# Nerf Ganking Megathread **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Created:** [March 7, 2021, 2:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004 "2021-03-07T02:12:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 306
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 11:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6238 "2022-08-18T11:34:38Z")
So much for wanting to have a conversation. If you dont actually have an answer, you should learn to be graceful in retreat. I notice also you had no answer to the loss of income from successfully completed “bait” contracts. ---
**Author:** ![Jesse\_W\_James](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jesse_w_james/32/316227_2.png) [@Jesse\_W\_James](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jesse_W_James)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 11:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6239 "2022-08-18T11:37:49Z")
Repeating myself over and over and you say why why why like a 5-year-old isn’t a conversation I am sorry. If you really don’t know or can’t conceive an idea do let me know I will actually answer, but I feel like you are simply wasting my time here to be honest and doing it on purpose. > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > I notice also you had no answer to the loss of income from successfully completed “bait” contracts. Because it doesn’t matter, I think you are missing the much much bigger picture altogether. You are making statements like ships are going to go from 1B to 100M and that simply isn’t the case. JJ ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 11:40am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6240 "2022-08-18T11:40:42Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Repeating myself over and over But you werent. You were making a supposition and I was asking what led you to that supposition. If you cannot or will not answer it, then its not the fault of the person you are trying to convince. > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > You are making statements like ships are going to go from 1B to 100M Where on earth did you get that from? I made no such claim. > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Because it doesn’t matter Given the value on them and that they exist only because ganking is possible, they very much do matter. ---
**Author:** ![Geminus\_Duolphus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/geminus_duolphus/32/329938_2.png) [@Geminus\_Duolphus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Geminus_Duolphus)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 12:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6241 "2022-08-18T12:10:18Z")
I’m of the introverted persuasion. I’m not sure you speak for the majority there like introverts are somehow all of the same mind. I would put it to you that people don’t join the game because they feel like it’s a safe space where they can do their thing quietly. People join the game because something about eve captures their imagination and when they play they stay because they are enjoying it or leave because they aren’t. New players don’t leave because they were ganked or because high sec isn’t safe. If a new player dies it’s for one of two reasons. They wandered into low sec or they made themselves flash suspect without realising it, probably by looting cans or a wreck. They are not on a gankers radar. If they are in the game long enough to get on a gankers radar then they have got themselves into a mission boat of BC size and above or are in a barge. Meaning they have been in the game long enough to have spoken to people and to understand how ganking works. If they leave because they lost something at this point then they are probably clueless enough to have lost the same ship to a mistake in a mission or to shooting an authosian lancer than came into a belt and not understanding how they are different to a mission runner. As I explained the ganking destruction isn’t going to have a direct impact on the economic figures. It’s going to have spill on effects that are tough to predict throughout the game. Hauling for instance, one of the longest standing and best organisations in the game are the frogs. They are an institution that provides a service and clearly take pride in what they do. What happens when they are not needed? Anyone can run a jump freighter to where they need to go and shuttle the stuff into the safety of high sec. So by destroying the ganking playstyle you are putting the game at risk of losing the gankers who will have to decide if they want to find another niche in the game but you are also putting the frogs and their ilk at risk of dissapearing from the game. Do you really believe that the few people that might join the game just because you can convince them that high sec is safe will outweigh those two groups? So that is three groups we’ve identified in two posts that would be at risk if we made high sec somehow safe. You want a fourth how about the players that don’t enjoy ganking but just feel like making high sec safe is the final straw in turning the game into WoW in space? Already on the verge of feeling disenfranchised by the games decline you’ve hammered the nail in that coffin too? Are any of these things for sure? No they are speculative. Just as speculative as your high sec utopia. The point is EVE is a delicate and complex as the human body. Sure it can take a knock or two and keep running. Lose a limb and adapt. But equally speaking an apple could fall from a tree and strike it on the head revealing a hidden problem and suddenly it’s dead of an aneurism on the floor. This is why CCP are slow to introduce change, they’ve got something that works, any major change could improve it or make it unravel so they do so soberly and carefully and still often get it wrong when they do. If you are talking about making changes to the fundamentals of the game and it’s this easy to come up with ways that it could go wrong I have to question why anyone would be motivated to make those changes. You clearly have some strong ideas about how it would be better, but the passion with which you argue for them isn’t equal to the surety of the outcomes or the foundation upon which the ideas are built. I would be careful of what you wish for because you are like the early surgeons that are eager to open someone up and see how they work without having had a text book to teach them the rudiments of how that body works. It’s not like you have a cadaver of eve to practice on but if you get it wrong you sure will. ---
**Author:** ![Ax\_l\_Thorne](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ax_l_thorne/32/412835_2.png) [@Ax\_l\_Thorne](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ax_l_Thorne)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 12:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6242 "2022-08-18T12:35:40Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > which has been proven to kill games. Please cite source material. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 1:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6243 "2022-08-18T13:00:48Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Are you suggesting Ramona, stop trolling. You know JJ is right. A safe Highsec for everyone is the best possible game playing experience. Just imagine all the new players that CCP would get, everyone just happily mining and hauling in peace. ☮ ---
**Author:** ![Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/uriel_the_flame/32/490165_2.png) [@Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Uriel_the_Flame)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 1:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6244 "2022-08-18T13:23:51Z")
I wonder if stealing and deployable shooting will still be allowed or if only later will CCP succumb to the whiners and remove yellow safety as well. 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 2:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6245 "2022-08-18T14:27:01Z")
No, no, no. Uriel, stop trying to ruin JJ’s utopia. Green safeties. Happy miners. No PvP. ---
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 2:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6246 "2022-08-18T14:35:00Z")
[Aiko Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)Today is the anniversary of the day I (Aiko ) joined this community! Boo! I mean YAY happy Forum day! and No You are not my princess no more!. But serious now, it was fun while it lasted. ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 2:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6247 "2022-08-18T14:45:13Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > I do love the game and I want it to be successful For some reason, in your mind I am denied the possibility of holding that same exact underlying emotion. Despite coming to a different conclusion than you. > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > I don’t give you a lot of credit for anything, but I will give you a gold star for your hate on JJ Look, I get it. My tough, frank, candidly honest, and straightforward feedback delivered to you as a courtesy that others here do not give you, you do not recognize its value for what it is. It’s honest, it’s a useful signal for personal reflection _and growth_, it’s encouragement to better engage with the community, having a genuine presence here. You instead perceive and receive that feedback as a threat. To _your_ ideas. And therefore to _your_ sense of self. Because you’ve coupled the two, to no fault of anyone else but you. You then have a quick knee-jerk reaction, you don’t take a breath before responding, and you grant me absolutely nothing. Leading to insults, denials of my humanity, unemapthetic rhetoric, whatever you want to call it. I still don’t care about that, I still care about the forum community which is the only reason I bother responding to a poster who tries to single me out for as displeasureable abuse as possible. Let me save you the time and just refresh your memory and you can go back 2.5k posts to see how consistent I have been: if you don’t like what I have to say then _please join the community_ as a _genuine_ capsuleer with your main, post far less frequently in a manner that actually reflects anything than agenda-pushing demagoguery, or don’t post at all. Otherwise I look forward to the third time we have this exact conversation again. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 2:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6248 "2022-08-18T14:47:36Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Altara it is called sandbox gatekeeping. You want to limit me to what I can do in my sandbox and you want me to haul 1m cargo and you want me to do this long list of sh\*t no one wants to do. It is no longer a sandbox at that point. > > This in turn kills big games and it is what is happing to Eve Online. Ganking is a form of gatekeeping which has been proven to kill games. > > Is that good enough for you? Hell, no. It’s just yet more disingenuous waffle from you. I asked you for actual **evidence** of your claim that ’ numbers are going down due to ganking’… …_and it is very clear that you don’t have any_. And once again you speak with forked tongue, as the person trying to restrict what people can do is actually you. Do you have anything to offer _other_ than bovine excrement ? ---
**Author:** ![Ferdiad\_Silver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ferdiad_silver/32/331325_2.png) [@Ferdiad\_Silver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ferdiad_Silver)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6249 "2022-08-18T15:00:09Z")
I’m pro ganking but I don’t understand this obsession about wether people post on their main or not. This is my main, does that mean I’m somehow more credible or does the fact I’m terrible at pvp somehow disqualify me from conversation about the game? If you play and you have an opinion then you should be able to share it. Wether on your main or not. ---
**Author:** ![Ax\_l\_Thorne](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ax_l_thorne/32/412835_2.png) [@Ax\_l\_Thorne](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ax_l_Thorne)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6250 "2022-08-18T15:11:09Z")
> [@Altara\_Zemara](#): > > I asked you for actual **evidence** of your claim that ’ numbers are going down due to ganking’… It’s self evident evidence. Only low I.Q. People ask for source materials. He’s here for the _conversation_ One in which he completely fabricates evidence, uses that as the foundation of his argument and we are all _expected_ to just accept it. In the name of _conversation_ Because true conversationalists don’t utilize that icky logic and accountability. Ewwww. Gross… So, get on board Altara. J.J.s Utopia is here, and it’s going to stay, gosh darn it. ---
**Author:** ![Jesse\_W\_James](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jesse_w_james/32/316227_2.png) [@Jesse\_W\_James](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jesse_W_James)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6251 "2022-08-18T15:13:53Z")
> [@Geminus\_Duolphus](#): > > So by destroying the ganking playstyle you are putting the game at risk of losing the gankers who will have to decide if they want to find another niche in the game but you are also putting the frogs and their ilk at risk of dissapearing from the game. It doesn’t put the game at risk, stop drinking the kool-aid man. > [@Geminus\_Duolphus](#): > > Do you really believe that the few people that might join the game just because you can convince them that high sec is safe will outweigh those two groups? Yes thousands and thousands of new players don’t make it past the first few months, if you can capture even 25% of them, it would be a huge number for our game today. > [@Geminus\_Duolphus](#): > > So that is three groups we’ve identified in two posts that would be at risk if we made high sec somehow safe. I don’t see how they would be at risk. If I don’t like hauling I don’t like hauling, it isn’t about risk, it is about what I am willing to train to do, and some simply do not train to be a hauler. I don’t think that is a crazy thing, I think very normal. > [@Geminus\_Duolphus](#): > > You want a fourth how about the players that don’t enjoy ganking but just feel like making high sec safe is the final straw in turning the game into WoW in space? Already on the verge of feeling disenfranchised by the games decline you’ve hammered the nail in that coffin too? Are you talking about the antigank group? the group that get little if not nothing for their efforts. I am sure if they felt as you described they are quitting the game anyhow. To be honest and fair here in the conversation. > [@Geminus\_Duolphus](#): > > If you are talking about making changes to the fundamentals of the game and it’s this easy to come up with ways that it could go wrong I have to question why anyone would be motivated to make those changes. We need money, I know no one reads here unless it is AP cited with a link, but go to Google and look Eve’s revenue has shrunk for 3 quarters in a row, that is 9 months of a downhill slide. If you were running the business, would you be thinking, we just need to keep the pace nice and slow on the change. > [@Geminus\_Duolphus](#): > > I would be careful of what you wish for because you are like the early surgeons that are eager to open someone up and see how they work without having had a text book to teach them the rudiments of how that body works. It’s not like you have a cadaver of eve to practice on but if you get it wrong you sure will. And there are plenty of Dr. in this thread. It is very simple business, we need money which come from new player subing to the game. Cutting 1% of the game to get 20% easy decision. JJ ---
**Author:** ![Ax\_l\_Thorne](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ax_l_thorne/32/412835_2.png) [@Ax\_l\_Thorne](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ax_l_Thorne)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6252 "2022-08-18T15:15:08Z")
Oh look, he’s replying to his sock puppet too! ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6253 "2022-08-18T15:15:49Z")
> [@Ferdiad\_Silver](#): > > This is my main, does that mean I’m somehow more credible Yes. > [@Ferdiad\_Silver](#): > > does the fact I’m terrible at pvp somehow disqualify me from conversation about the game? No. > [@Ferdiad\_Silver](#): > > If you play and you have an opinion then you should be able to share it. Wether on your main or not. Yes, but the honesty of admitting one is posting on an alt does not somehow demand _for everyone else_ that they overcome and “eliminate” their paranoia about forum alt sock puppets and influence campaigns as has often happened in the history of this very game. It’s not about you. It’s about what you demand _of others_. ---
**Author:** ![Jesse\_W\_James](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jesse_w_james/32/316227_2.png) [@Jesse\_W\_James](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jesse_W_James)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6254 "2022-08-18T15:17:48Z")
> [@Ax\_l\_Thorne](#): > > Please cite source material. Literally, go to [Google.com](http://Google.com) and type in MMO gatekeeping and read until you are tired. I can’t hold your hand forever in life Ax, at some point you need to be a big boy and go to the internet and read. JJ ---
**Author:** ![Jesse\_W\_James](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jesse_w_james/32/316227_2.png) [@Jesse\_W\_James](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jesse_W_James)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6255 "2022-08-18T15:20:01Z")
@Aiko_Danuja how do you think you will adjust to low, where flying cheap ships gets you killed pretty quick? Are you going to Corp up and take some system in Null, or maybe run a WH? I would love to see gankers organize into something with meaning. JJ ---
**Author:** ![Ax\_l\_Thorne](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ax_l_thorne/32/412835_2.png) [@Ax\_l\_Thorne](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ax_l_Thorne)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6256 "2022-08-18T15:20:39Z")
I want to make sure I’m reading the same thing that you did. The only way that can happen is if you link what you read. That way we are on the same page and comparing apples to apples. ---
**Author:** ![Geminus\_Duolphus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/geminus_duolphus/32/329938_2.png) [@Geminus\_Duolphus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Geminus_Duolphus)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2022, 3:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004/6257 "2022-08-18T15:21:40Z")
Yeah you’re not making yourself sound terribly credible accusing everyone that occasionally disagrees with you of being a sock puppet. JJ is wrong about so very much in my opinion but atleast he doesn’t undermine himself by attacking my charachter. Even if he undermines himself my replying confidently with nothing more than opinion or responses that have nothing to do with the point I made. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004.md?page=305) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/nerf-ganking-megathread/299004.md?page=307)