# Local Comms Blackout - Discussion Thread - Part Deux! **URL:** \ **Category:** Announcements\ **Tags:** feedback, official\ **Created:** [July 18, 2019, 7:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410 "2019-07-18T19:57:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 4:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/105 "2019-07-19T04:51:46Z")
102 replies already, wonder if this thread will also hit the 10,000 lock. ---
**Author:** ![Sylvia\_Kildare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sylvia_kildare/32/416948_2.png) [@Sylvia\_Kildare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sylvia_Kildare)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 5:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/106 "2019-07-19T05:56:24Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > They can, yes. At the same time, using only Miner IIs, a Rorqual still mines about 160% of a boosted Hulk’s yield. Without caring about training for the crystals or the strip miners. So there’s still no real upside to downgrading to a Hulk. Not to downgrading an already-fully-trained-Rorq pilot, no… but I know a few people who do the 1 Rorq 2 Hulk thing, and they might have been tempted to just go 3 Rorqs eventually prior to the spring 2019 nerfs. But now they’re happy staying 1 Rorq 2 Hulk (especially with the increased Rorq boosts… still waiting on Orca to get a half as good boosting bonus increase ;D) in light of the changes. ---
**Author:** ![Loutro\_Fift](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/loutro_fift/32/195473_2.png) [@Loutro\_Fift](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Loutro_Fift)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 6:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/107 "2019-07-19T06:10:25Z")
> [@frentelgt](#): > > I myself normally wouldn’t post But here is the deal all of you who are bashing the 10000 or so who dropped their accounts that’s about 15 x 10000 x 12 = 1.8 million or so in revenue to ccp. That being said All you devs and GM types who are paid by the consumer where is the paycheck going to come from……… At a certain point even you the hardcore pvpers will find the game unplayable as targets become scarce and ships become hard to come by. And as for you who want to poke at the unsubbers just remember you already are paying to play all you lose are targets. Proof please, otherwise stop believing all that nonsense in your head. Your logic is missing ---
**Author:** ![fudface](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fudface/32/410867_2.png) [@fudface](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/fudface)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 6:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/108 "2019-07-19T06:19:59Z")
risk averse much dude. ---
**Author:** ![Randolph\_Jackson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/randolph_jackson/32/180036_2.png) [@Randolph\_Jackson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Randolph_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 6:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/109 "2019-07-19T06:21:24Z")
black out is awesome ty ccp ---
**Author:** ![Merovee](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merovee/32/167629_2.png) [@Merovee](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merovee)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 6:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/110 "2019-07-19T06:22:28Z")
Well I guess I better give my opinion. Keep the black out, but allow citadels to anchored onto gates to control who can use it. They can be the frontier forts of null sec. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 6:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/111 "2019-07-19T06:23:54Z")
> [@Sylvia\_Kildare](#): > > they might have been tempted to just go 3 Rorqs eventually prior to the spring 2019 nerfs. > > But now they’re happy staying 1 Rorq 2 Hulk (especially with the increased Rorq boosts Then they’re making a mistake. Going to the Rorq and just using Miner IIs will give them more yield, and an easier time moving the pilots around if needed. ---
**Author:** ![Sylvia\_Kildare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sylvia_kildare/32/416948_2.png) [@Sylvia\_Kildare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sylvia_Kildare)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 6:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/112 "2019-07-19T06:54:06Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Then they’re making a mistake. Going to the Rorq and just using Miner IIs will give them more yield, and an easier time moving the pilots around if needed. Interesting stuff. I will relay that tip, thanks. I guess it’d work on Orcas, too, eh? supplement the ore mined by 5 ore bots with a bit of miner II action. Of course, any Orca or Rorq that’s fitting 3 burst modules has less high slot room… Edit: hang on, are you just pulling my leg? no turret slots = no miners, right? same reason a venture can only fit 2 despite 3 high slots? ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 6:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/113 "2019-07-19T06:57:11Z")
I wandered around Null last night. Very quiet. Except for a couple small gangs. When theres a vacuum developing, the next thing is it becomes filled. Lets see what Stage 4 brings. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:11am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/114 "2019-07-19T07:11:37Z")
Mining Drone IIs, not Mining Laser IIs. Rorq w/2 Capital Drone Mining Augmentor IIs, 1 Capital Drone Mining Augmentor I, 2 Drone Navigation Computers == 74.3m3/s w/5 Mining Drone IIs. Hulk w/2 Strip Miner IIs, 3 Mining Laser Upgrade IIs, 5 Mining Drone IIs: 59.1m3/s + 5.67m3/s = 64.8m3/s — and it will die, a lot. You’ll need to drop that to 1 MLU II to have what passes for a tank on a Hulk, and you generally don’t want to try using Miner IIs on a Hulk because it’ll need to have drones out already to auto-aggress on rats etc. which drops your yield to 49.8m3/s. And no, it doesn’t work on the Orca, because the Industrial Core gives a +500% Drone Ore Mining Yield Bonus and a +30% Drone Maximum Velocity Bonus. The Orca’s only pulling in 24.8m3/s with its 5 drones, which are only moving 1.13km/s compared to the Rorqual’s 1.32km/s. ---
**Author:** ![Ikki\_Phoenix](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ikki_phoenix/32/391105_2.png) [@Ikki\_Phoenix](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ikki_Phoenix)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:18am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/115 "2019-07-19T07:18:33Z")
A test? this 1 week should be enough for them to see it is not working and call it a day before they lose more money and the game sees a further drop of players. From marketing stand point, this is the worst I have seen CCP do ever and I have been in EVE since 2006… ---
**Author:** ![Ikki\_Phoenix](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ikki_phoenix/32/391105_2.png) [@Ikki\_Phoenix](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ikki_Phoenix)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:20am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/116 "2019-07-19T07:20:35Z")
Stage 4 wont bring anything but a full on dead null sec system. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/117 "2019-07-19T07:23:03Z")
So either way, its a win? Good to know ---
**Author:** ![SPAECMARNIES](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/spaecmarnies/32/280901_2.png) [@SPAECMARNIES](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/SPAECMARNIES)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/118 "2019-07-19T07:30:56Z")
So, as a nullsec citizen, I’ll share my observations: - Ratting in subcaps is basically dead. Not sure if this is because the idiotic one-shotting drifter invasion, or because subcaps can’t deal with random drops. - Ratting in supercaps is fine, especially in nullsec alliances with safe cynos and supercap umbrella. Not a lot of succesful drops from roamers happen. - Roaming fleets blow chunks, you spend a lot of time investigating systems with even less of a payout or chance at fights. Fleets are boring and annoying now. So all in all, change bad for new people, those with plenty isk can act like nothing changed, and pvp is even harder to get by. None of this surprises me. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/119 "2019-07-19T07:31:15Z")
Yes, a test. They’re gathering data. The entire point here is that “we’ll be monitoring what effect this has on the cluster”. As for ‘1 week should be enough’… right now we’re 1k below this point last week (Before the Blackout went into effect). We started the week with 3 days of solid ‘down 2-3k’, and yesterday actually hit the #s from the past 2 Thursdays. However, as a _general_ rule: 1. You cannot compare day-to-day numbers, ie: Monday-Tuesday, because player usage patterns vary by day. As a result, you have to compare Mondays to Mondays, etc. 2. The first full set of the data after the Blackout goes into effect has to be considered suspect—the system is, at that point, still potentially in shock from the change, and has not settled yet. 3. With that in mind, you begin looking for meaningful data in the second week, but need _at least_ two data points that can then be compared to two pre-Blackout data points, in order to look for differences in trends (ie: how are the numbers changing from pre-Blackout to in-Blackout, and how are they changing week-to-week? Is the week-to-week change different from the pre-Blackout week-to-week change?) 4. CCP isn’t just looking for PCU count here. They’re looking for _what the people online are doing_. Example: if there’s a spike in kills, is that spike in kills reflecting the same number of hunters catching more prey because of the blackout, or is it representing _fewer_ prey, and more hunters running into _each other_ as they search farther afield? There’s a whole lot of data they need, and collecting that data means they need to get the system to settle into the in-Blackout equilibrium it’s moving toward. You’re looking at a _minimum_ of 3 weeks to get meaningful data, and if you want CCP to actually be able to fix _anything_ in EVE, you need to be patient with this process and let them get the data they need. 70% of players never leave highsec. Jin’taan was specifically authorized by Guard to release that data point earlier this year. That means that if this _completely_ craters nullsec, CCP still has _at least_ 70% of their players, plus anyone in lowsec or anyone who just moved out of null but kept playing. Do not for one moment think that what you are seeing right now is a _bad_ thing. The ‘bad’ thing going on is players reacting like the sky is falling after 1 freaking week in the historical low-activity window of summer. This is when this does the _least_ damage: people were already going and having a _life_. Just like every year. ---
**Author:** ![SPAECMARNIES](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/spaecmarnies/32/280901_2.png) [@SPAECMARNIES](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/SPAECMARNIES)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/120 "2019-07-19T07:32:05Z")
It doesn’t help that the numbers are muddled with the SP payout nonsense and other encouragements to log on. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/121 "2019-07-19T07:33:30Z")
Don’t be silly. _We_ only have PCU. _They_ have ‘how long did they login?’. You don’t even need to select a character to claim the SP from this part of the event. So anyone who wasn’t going to login anyway should be spending no more than 30 seconds at login screen, and then disconnect. ---
**Author:** ![Emmy\_Chelien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emmy_chelien/32/354594_2.png) [@Emmy\_Chelien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emmy_Chelien)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/122 "2019-07-19T07:39:29Z")
The Demiurge is what I call Hilmar now ---
**Author:** ![Sylvia\_Kildare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sylvia_kildare/32/416948_2.png) [@Sylvia\_Kildare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sylvia_Kildare)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/123 "2019-07-19T07:44:47Z")
Oh, lol. You said Miner IIs, and that IS literally the name of the venture/prospect/endurance module, yanno, so yeah… that was amusing. But yeah, already using those in my Orca. Well, in HS. Elsewhere, I’m using Augmenteds. Anyway… sure, tech 2 and/or augmented ore and/or ice mining drones are great, and… one of those Rorq pilots I know was using t2s before he had built/imported the excavators, and was adding 1 excavator at a time… but they kinda pale in comparison to the full might of 5 excavators with icore2, no? But if you want to Rorq without engaging your icore, I guess that could be an option. ---
**Author:** ![Ikki\_Phoenix](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ikki_phoenix/32/391105_2.png) [@Ikki\_Phoenix](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ikki_Phoenix)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2019, 7:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410/124 "2019-07-19T07:46:27Z")
We will have to agree to disagree. 1 week of this should be plenty for CCP to reverse course and recognize they have made a mistake. CCP does not need 3 weeks to get any data. They should be just happy to get 1 week of this and if they are crazy enough to even think beyond 3 weeks, then I guarantee they will be losing money and subscribers at a rate not seen before. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410.md?page=5) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/local-comms-blackout-discussion-thread-part-deux/176410.md?page=7)