# Militia corruption: Breaking the Deafening Silence on Dirty Deals **URL:** \ **Category:** Intergalactic Summit\ **Created:** [October 17, 2019, 4:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136 "2019-10-17T16:48:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 4:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/1 "2019-10-17T16:48:37Z")
The empire militias generally aren’t known for their quality overall. As a loyalist who’s served in the Amarr militia for over seven years straight at this point, I’ve seen everything from genocidal blooder human-adjacent monsters performing mass sacrifices of people to profiteers who switched sides from another militia not because of a change in heart, but because it became profitable to do so. It is henceforth without a shadow of a doubt not true that being in a militia makes you a loyalist, nor is it true that not being in a militia precludes you from being such. With that being said, for a time, I thought our militia was improving. The garbage that was TMOCC is virtually gone, and so there are no groups as _obviously_ corrupt left over. While I had no delusions about the current militia being a bastion of loyalty or even integrity, it seemed a far cry from the militia of old with groups like Fweddit and Death by Design among its ranks. My fleets were growing and the people coming were good, honest people. Unfortunately, it seems that I was in a bubble. Relatively like-minded people wanted to associate with me, but what I wasn’t seeing was another incarnation of a wicked, corrupt militia. ![Hqm9GhixUVHFnmn1tkST3mEZmOm15V6dI7VJOF54jGY](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/6/2/628b3816a9d9b082b8a25f6d5d0e088f804a6fc6.jpeg) This is a bloodthirsty militia willing to cede systems for a chance to have _slightly_ better fights. This is a militia that ultimately cares not about the goals of Amarr, but about putting killmarks on the sides of their ships. I too enjoy combat, but I don’t _like_ that I do and I won’t do what I view as _wrong_ in order to get more of it. If there is any solace I can take away from this, it’s that ours is not the only corrupt militia. But on the other side of that coin, it’s almost _more_ disappointing that Ushra’Khan signed onto the deal than it is that some known privateer groups on our side did. But I guess that’s not my house to clean. PIE was approached in reference to the agreement. Aldrith and I were spoken to about it, and outright rejected any notion of participating, and I made it a point to fight in Arzad during my patrols. Nobody’s been talking about this here, so I’m starting to, and I think this deal is _trash._ ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/2 "2019-10-17T17:11:30Z")
As a newcomer to the militia I can neither validate or dispute your opinion upon its past, but in lieu of a bubble of my own I have perhaps had more direct interaction with the parties involved in this document. You speak adequately to their motivation, though it is worth noting that the relative few in the crusade who sought to defend the stipulated systems; Arzad in particular, were able to blunt the Ushra’Khan offensive there. This successful defense revealed a greater commitment to the treaty than I expected, as the signatories within the crusade began to cooperate with subsequent minmatar offensives, either castigating or firing on allied militia as they deemed necessary. These combined fleets succeeded in what I presume was the intent of making intervention distasteful for loyalists, and were far more rapidly successful than Ushra’Khan’s earlier attempts. ---
**Author:** ![Aldrith\_Shutaq](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aldrith_shutaq/32/378618_2.png) [@Aldrith\_Shutaq](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aldrith_Shutaq)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/3 "2019-10-17T17:12:48Z")
While I agree with the core protest against war profiteering, the methods are absolutely unacceptable. Consciously failing to defend the sytems in which our people live, exposing them to attack by the enemy, is treason and morally reprehensible. ---
**Author:** ![Ange\_des\_Larmes](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ange_des_larmes/32/304752_2.png) [@Ange\_des\_Larmes](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ange_des_Larmes)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/4 "2019-10-17T17:14:27Z")
The deal isn’t good for the Amarr or Minmatar expansionists but it could bring about stability in the systems impacted for the everyday citizen. On a more pragmatic note, however, it is very good for business if you happened to have a contact who told you to buy republic fleet modules while they were cheap and to sell them off in December when they will have skyrocketed. I mean, I didn’t do that - that would have been immoral. But I could imagine plenty of members of the Angel Cartel, Serpentis and possibly even the Thukker would have been tipped off before now. ---
**Author:** ![Deitra\_Vess](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/deitra_vess/32/249726_2.png) [@Deitra\_Vess](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Deitra_Vess)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/5 "2019-10-17T17:17:01Z")
On the bright side, at least you know where your enemies won’t be. Ground has been taken and lost for years, both sides have held the warzone. Has that made any difference? Has that brought either side closer to the table? I hate to say it but the only thing that may have some effect is lives lost. Force more combat, create distain on both sides for litterally throwing lives away for nothing. That **may** bring things towards an end. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/6 "2019-10-17T17:19:06Z")
Naturally. And I’m assured that the the gain in value of the rewards available to the signatories is not a motivationary factor in this gambit. It’s solely principle. ---
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/7 "2019-10-17T17:23:11Z")
This deal isn’t about forcing peace and you know it. I don’t know exactly what it would take to force peace talks in the proxy wars, but an agreement to swap certain systems for a few months sure as hell isn’t it. ---
**Author:** ![Samira\_Kernher](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/samira_kernher/32/244840_2.png) [@Samira\_Kernher](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Samira_Kernher)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/8 "2019-10-17T17:25:36Z")
> [@Ange\_des\_Larmes](#): > > But I could imagine plenty of members of the Angel Cartel, Serpentis and possibly even the Thukker would have been tipped off before now. And most of the capsuleers in the militias, who change their loyalties whenever suitable to drive market prices up and down. ---
**Author:** ![Deitra\_Vess](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/deitra_vess/32/249726_2.png) [@Deitra\_Vess](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Deitra_Vess)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/9 "2019-10-17T17:34:54Z")
Oh, I know that. I also know it’s a slight possibility. Your not mad theres now a necessity to fight for a victory right? Holdings and civilian populations in a warzone? Why would you rebuild your home at the base of a volcano when you know it will inevitably erupt again? I don’t know what is significant about defending land that was cast out by your late empress. If they want change they should petition for a change, or pray or whatever your kin do for change or, rather should have at some point over the last few decade. Personally I find the arrangement an odd one, I also don’t understand why it’s a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/10 "2019-10-17T17:36:27Z")
> [@Deitra\_Vess](#): > > Why would you rebuild your home at the base of a volcano when you know it will inevitably erupt again? Because you’re not a rich, immortal capsuleer with the ability to move. Great blaming the victim. ---
**Author:** ![Deitra\_Vess](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/deitra_vess/32/249726_2.png) [@Deitra\_Vess](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Deitra_Vess)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/11 "2019-10-17T17:41:38Z")
Your empress never assisted evacuating a warzone? It’s been over a decade, if the empress never decreed some assistance program to support people in an area she herself condemned a warzone or the holders _with money_ never left a warzone, yes I am blaming the victim for not acting over the span of a decade. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/12 "2019-10-17T17:42:10Z")
> [@Deitra\_Vess](#): > > I also don’t understand why it’s a problem. There are a number of problems, not least that the document does not cover the full extent of what is being done. The profiteers are not only refusing to defend but participating in the offensives. Several people have speculated on why they are so committed, given they mostly reach the same conclusions. I don’t feel the need to rehash those possibilities. ---
**Author:** ![Deitra\_Vess](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/deitra_vess/32/249726_2.png) [@Deitra\_Vess](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Deitra_Vess)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/13 "2019-10-17T17:43:15Z")
That’s a point I fully agree with. I don’t know why they agreed, it’s not a document I’m bound to, nor would I follow. As such, if you chose not to follow it where’s the problem? ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/14 "2019-10-17T17:48:50Z")
The problem is my unwillingness to engage members of the crusade, I’ll return fire if I must. But I’d rather not even be doing that. ---
**Author:** ![Deitra\_Vess](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/deitra_vess/32/249726_2.png) [@Deitra\_Vess](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Deitra_Vess)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/15 "2019-10-17T17:50:13Z")
You don’t shoot traitors? Aligning with your enemy would be treason, shooting them is supporting your side, not harming it. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/16 "2019-10-17T17:51:41Z")
I’d sooner not attack the naive or ill-led. Their leadership’s profiteering is not necessarily theirs. ---
**Author:** ![Nomistrav](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nomistrav/32/278296_2.png) [@Nomistrav](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nomistrav)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/17 "2019-10-17T17:51:50Z")
I stand in utter shock that of all entities, Ushra’khan were the ones to sign this treaty. I knew of the treaty as soon as it was released and expressed my displeasure in it among my peers, but decided to keep silent in the hopes that may be _some_ good could come of it. I’m still waiting. I won’t speak for the Minmatar or how this affects the Republic. Such is not my place. However, I will speak generally when I say that it there is an incredible irony in that the same Ushra’khan that would place a 1 ISK bounty on Karin Midular, signifying her worth in their eyes over the handling of the Defiants and appeasing the Empire, would actively work with Empire “loyalists” for the sake of “better fights”. Perhaps there is a long-game - some strategy at play here that only Ushra’khan’s upper echelon is privy to, but one must give them the same respect given to Midular and look at the short-term; look at this coalition as it is stands today. Far be it to merely view the contrasting ideals of the greater goal of freeing slaves to hunting for greater joy in conflicts, it’s naive to expect that the war profiteers won’t simply _find another way_. Barred from accepting contracts on behalf of the two factions (who know full well who they are issuing these contracts to) the profiteers will simply move on to risk-averse capture and control of loosely patrolled systems. Loosely patrolled systems that both the Republic and the Empire are eager to dispense lucrative rewards for even _attempting_ to gain control of. This is not a new issue, either. It’s confounding. It’s utterly confounding that the one thing that brought the Amarr and the freedom fighters together was the hope of _more violence in the future._ I can’t stand by this at all. ---
**Author:** ![Samira\_Kernher](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/samira_kernher/32/244840_2.png) [@Samira\_Kernher](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Samira_Kernher)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/18 "2019-10-17T17:52:09Z")
> [@Deitra\_Vess](#): > > Your empress never assisted evacuating a warzone? Nor has the Republic. Neither side is going to spend the massive amounts of money and deal with the huge migrant influx that would entail completely depopulating the warzone. The area is large, there’s millions of people living there, there’s industrial interests, it’s not the kind of place you can just go ‘let’s evacuate everyone!’. It’s not like a city that you know is about to be bombed. And most places _aren’t_ shelled, unless they’re a military target. Most civilian settlements are pretty safe most of the time – not always, obviously, but, well… to use your example, many settlements still sit under active volcanos, and in hurricane areas. Yes, eruptions and huge storms happen sometimes, but unless it’s a daily occurrence, most people will rebuild and stay where they are. Obviously, a lot of people _have_ fled, there’s been a lot of refugee waves from the warzone, but plenty of people still live there. With regards to the deal, the militia organizations have major bases in the “deal systems,” it’s where their agents coordinate offensive operations against the enemy. So this deal is going to affect their ability to facilitate the war. ---
**Author:** ![Reginald\_Sakakibara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/reginald_sakakibara/32/270314_2.png) [@Reginald\_Sakakibara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Reginald_Sakakibara)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/19 "2019-10-17T17:55:07Z")
I have often spoken at length of the corruption within the 24th Imperial Crusade. I have been branded a “traitor” and a “pirate” by former allies because I took up arms against the Sani Sabik, Blood Raiders, and their sympathizers. I have publicly applauded Lord Arim Ardishapur for calling attention to how the ranks are polluted by such filth and now I do the same for you, Captain Elkin. Now that the Bleak Lands and Devoid are squarely within the Sarum Military Circuit, let us pray that Lord Arrach administers swift justice in the face of such blatant corruption. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 5:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/20 "2019-10-17T17:56:22Z")
> [@Nomistrav](#): > > Perhaps there is a long-game - some strategy at play here that only Ushra’khan’s upper echelon is privy to They’re not especially secretive, Harkon Thorson has stated on multiple occasions it was about ‘Starkman’, the second planet of the Arzad system, the place they failed to take as they lost all the Tribal Liberation Bases. Where their morale broke and they abdicated their offensives to Templar Dane and the Minmatar working with him. [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136.md?page=2)