# KVN-36 Node Death - 2020/08/21 **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [August 21, 2020, 9:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893 "2020-08-21T21:33:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![xttz](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xttz/32/441557_2.png) [@xttz](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/xttz)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/204 "2020-08-21T22:46:26Z")
[https://i.imgur.com/hZotOSk.mp4](https://i.imgur.com/hZotOSk.mp4) ---
**Author:** ![Runt\_Ormand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runt_ormand/32/225362_2.png) [@Runt\_Ormand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runt_Ormand)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/205 "2020-08-21T22:46:37Z")
Words cannot describe how unenjoyable this experience was for a new player. How has tidi not been addressed in 15+ years? Why are timers not effected by server crashes? ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/206 "2020-08-21T22:48:41Z")
I mean someone used same tactic back in the days, 0 complaints there. And btw: i would use the same stuff to suicide-smartbomb as many enemies as possible. If CCP knows about the issue and will not fix neither modules not servers… well… ---
**Author:** ![Wibla](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wibla/32/462773_2.png) [@Wibla](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wibla)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/207 "2020-08-21T22:50:36Z")
> [@Mashiro\_Rima](#): > > Look at the little Goon being sad people are spouting the truth about his alliance. Get out of here kid. Shoo back to SomethingAwful Oh, so now you’re done bitching about dumb ■■■■ from 2012 and instead resort to ad hominem-arguments. Cool beans. > [@Daro\_Mozu](#): > > i wonder if you would ask about the same thing if it would be NC/horde keep seiged by goons 😃 😂 > [@Rex\_Vyvorant](#): > > Hey im just saying when someone uses a decent amount of ships that have SBs Bursts and Target breakers its pretty suspicious Chemoing fleets is all the rage, so this was to be expected. Note that it was an imperium fleet that ate ■■■■ to smartbombs. > [@Runt\_Ormand](#): > > Words cannot describe how unenjoyable this experience was for a new player. It sucks pretty bad man, hope you had ample supply of beer / stronger stuff. > [@Runt\_Ormand](#): > > How has tidi not been addressed in 15+ years? Why are timers not effected by server crashes? Structure timers have never been affected by TiDi, and as far as I’ve heard it’s pretty hard for CCP to change them to follow the TiDi as well. I wouldn’t count on this changing anytime soon. ---
**Author:** ![RatKnight1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ratknight1/32/224448_2.png) [@RatKnight1](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/RatKnight1)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/208 "2020-08-21T22:51:24Z")
CCP does not reimburse large scale player conflicts. ---
**Author:** ![Wibla](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wibla/32/462773_2.png) [@Wibla](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wibla)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/209 "2020-08-21T22:52:26Z")
![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/d/d/ddaafb3e61deba60e05059399e169cf598edffe0.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Malina\_Akachi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/malina_akachi/32/404329_2.png) [@Malina\_Akachi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Malina_Akachi)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/210 "2020-08-21T22:53:51Z")
Can somebody explain why the timer keeps running if the server goes down irregularly? I’d imagine they’d do something like adding the time the server was offline to the timer in case something like this happens. ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/211 "2020-08-21T22:55:57Z")
> [@Wibla](#): > > Structure timers have never been affected by TiDi, and as far as I’ve heard it’s pretty hard for CCP to change them to follow the TiDi as well. I wouldn’t count on this changing anytime soon. there you go ---
**Author:** ![Axhind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/axhind/32/461932_2.png) [@Axhind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Axhind)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/212 "2020-08-21T22:56:13Z")
They are for small ones. But not for big battles where you bring 2 times our numbers and use tactics that increase TiDi. ---
**Author:** ![Aernir\_Ridley](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aernir_ridley/32/339667_2.png) [@Aernir\_Ridley](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aernir_Ridley)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/213 "2020-08-21T22:56:14Z")
Actually here’s a nice and easy idea: Can CCP automatically disable burst jammers and target spectrum breakers after a certain threshold of players or TiDi level? Smartbombs at least have a legitimate use but I doubt anyone’s strategies would be ruined by the removal of those two modules. ---
**Author:** ![RatKnight1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ratknight1/32/224448_2.png) [@RatKnight1](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/RatKnight1)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/214 "2020-08-21T22:56:19Z")
Yeah, So goons brought this up the last time this happened… when they were attacking a Panfam keepstar and the node crashed. Basically, iirc, the timer is not tied to the node time and is instead tied to the real clock. This is necessary because something or another breaks if you tie the structure timer to Tidi. The timer WAS paused while the node was down, but as soon as the node is back it resumed. There is no “fair” way to decide when the timer would start again after a node crash… you either do it as soon as it comes back, or you… pick an arbitrary time? There is no good solution. ---
**Author:** ![Axhind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/axhind/32/461932_2.png) [@Axhind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Axhind)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/215 "2020-08-21T22:59:20Z")
Best part is that NC and pets told us to adapt when we were on the attacking side and their keeps got saved by the timer being in RT. Strange how they find it wrong now 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Bonsailinse](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bonsailinse/32/381163_2.png) [@Bonsailinse](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bonsailinse)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 10:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/216 "2020-08-21T22:59:51Z")
Rendering game mechanics and modules useless because a server can’t handle them isn’t something any gaming developer should be proud of, especially if you already have a system in place to prevent server crashes. Not using fighters or burst modules isn’t an option at all. ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 11:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/217 "2020-08-21T23:00:13Z")
This can not be done for one reason: if CCP will go this way then CCP will need(eventually) micro-script a lot of things in EVE for the sake of whatever. Restriction here, restriction there… game will become their playground, not ours. ---
**Author:** ![Heffoz](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/heffoz/32/196328_2.png) [@Heffoz](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Heffoz)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 11:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/218 "2020-08-21T23:00:46Z")
The other problem which nobody seems to be recognising is that they rolled back the server too. Ships that were safe and KS damage progress that had been made had been reversed. So not only did they fail to set the structure timer to something that was fair, they reversed time (and damage done to the keepstar by a large amount). ---
**Author:** ![RatKnight1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ratknight1/32/224448_2.png) [@RatKnight1](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/RatKnight1)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 11:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/219 "2020-08-21T23:03:10Z")
That happens everytime this happens. At the very least, it doesn’t pick sides. Also, the keepstar did not have damage undone. I was on grid, and it was exactly the same before as after. There were ships that had died that appeared, for a short time, to come back to life but eventually died anyhow. Goons bitched about this when it happened to us, and nothing changed. Don’t expect anything to come of this. ---
**Author:** ![Morphius1280](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/morphius1280/32/491556_2.png) [@Morphius1280](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Morphius1280)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 11:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/220 "2020-08-21T23:03:58Z")
Agreed, when the server died i was on grid attempting to lock a rokh. when the server came back up i was warped to the astra, which took time to warp back down. by the time i did keepstar was almost fully repaired with only a few seconds left. WTF Gives? ---
**Author:** ![Axhind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/axhind/32/461932_2.png) [@Axhind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Axhind)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 11:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/221 "2020-08-21T23:04:55Z")
> [@Bonsailinse](#): > > Rendering game mechanics and modules useless because a server can’t handle them isn’t something any gaming developer should be proud of, especially if you already have a system in place to prevent server crashes. > Not using fighters or burst modules isn’t an option at all. There are limits to everything in real life. Server power is not infinite. Even with the best of the best Zen2 epyc ones there are limitations. We can load the server more than any available CPU on the planet can handle. That means that we have to take that into account. CCP can upgrade the server (last upgrade they posted about was ages ago so maybe we can get 20-30% more IPC with newest ZEN2s) but that is not infinite. We will just cram in more people (NC and co had twice our numbers in this fight). At some point mitigation of TiDi involving correct doctrines and limiting amount of people in the system are your only realistic options. I guess you can also cry on the internet about CCP not having magical servers or ability to break physical and mathematical limits but that will not get you anywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Rain6637](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rain6637/32/404316_2.png) [@Rain6637](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rain6637)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 11:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/222 "2020-08-21T23:07:07Z")
![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/2/f/2fd405b814f09e6e676b70f5285e25b602989d7c.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Kirito\_Ouma](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirito_ouma/32/213123_2.png) [@Kirito\_Ouma](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirito_Ouma)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2020, 11:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893/223 "2020-08-21T23:07:24Z")
What a load of ■■■■ honestly. This just broke a lot of spirit. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893.md?page=10) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/kvn-36-node-death-2020-08-21/261893.md?page=12)