# Making Low-Sec Gate-Camping A Concord-able Offence **URL:** \ **Category:** Player Features & Ideas\ **Created:** [July 9, 2019, 10:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694 "2019-07-09T22:50:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Daoden](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daoden/32/271841_2.png) [@Daoden](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daoden)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/21 "2019-07-10T00:23:36Z")
What about camping data and relic sites. Is that not “real” PvP either? Half of the types of PvP in this game are either camping. ---
**Author:** ![Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirk_fjordkreath/32/147181_2.png) [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirk_Fjordkreath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/22 "2019-07-10T00:26:26Z")
> [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > > [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > > > The determination of whether someone is botting is for CCP to look into and should be decided on an individual basis. > > I feel like then, the correct course of action is to report the players that you believe are botting. > > The incorrect course of action is to demand that certain aspects of the game, like gatecamping, be changed because you _think_ that someone might be botting. > > The reason I’m trying to get you to specifically clarify your position is to make sure that we don’t accidentally remove a certain style of gameplay (gatecamping) because you are concerned with something unrelated (botting), because that may impact other aspects of the game unintentionally. I completely agree with you on that, being that I don’t want it to be completely impossible, but I think it should be severely punished in Low-Sec seeing as though Null-sec gate camps are no-holds-barred. 60% of all systems in EVE are Null-Sec, that’s plenty room for gate camps to flourish. ---
**Author:** ![Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirk_fjordkreath/32/147181_2.png) [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirk_Fjordkreath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/23 "2019-07-10T00:29:28Z")
> [@Daoden](#): > > What about camping data and relic sites. Is that not “real” PvP either? Half of the types of PvP in this game are either camping. I didn’t specifically mention this stuff but I think it would fall under the combat site hunting and ratting example I gave above, being that said pray of camp chose not only to commute through Low-Sec, but decided to roll-the-dice so to speak ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/24 "2019-07-10T00:34:28Z")
> [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > The reason I’m trying to get you to specifically clarify your position Basically some carebears are realizing the profits to be made in LS and want in…but with no risk of course. Just add it to the list… No ganking No bumping No unwanted PVP No gatecamping ---
**Author:** ![Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirk_fjordkreath/32/147181_2.png) [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirk_Fjordkreath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/25 "2019-07-10T00:46:32Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > > [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > > > The reason I’m trying to get you to specifically clarify your position > > Basically some carebears are realizing the profits to be made in LS and want in…but with no risk of course. > > Just add it to the list… > No ganking > No bumping > No unwanted PVP > No gatecamping Ah, I understand, Topic Title is a bit extreme. To me it just seems that the “response” to aggression in Low-Sec is just a little pathetic, seeing as NPC stations and gates are the only places that are “protected”, its laughable. Not sure what you mean by no ganking (other than Gate-Camps) but like I said above Low-sec is usually peoples first experience with PVP(as it should be), the game is even formatted to try and facilitate that. Its very unfortunate that it’s usually a powerless one. ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/26 "2019-07-10T00:56:23Z")
> [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > Its very unfortunate that it’s usually a powerless one. …because they don’t know what they are doing, haven’t fitted correctly or done any intel work. Gate guns deter any casual shenanigans but are useless against a knowledgeable and prepared opponent…as it should be. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/27 "2019-07-10T00:57:48Z")
> [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > being that I don’t want it to be completely impossible, but I think it should be severely punished in Low-Sec I’m a bit lost. You’re saying we should be punishing non-“real” PvP more severely because it can be done by bots? ---
**Author:** ![Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirk_fjordkreath/32/147181_2.png) [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirk_Fjordkreath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/28 "2019-07-10T01:08:21Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > > [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > > > Its very unfortunate that it’s usually a powerless one. > > …because they don’t know what they are doing, haven’t fitted correctly or done any intel work. Gate guns deter any casual shenanigans but are useless against a knowledgeable and prepared opponent…as it should be. Again I don’t think it should be impossible, but that sort of well put together gate camp should surely survive Null, where it would be more suitable. Think of it this way, those carebears you mentioned earlier don’t want any risk, so by giving them shipping lanes they might just get ballsey enough to try going into (not just through) Low-Sec, giving you all the chances for war decs on Low sec citadels, bumping out of NPC stations and player stations, belt ganks, the works. They would also be off the beaten path making clean up easier. ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/29 "2019-07-10T01:14:59Z")
But in LS, that person(people) are apex predictors. Every environment has them and NS is no different. > [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > so by giving them shipping lanes So basically, they don’t need to learn the game, do recon, fit correctly or gain allies…just hit the big old easy button. And how is it “ballsey” if they know they are 100% safe to enter? Also, the clean-up is already being done by people not afraid to enter LS…carebears should not feel entitled to the same content/riches if they are unwilling to learn and apply a little effort. ---
**Author:** ![Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirk_fjordkreath/32/147181_2.png) [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirk_Fjordkreath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/30 "2019-07-10T01:23:00Z")
> [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > > [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > > > being that I don’t want it to be completely impossible, but I think it should be severely punished in Low-Sec > > I’m a bit lost. > You’re saying we should be punishing non-“real” PvP more severely because it can be done by bots? No, the botting is just something that is not just a concern for balance and, if I’m not mistaken UELA following, but also that people cant compete with computers unless…(PVE). Again, the fact players are killed in Low-Sec isn’t an issue (to me), what is, is that it is virtually un-counterable. If they introduced a new skill that needed Astrometric Pinpointing V(5) that allowed you to combat probe scan bordering systems then maybe it would be counterable. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/31 "2019-07-10T01:25:10Z")
> [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > Again, the fact players are killed in Low-Sec isn’t an issue (to me), what is, is that it is virtually un-counterable. I’m still lost, then are you saying that this is changing your definition of “real” pvp? That if it’s something that’s (virtually) un-counterable, it’s also not “real” pvp? ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/32 "2019-07-10T01:26:13Z")
> [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > is that it is virtually un-counterable This is wrong…I go in and out of LS all the time without issue and there are a half dozen reasons for that…please stop trying to frame the argument in absolutes. Everyone sees what you are doing and it just discredits ALL your arguments… ---
**Author:** ![Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirk_fjordkreath/32/147181_2.png) [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirk_Fjordkreath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/33 "2019-07-10T01:30:20Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > But in LS, that person(people) are apex predictors. Every environment has them and NS is no different. > > > [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > > > so by giving them shipping lanes > > So basically, they don’t need to learn the game, do recon, fit correctly or gain allies…just hit the big old easy button. And how is it “ballsey” if they know they are 100% safe to enter? > > Also, the clean-up is already being done by people not afraid to enter LS…carebears should not feel entitled to the same content/riches if they are unwilling to learn and apply a little effort. I don’t quite understand that first bit. The problem with recon is that either you give CCP one more sub and become a Multi-boxer, or someone (maybe said person themselves) has to become this weird sacrificial lamb, such content…(insert 2012 meme). They don’t get anything more than gratification from entering though, transit volume of players in Low-Sec shouldn’t affect you unless your income is generated from unfair, uncounterable, ambush tactics. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/34 "2019-07-10T01:31:16Z")
> [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > I don’t quite understand that first bit. > > The problem with recon is that either you give CCP one more sub and become a Multi-boxer, But you’re wrong. [https://eve-gatecheck.space/eve/](https://eve-gatecheck.space/eve/) Services exist that don’t require you to have more subs or become a multi-boxer. ---
**Author:** ![Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirk_fjordkreath/32/147181_2.png) [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirk_Fjordkreath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/35 "2019-07-10T01:33:38Z")
> [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > > [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > > > I don’t quite understand that first bit. > > > > The problem with recon is that either you give CCP one more sub and become a Multi-boxer, > > But you’re wrong. > > [EVE - Check before you jump!](https://eve-gatecheck.space/eve/) > > Services exist that don’t require you to have more subs or become a multi-boxer. This is a third party service, correct? ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/36 "2019-07-10T01:35:59Z")
> [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > give CCP one more sub and become a Multi-boxer I just use Alphas, zKB and the real-time map…really not an issue… > [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > unfair, uncounterable, ambush tactics They make profits because people are lazy, ignorant or careless…how is that unfair? BTW, ambush tactics is covered on day 1 of combat school so to claim unfair is, well, silly. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/37 "2019-07-10T01:36:41Z")
> [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > This is a third party service, correct? Yes, it is. ---
**Author:** ![Ciryc\_Lagrej](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ciryc_lagrej/32/375359_2.png) [@Ciryc\_Lagrej](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ciryc_Lagrej)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/38 "2019-07-10T01:37:46Z")
Gate camping is fine and is not an issue. Gate gun dps does hurt and helps the defender a decent amount IF THEY ACTUALLY FIGHT. Not to mention it makes smaller things trying to gate camp get blapped usually and so things trying to catch you on low usually lock slower. ---
**Author:** ![Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kirk_fjordkreath/32/147181_2.png) [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kirk_Fjordkreath)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/39 "2019-07-10T01:38:12Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > > [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > > > is that it is virtually un-counterable > > This is wrong…I go in and out of LS all the time without issue and there are a half dozen reasons for that…please stop trying to frame the argument in absolutes. Everyone sees what you are doing and it just discredits ALL your arguments… Reasons being, and I’m just guessing, that you’re part of a low sec based corp, possible back up, toll payments to gangkers. it would be nice to know those reasons, cause it kinda looks like you’re shitting down the convo… ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:40am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694/40 "2019-07-10T01:40:37Z")
> [@Kirk\_Fjordkreath](#): > > Reasons being, and I’m just guessing, that you’re part of a low sec based corp, possible back up, toll payments to gangkers. Maybe he just has more balls than you? [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/making-low-sec-gate-camping-a-concord-able-offence/173694.md?page=3)