_Ambraelle](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dior_ambraelle/32/393685_2.png) [@Dior\_Ambraelle](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dior_Ambraelle)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 9:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/437 "2017-07-07T09:12:36Z")
Are you using L or XL shield boosters, or their ancillary versions? Because… yeah, it seems like it’s not a thing anymore. ---
**Author:** ![NextDarkKnight](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nextdarkknight/32/171101_2.png) [@NextDarkKnight](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/NextDarkKnight)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 9:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/438 "2017-07-07T09:38:00Z")
How much damage can that fit apply? Tell you the truth I have only used Heavy Missiles on battleship sized weapons since the missile change. I sometimes play with people that still use Heavy MIssile on a Tengu but it takes us so long to complete a site I rather go HAM Solo. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Floydy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mr_floydy/32/220816_2.png) [@Mr\_Floydy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mr_Floydy)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 9:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/439 "2017-07-07T09:41:47Z")
Will vary I guess. I’ve not ran the numbers to see how different they are in a long while, but Heavy missiles have always applied much better than heavy assault missiles. Especially against small/fast stuff. ---
**Author:** ![zluq\_zabaa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zluq_zabaa/32/19011_2.png) [@zluq\_zabaa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zluq_zabaa)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 9:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/440 "2017-07-07T09:47:16Z")
> [@Cade\_Windstalker](#): > > If you want an academic definition this paper has some good ones: [http://nicolasesposito.fr/publications\_fichiers/esposito2005definition.pdf](http://nicolasesposito.fr/publications_fichiers/esposito2005definition.pdf) Thanks for the link. So he took the definition of _game_ and _play_ from Eric Zimmerman, who is a video game designer himself. His definition of _play_ is either too narrow or too broad for me, depending how you choose to read it. He states: > “Play is the free space of movement within a more rigid structure. Play exists both because of and also despite the more rigid structures of a system.” If you read that broadly you’ll have to extrapolate that almost everything that happens in the universe is _play_. More narrow, so if you think already inside the box of games we know and understand as games, it leads to the question what _free space of movement_ even is and even if we accept this cloaky term as something that exist in games, does it really define the term _play_? I don’t think so. Similar with his definition of _game_ which - read with best intentions - is a somewhat working for many games. He says that “…enacting an artificial conflict that ends in a quantifiable outcome”. This is one of the reasons I did say that EVE contains games, but is not a game as a whole. It is a virtual space in which we play games, communicate and so on. While certain aspects of EVE provide strict enough rules to fit his definition of game (“…one or more players follow rules that constrain their behaviour”) you’d need to read that very broadly to define EVE as a whole as a game. If you do, you would also have to conclude that society itself is a game, which is, in my view, not a good way to use terms. Otherwise I’ll find a way to explain you why everything is Broccoli. ---
**Author:** ![Metharius\_Endares](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/metharius_endares/32/6228_2.png) [@Metharius\_Endares](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Metharius_Endares)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 9:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/441 "2017-07-07T09:55:33Z")
> [@Cade\_Windstalker](#): > > I like that it’s a bit cleaner and more “space-shippy” as opposed to looking like one of those Styrofoam lock together models. i understand that. the difference in that regard isn t an issue, that s why i spoke about the commorant, the moa and the Osprey by giving this link [http://imgur.com/a/IubEk](http://imgur.com/a/IubEk) . Here to, the line is more “modern spaceship” verry polished, and aerodynamic’s profile. This is “ok” i guess because i understand that this is 100% subjective. some like this “verry SF loking ship in the SF” some do not. however, like i said in the case of the commorant , the eagle and osprey, griffin, trasher etc, they kept the vibe, line and what define thoses ship. they didn t transformed it into another ship like they did with the chimera (who became this Rokh.2.0). i gues during development they eard “carrier” so they went “oh then let s make it like a boat, in space” i really think the old chimera had more identity [http://imgur.com/uUcOjw9](http://imgur.com/uUcOjw9) i really think they should have just update its model, add some animation/moving part but kept the ship’s line. (like they did with pretty much all other ship…so why?) ---
**Author:** ![Rek\_Seven](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rek_seven/32/281864_2.png) [@Rek\_Seven](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rek_Seven)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 10:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/442 "2017-07-07T10:43:54Z")
Slightly off topic but it applies to Tech 3 cruisers… Why is it acceptable that an active shield tank is so much stronger than an active armour tank? You can build a cloaky tengu that can rep almost 3k damage per second while being 70% cap stable. Comparatively, the Proteus struggles to achieve 1k ehp/s and your cap only lasts 55 seconds. Generally the proteus is under-powered in comparison to the Tengu. They both achieve around 1k dps but the tengu has 5x the damage projection, 3x the local rep power and is not affected by neuts nearly as much as the Proteus… In what world is this good balance? ---
**Author:** ![Skarlock\_Tremillion](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/skarlock_tremillion/32/51068_2.png) [@Skarlock\_Tremillion](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Skarlock_Tremillion)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 11:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/443 "2017-07-07T11:51:34Z")
Will access to exploration sites be changed with this update? Basically will T3 cruisers be allowed to access the same sites as other cruiser sized hulls, that they’re currently restricted from accessing? ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 11:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/444 "2017-07-07T11:52:34Z")
> [@Skarlock\_Tremillion](#): > > Will access to exploration sites be changed with this update? Basically will T3 cruisers be allowed to access the same sites as other cruiser sized hulls, that they’re currently restricted from accessing? Fozzie answered this earlier in the thread. Basically, no plan to change gate access at this stage, so no. ---
**Author:** ![zluq\_zabaa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zluq_zabaa/32/19011_2.png) [@zluq\_zabaa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zluq_zabaa)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 12:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/445 "2017-07-07T12:01:37Z")
Are you talking current T3C or post-patch? ---
**Author:** ![Jake\_Chely](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jake_chely/32/376786_2.png) [@Jake\_Chely](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jake_Chely)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 12:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/446 "2017-07-07T12:30:39Z")
Most changes of this rebalance seem fair but I’m concerned about tech3 base speed. I used the simulator on SISI to check and compare the speed of Tech3 and battlecruisers. I might be wrong but I think ship classes are here for a reason : a cruiser is supposed to be more agile and faster than a battlecruiser. Some of the new Tech3 like the Proteus can’t get any bonus to speed from subsystems. It brings them in line with the battlecruisers in terms of speed. Some battlecruisers are even faster than tech3, which, in my opinion, is not very logical considering they are not from the same ship class. Maybe Tech3 should be considered more in between cruisers and battlecruisers. It terms of agility and signature radius it’s pretty much the case with that rebalance. But it doesn’t seem to be the case for speed. Is there any potential change scheduled for base speed before release? ---
**Author:** ![Rek\_Seven](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rek_seven/32/281864_2.png) [@Rek\_Seven](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rek_Seven)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2017, 12:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414/447 "2017-07-07T12:32:08Z")
In terms of the type of reps? Both i guess… The cloaky fits i was talking about are based on post-patch stats. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414.md?page=21) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/july-release-strategic-cruisers/8414.md?page=23)