# My contribution to the "Highsec Lobby" initiative **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Created:** [February 12, 2020, 7:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219 "2020-02-12T07:46:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 1:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/490 "2020-02-20T13:19:37Z")
Is that a CODE ship? Doesn’t really look like one… ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 1:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/491 "2020-02-20T13:23:20Z")
Was that blown up in Amarr? ---
**Author:** ![Ugren\_Okaski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ugren_okaski/32/181459_2.png) [@Ugren\_Okaski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ugren_Okaski)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/492 "2020-02-20T14:12:15Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > it has no relevance to the Procurer BPO purchased in hisec You know, you can actually leave highsec… There is no wall that forbids travelling back and forth. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/493 "2020-02-20T14:37:28Z")
> [@Ugren\_Okaski](#): > > You know, you can actually leave highsec… There is no wall that forbids travelling back and forth. I must have done that to get those Titan and Super kills, damn I did not know, that is super scary, I need to sit down and find a safe space quick. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/494 "2020-02-20T14:49:13Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > new character doesn’t directly equate to new player, though it’s the best approach we have for measuring “newb” state in the game. Not at all. We can use common sense, and talk to miners, and realize that most of them are AFK mining while they do something else. They aren’t new at all, they are just AFK. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/495 "2020-02-20T14:49:50Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > those Titan and Super kills, You didn’t get any. Whoring on a kill is not the same as getting a kill. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/496 "2020-02-20T14:52:29Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > You didn’t get any. Whoring on a kill is not the same as getting a kill. There is no CONCORD in nullsec. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/497 "2020-02-20T14:52:34Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > The only way for the above statement to be correct would be that Aiko had contacted nearly all of her venture victims How do you think mining permits are sold? ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/498 "2020-02-20T14:56:10Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > There is no CONCORD in nullsec. Yah, that’s why we refer to nullsec as the tutorial zone. Ganking is elite PvP, because you have to kill the ship before CONCORD can kill you. Right? ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/499 "2020-02-20T14:56:51Z")
So you have been seduced by the fun of CONCORD racing, way to go Aiko! Though technically speak every gank is CONCORD racing… ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 2:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/500 "2020-02-20T14:57:38Z")
I’m just not seduced by the thought of flying around in a blob of ships and doing 0.1 damage to a titan, and then spending YEARS bragging on the forums about the time I killed a titan. 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 3:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/501 "2020-02-20T15:00:50Z")
Bragging, I just said that I had an objective to get on a Titan kill, if that is bragging then you are need of some serious help. Mentioning it above in such a jokey fashion was more to point out that those ships are not in hisec, and if you see that as boasting in any way then I have to wonder. Speaking of wondering, Uncle Paulie is one of your toons is he not? He went AFK on a citadel allowing an easy bump and destroy, was a fun kill that. I mention that only because you have a thing about gong AFK, were you watching Netflix by any chance in between the thrill of ganks? ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 4:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/502 "2020-02-20T16:03:03Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > I was in a devoter, how the hell am I supposed to stop a gank by multiple Talos’s? And none of them were low security status either. So I guess thats a No? Also, choose a better ship maybe? > [@Dracvlad](#): > > Dream on… I think youre confused. Im not the one trying to stop ganks, you are. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 4:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/503 "2020-02-20T16:08:12Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > I just said that I had an objective to get on a Titan kill I also have an objective to do some completely meaningless thing that I will proceed to mention repeatedly over the years. 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 4:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/504 "2020-02-20T16:13:10Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > So I guess thats a No? Not really, if you look at it from a strategic point of view and morale. > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > Also, choose a better ship maybe? Perfect ship, was very effective. > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > I think youre confused. Im not the one trying to stop ganks, you are. Well I did, because they were a bit down after that. Do keep up… > [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > I also have an objective to do some completely meaningless thing that I will proceed to mention repeatedly over the years. 🙄 You are the one who keeps mentioning it. It is only two Titans, I am sure Solonius has many more than me on his main Goon character… ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 5:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/505 "2020-02-20T17:20:39Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Lol, then you’re deluded. If you think one anecdote is proof then it’s impossible to have a reasonabel and rational discussion with you. You were replying to Meril riskin, or whatever her name is, when she said that New players used to congregate together to create new corps. Your reply was that They do now, but back then, they didnt. If your claim is that they didnt, then yes, one example that they did, disproves your claim. If youd like to be more precise with your words, feel free to correct yourself. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > 🤣 🤣 🤣 Rubbish. You’re a relative newbie. EVE is pretty much being kept afloat by the existence of long-term veterans too invested in the game too leave. People like you are actually the problem because you’re opposed to any change that CCP could use to bring in different types of players, and they’ve pretty much exhausted the pool that fits the existing niche. So Im a relative newbie, but at the same time, im the problem because im also a bittervet? Okay kid. And no, dont assume what i am or am not against. I am not against Hisec having more content, as I do not see Nullsec as the endgame content. I was all for the nerfs to Rorquals despite using them myself because I knew how devastating they were to the economy. You dont even know half of the things that I am for, or against. Why dont you ask me before assuming what I know? > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Gamers have changed and most newer gamers don’t want the steep learning curve EVE has historically had. There’s only so much CCP hand do through revamping the NPE, so at some point they have to take a long hard look at the minority of players who entertain themselves by harassing newbies. None of what we said were even remotely having to do with harassing newbies. DJ Funkybacon was one of the first people to point this out on his EVE Radio show, and in the CSM Minutes. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Newbies are being targetted by veteran players at a significantly higher rate than most players will be. In what way? Ganking? Because, when we see the statistics on who is ganked on Zkillbaord, for example, the majority of ganks are not ventures and T1 frigates. Just today, the 20th, by looking at the Zkillboard, the ganked targets are a Proteus, Obelisk, Hulk, Orthrus, Praxis, Mackinaw, and Gila. The Gila and Praxis may be new players, but they are using T2 modules, so they are atleast omega. So in what other metric are new players being targetted more, and can you provide even partial evidence that this is true? > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Percentage wise they will have a lot invested though. If a new player creeping up on his first sub renewal suddenly loses 90% of his stuff, that’s unlikely to make him sub. When I joined it was incredibly rare for a newbie to be hit that hard, but I can tell you now that if my first impression of the game is that each time I pay I potentially have to restart my progress from the ground up, I’d probably not be here. Any sane person would not continuously throw money at a game that effectively starts them over again whenever another player wills it, particularly when there’s so many zero subscription alternatives out there. Sure, anyone who loses 90% of their stuff, irrespective of being a new player or veteran, will be more likely to consider unsubbing, or even unsub, than someone who doesnt. I think that pain transcends whether you are new or not. But percentage is meaningless without timeframe. 100% of 10 minutes, and 20% of a year, arent even comparable in terms of time spent. And someone who loses 90% of his assets while playing for 2 years, is going to lose more, both in effort and in time, than someone who loses 90% of his assets while playing for 2 months. Compound this with the fact that most new players arent going to be flying around in expensive ships, and that everything about killing the more expensive, higher cost ship over the cheaper, smaller ship, is necessarily better, in all instances, and you end up with richer, older players being targetted over younger, poorer ones. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Then you’re a disturbed individual that needs psychological help. Did I say that I wanted to hear players get upset? I merely said that I agree with you, that some people want to hear players get upset. You do understand the difference between “There are some people who are sociopaths” and “i am a sociopath”, right? That those two sentences say different things? > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Not really. If you’re an experienced enough player you can do some pretty heavy damage with an alpha. The reply that I gave, isnt “Alphas deals zero damage”, it was “newly created characters/players are easier to deal with with regards to AWOX than an older, more established characters.”. And you essentially agree with that, by stating that “you can do some pretty heavy damage with an Alpha”, instead of saying “No, Alphas deal heavier damage than year old Omega accounts”. So yes, really. My statement was correct. Maybe next time, instead of saying “Not really”, you should say “Sure”, if you agree with the comment you are replying to. You can add a “But” or something to add more to your thoughts, but you are dead wrong when you say “Not really”, then go on to agree with what I said. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Yep, and most of them were bad corps run by bad and inexperienced players or scam corps looking actively to awox new players. At least now there are legitimately decent corps in the mix because those decent corps no longer have to worry about a new character being an alt, because it’s irrelevant whether they are or not. What? You do realize that the corps that we were always recommending new players go to, always had open recruitment processes where they essentially accepted any and all players? Like EVE university, RVB, Brave newbies, etc? No one was recommending new players apply to Black Legion or PIRAT. New players still cant get into those corporations easily, even without AWOXing, because they require experience and the ability to fly certain ships. The good corporations that we had always recommended to new players, even before the Awoxing nerf, accepted any and all new players. Thats a part of what made them good. They knew how to deal with players, and taught them how to survive in EVE, including providing free support. And at the same time, I knew quite a few of the FCs and higher ups of EVE Uni. Do you know how many times I ever heard of anyone getting Awoxed? Once. And the player paid back the person he hit, because it was a mistake. Players didnt join EVE Uni in order to awox. It was never a problem for them, even though they had an open door policy. Take a good couple minutes, and think about why that is. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 5:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/506 "2020-02-20T17:23:26Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > Not really, if you look at it from a strategic point of view and morale. Yes, from a strategic point of view, letting the freighter die is better. And its also better from a Morale point of view, too. Wait, are we talking about the Gankers point of view, or AGs point of view? > [@Dracvlad](#): > > Perfect ship, was very effective. If it was perfect, it wouldve stopped the gank. > [@Dracvlad](#): > > Well I did, because they were a bit down after that. Do keep up… So down that they stopped ganking, completely, for ever. And then you woke up? ---
**Author:** ![Ugren\_Okaski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ugren_okaski/32/181459_2.png) [@Ugren\_Okaski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ugren_Okaski)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 5:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/507 "2020-02-20T17:27:21Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > If it was perfect, it wouldve stopped the gank. It is perfect for loot denial, of course. Loot denial is a profitable activity ans also indirectly deals damage to gankers. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 5:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/508 "2020-02-20T17:32:41Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > Yes, from a strategic point of view, letting the freighter die is better. And its also better from a Morale point of view, too. > > Wait, are we talking about the Gankers point of view, or AGs point of view? The Gankers lost out in a major way on that gank, they lost a lot of ISK on the ships they used and picked up no loot at all. That is the AG’s point of view. > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > If it was perfect, it wouldve stopped the gank. It was the perfect ship for my objective which was loot denial. > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > So down that they stopped ganking, completely, for ever. Don’t be ridiculous. > [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > And then you woke up? Yes, AG has woken up. Get used to it. > [@Ugren\_Okaski](#): > > It is perfect for loot denial, of course. Loot denial is a profitable activity ans also indirectly deals damage to gankers. Very much so, but not so bothered about the profitable, more like the damage to gankers in terms of no loot. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2020, 5:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219/509 "2020-02-20T17:48:38Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > they lost a lot of ISK on the ships they used and picked up no loot at all. Gankers don’t care about loot or isk. They only care about the gank. Antigankers will never succeed, because they don’t even understand what ganking is about. To quote Jason Kusion, “If I wanted isk, I’d just retrain all my accounts to fly rorquals… or even better, I could just buy some PLEX.” [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219.md?page=23) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/my-contribution-to-the-highsec-lobby-initiative/219219.md?page=25)