# Militia corruption: Breaking the Deafening Silence on Dirty Deals **URL:** \ **Category:** Intergalactic Summit\ **Created:** [October 17, 2019, 4:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136 "2019-10-17T16:48:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 7:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/41 "2019-10-17T19:38:52Z")
Once again, they’re not trying to end the war. For somebody who has called me dishonest twice, it’s strange that you would imply they’re doing a damn thing to try for peace. They’re trying for more capsuleer on capsuleer fighting specifically. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 7:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/42 "2019-10-17T19:45:19Z")
> [@Rinai\_Vero](#): > > primary stated purpose of the participants themselves, which is to reduce the influence of so called “mission runners” on the warzone. Firstly, the influence of “mission runners” is monetary; they influence the price of militia rewards. Secondly as misinformation has been raised. In the weeks leading up to this document being made public, many of the signatories engaged in a Glamourex fueled surge in participation. They’re beneficiaries of the system they seek to lock down to the tune of tens of billions, only the most gullible would believe scarcity of reward and the commensurate increase in value is not a significant part of the motivation for this decision. I’m not going to engage with the notion it’s an honestly negotiated agreement, because it’s at best disingenuous but more likely simply exploitation of justified misgivings among good people about a broken system. Ending on my opinion, this treaty is to control the flow of the spoils of this war, increase the ‘quality’ of their combat, and gain recognition for… whatever this is. I couldn’t begin to guess which is the more important, I suppose that would depend which particular pilot’s priorities one is asking about. ---
**Author:** ![Rinai\_Vero](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rinai_vero/32/390870_2.png) [@Rinai\_Vero](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rinai_Vero)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 7:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/43 "2019-10-17T19:50:31Z")
No, they are clearly not trying to end the war… but neither are they trying to “purposefully lose” it as you stated. Even in war, there can be negotiated agreements to limit the terms of engagement. Such agreements often _are_ the building blocks of a later peace. In my time as a diplomat, I have negotiated with State Protectorate forces on numerous occasions to facilitate prisoner exchanges or to set up temporary cease fire agreements in order to engage pirates. Such agreements are far from uncommon. From where I’m standing, this agreement differs only in scope. It is an experiment, and a fair assessment should Identify both the positive and the negative motivations for it. I don’t disagree that part of the intended purpose of the agreement is to generate more killmarks, but it is not accurate to claim that there are no other purposes. ---
**Author:** ![Templar\_Dane](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/templar_dane/32/132921_2.png) [@Templar\_Dane](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Templar_Dane)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 7:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/44 "2019-10-17T19:52:16Z")
Some of us enjoy the endless war and glorious capsuleer combat. Besides, the systems ceded were originally captured by the militia pilots that spend all of their time in the warzone fighting in the plexes. Rather than debating politics from the safety of highsec and doing a weekly roam to _pretend_ we’re a part of the war effort, we started a blockade of the agent stations to hurt these nonparticipants. The nonparticipants _could_ still do their missions, but they _aren’t_, and they aren’t because the pay isn’t as good now. We get called “profiteers” after having spent months capturing systems day in day out. Profiteers are the ones doing missions for both sides and the ones defending the integrity of said mission runners. Before this deal there were no minmatar in space to fight. You want to make war on your enemy? Go to Arzad. BUT I warn all Amarr militia pilots that if you try to regain that system or any of the other systems with 24th Imperial Crusade stations we will destroy you. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 8:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/45 "2019-10-17T20:00:11Z")
> [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > debating politics from the safety of highsec That I elected not to fight you and those who follow you aside, your participation would not have been necessary had I stayed in hisec debating politics. > [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > I warn all Amarr militia pilots that if you try to regain that system or any of the other systems with 24th Imperial Crusade stations we will destroy you. That is the single point of any sincerity I’ve seen from you… well ever. While we have you in an honest mood could you tell us whether you’re a profiteer? You deflected but offered no rebuttal to that accusation. ---
**Author:** ![Samira\_Kernher](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/samira_kernher/32/244840_2.png) [@Samira\_Kernher](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Samira_Kernher)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 8:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/46 "2019-10-17T20:04:07Z")
> [@Rinai\_Vero](#): > > I speak with authority. I have roughly a decade of combat and leadership experience in this conflict. I know who is pulling their weight and who isn’t. Regardless of how any of us might feel about them, they are still fulfilling security contracts assigned to them _by_ official, authorized militia agents. They might not be contributing to the matter of system _occupation_, but they are still carrying out official combat assignments. But they _are_ playing the system, exploiting the war to line their own pockets. That much I’m not denying. The tides of the war, and the length it goes on, are certainly things that can be attributed to them. ---
**Author:** ![Rinai\_Vero](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rinai_vero/32/390870_2.png) [@Rinai\_Vero](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rinai_Vero)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 8:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/47 "2019-10-17T20:16:19Z")
> [@Samira\_Kernher](#): > > Regardless of how any of us might feel about them, they are still fulfilling security contracts assigned to them _by_ official, authorized militia agents. So? FDU bureaucrats have never liberated a system from the State Protectorate, and they never will. Why should I care if some botting war profiteer is helping a Militia agent keep his “official” metrics up? I have nothing against pilots who run missions to fund their personal wallets when they are doing it to keep themselves in the fight. Hell, GMVA has offered specific training on tactics, fitting, and logistics for LP conversion for years to help them do just that. But don’t expect me to mince words about the value I assign to those missions as “combat operations.” ---
**Author:** ![Templar\_Dane](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/templar_dane/32/132921_2.png) [@Templar\_Dane](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Templar_Dane)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 8:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/48 "2019-10-17T20:22:17Z")
Don’t forget about the ones directly funding pirate organizations who are currently a bigger threat to us than both enemy mlitias combined. ---
**Author:** ![Nomistrav](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nomistrav/32/278296_2.png) [@Nomistrav](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nomistrav)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 8:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/49 "2019-10-17T20:24:10Z")
I suppose my attempts to understand the supportive view here were not provocative enough to not be overshadowed by the more aggressive rhetoric so I’ll remain firmly in the belief that this treaty is a slow lesson in futility and leave it at that. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 8:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/50 "2019-10-17T20:30:50Z")
Pretty hypocritical to talk about the threat of pirates with your structures hidden behind siege green. ---
**Author:** ![Templar\_Dane](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/templar_dane/32/132921_2.png) [@Templar\_Dane](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Templar_Dane)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 8:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/51 "2019-10-17T20:39:11Z")
And you dock in pirate-controlled citadels. At least we have our own structures. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 8:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/52 "2019-10-17T20:42:17Z")
If they have the good grace to place a freeport in memory of Arkon Ardishapur, I’m content to make use of that convenience. ---
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 9:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/53 "2019-10-17T21:21:33Z")
> [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > Some of us enjoy the endless war and glorious capsuleer combat I admitted to enjoying combat. I’m not _proud_ that I enjoy it, but I do. But once again, I’m not however willing to compromise my morals to get more of it. > [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > Rather than debating politics from the safety of highsec I prefer low sec, honestly, but the funny thing is that the Empire has high security systems that _also_ have urgent issues to attend to. I’d rather be doing what’s _fun_, but I’ve all sorts of duties. If you paid attention to the politics, you might actually know what was going on in the cluster. > [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > and doing a weekly roam to _pretend_ we’re a part of the war effort Actually, two are run weekly, but the second is on a slower weeknight and focuses on new pilot development, but that’s besides the point. > [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > we started a blockade of the agent stations to hurt these nonparticipants. They’re not “nonparticipants.” They’re doing work literally assigned to them by the crusade. Many of them are dirtbags with awful motives, but that’s once again besides the point. > [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > Before this deal there were no minmatar in space to fight. That’s a _good_ thing. The fact that you list this as a negative shows you only care about the capsuleer on capsuleer combat, thus proving my point. > [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > Profiteers are the ones doing missions for both sides That’s _true_, but making it less likely that the Crusade gets the work it needs to be done, done only pushes them to find another way to be dirtbag profiteers… and I say all this as somebody who has never done a mission from the Crusade. > [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > I warn all Amarr militia pilots that if you try to regain that system or any of the other systems with 24th Imperial Crusade stations we will destroy you. Good to know. You should probably do some self reflection as to why you do the things you do. If you care about the Empire… Where were you in Thebeka? Where were you during the attack of Blooder capital ships in the Mandate? How much work within the Empire’s borders have you put in against the invading Triglavs? How many Drifters did you kill after the assassination of Empress Jamyl? How many Blooder Forward Operating bases did you take down? What have you done in our borders against Blooders in general? Sansha? Cartel? Other various rogue groups? What are your opinions on the newest wave of Theology Council appointments? What do you think of how we acquired Zashev? Do you know who he is? I realize the value in helping the Empire in one specific way, specializing yourself, in effect… But don’t begin to accuse anyone of _pretending_ anything if you need to run a Galnet search about any of these things. ---
**Author:** ![Gaven\_Lok\_ri](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gaven_lok_ri/32/293159_2.png) [@Gaven\_Lok\_ri](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gaven_Lok_ri)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 10:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/54 "2019-10-17T22:41:04Z")
> [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > I warn all Amarr militia pilots that if you try to regain that system or any of the other systems with 24th Imperial Crusade stations we will destroy you. This deal was problematic enough when it was just looking the other way and allowing stations to be captured by the enemy. Actively aiding the enemy and aggressively attacking loyal Amarr militia doing their jobs is significantly worse. ---
**Author:** ![Templar\_Dane](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/templar_dane/32/132921_2.png) [@Templar\_Dane](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Templar_Dane)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 10:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/55 "2019-10-17T22:47:56Z")
Militia mission agents are a militia matter. The highsec events are unrelated. Besides, those of us that are exclusive to lowsec (where any and all militia matters are located) are outlaws that can’t enter highsec. I have been in lowsec fighting the minmatar since the militias were formed. I didn’t just give my support by hitting the join button and then spending my days in highsec criticizing the actions of the ones that live in lowsec. I doubt there’s a soul in this militia that has spent more hours in the trenches than me. I’ve watched not just this militia, but the entire theater, waste away to a shadow of what it once was. The status quo must change and nobody else stepped up. We will continue to do what we are doing, prosecuting our war against the mission runners, and we will fight **anyone** that gets in our way. ---
**Author:** ![Templar\_Dane](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/templar_dane/32/132921_2.png) [@Templar\_Dane](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Templar_Dane)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 10:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/56 "2019-10-17T22:53:30Z")
The blockade doesn’t work if the minmatar keep losing their target systems. After the deal was brokered they made less than zero progress, so we used minmatar slaves to capture the plexes for them. Amarr pilots were warned multiple times not to interfere with the slaves’ work, those who didn’t listen were executed. ---
**Author:** ![Saronu\_Yassavi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saronu_yassavi/32/386208_2.png) [@Saronu\_Yassavi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saronu_Yassavi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 10:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/57 "2019-10-17T22:55:35Z")
I don’t dispute your efficacy in prosecuting occupancy campaigns, as attested to by your success in doing so for the enemy. My issue is more with the myopia in thinking fewer mission runners change anything, you again however seized upon a valid point in suggesting the theater is the problem. You fight without clear objectives in ‘endless war and glorious capsuleer combat’, with no objective there is no incentive to take risk and you end up with one sided massacres only when people are caught flatfooted. If your ‘war against the mission runners’ has any clearer goal than the glorious combat I can’t see it. ---
**Author:** ![Arsia\_Elkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arsia_elkin/32/388703_2.png) [@Arsia\_Elkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arsia_Elkin)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 10:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/59 "2019-10-17T22:58:37Z")
> [@Templar\_Dane](#): > > I’ve watched not just this militia, but the entire theater, waste away to a shadow of what it once was. The status quo must change and nobody else stepped up. What does a healthy militia look like to you? What is, in your mind the ultimate goal of the militia conflict? What does your “blockade” against our own forces do to achieve this end? ---
**Author:** ![Gaven\_Lok\_ri](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gaven_lok_ri/32/293159_2.png) [@Gaven\_Lok\_ri](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gaven_Lok_ri)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 11:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/60 "2019-10-17T23:01:47Z")
Your actions aren’t hurting the people running missions, you are hurting the people fighting for system control. You will never maintain this travesty long enough to matter for your stated objectives. And, more importantly, in the meantime you are giving Matari space superiority in several significant systems. Arzad is a powerful symbol for the Rebellion that you chose to actively work to lose. It is utterly unacceptable. Also, warnings aren’t being issued with any consistency. I was personally attacked by DnG without any warning. ---
**Author:** ![Diana\_Kim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/diana_kim/32/382972_2.png) [@Diana\_Kim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Diana_Kim)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2019, 2:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136/61 "2019-10-18T02:33:26Z")
> [@Arsia\_Elkin](#): > > Nobody’s been talking about this here, so I’m starting to, and I think this deal is _trash._ Any sort of deal with the enemy is TRASH. Anyone who deals with the enemy is TRASH. Any separate peace treaties with enemies of Empire and the State is TRASH! As long as our nations have to protect themselves from aggression of foreign invaders, coming like blight from Federation and Republic, those who want to deal with them is a weakling, a spineless coward and, yes, TRASH. Only our respective Empires have authorities to sing any peace treaties with enemies. Those who participate in such farce don’t deserve Honor to wear Imperial sigils or State badges! This deal is VOID. And those who will abide to it is TRASH as well. Glory to the State! And death to traitors! [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/militia-corruption-breaking-the-deafening-silence-on-dirty-deals/196136.md?page=4)