# New players have no reason to Sub and keep playing **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [June 25, 2018, 6:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056 "2018-06-25T06:44:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Dark\_Engraver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_engraver/32/45178_2.png) [@Dark\_Engraver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Engraver)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/62 "2018-06-25T13:34:59Z")
But most CCP employees haven’t a clue about getting decent at the game let alone good It’s sad how development ended up in the hands of people too incompetent to fit a ship so they copy the idea off a public kill board ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/63 "2018-06-25T13:35:49Z")
What has that even to do with what I wrote? ---
**Author:** ![mimi45](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mimi45/32/77591_2.png) [@mimi45](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/mimi45)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/64 "2018-06-25T13:37:01Z")
> [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > They did not stop there. This is a different talk by CCP Quant: You are really believe everything ccp say ? 😂😂😂😂😂 ---
**Author:** ![mimi45](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mimi45/32/77591_2.png) [@mimi45](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/mimi45)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/65 "2018-06-25T13:39:32Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > The data is quite clear - for true new players in the first weeks in the game, being shot by other players isn’t a factor in why they don’t subscribe. Another naive fanboy. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Engraver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_engraver/32/45178_2.png) [@Dark\_Engraver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Engraver)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/66 "2018-06-25T13:39:50Z")
You’re using them to solidify your example ---
**Author:** ![mimi45](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mimi45/32/77591_2.png) [@mimi45](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/mimi45)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/67 "2018-06-25T13:41:21Z")
> [@Dark\_Engraver](#): > > It’s sad how development ended up in the hands of people too incompetent to fit a ship so they copy the idea off a public kill board Because all good developers left ccp, ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/68 "2018-06-25T13:42:52Z")
You still make no sense. I was talking about the people who analyse the data at CCP to make business decisions. What has that to do with playing the game? ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Engraver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_engraver/32/45178_2.png) [@Dark\_Engraver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Engraver)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/69 "2018-06-25T13:45:03Z")
And look where it got us today… A dying shity old game with an aged playerbase which it will never retain ---
**Author:** ![Petrus\_Blackshell](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/petrus_blackshell/32/76768_2.png) [@Petrus\_Blackshell](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Petrus_Blackshell)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/70 "2018-06-25T13:49:18Z")
There’s some pretty serious bad vibes in this thread. Why don’t you guys take a breather and look at this happy fox: ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/3/0/30f48e0c5288f6bcd38a31ee6718fba5b8816e4d.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Engraver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_engraver/32/45178_2.png) [@Dark\_Engraver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Engraver)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/71 "2018-06-25T13:51:39Z")
It doesn’t help me relax,the fox that is,should’ve picked a cat gif ---
**Author:** ![Petrus\_Blackshell](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/petrus_blackshell/32/76768_2.png) [@Petrus\_Blackshell](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Petrus_Blackshell)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/72 "2018-06-25T13:53:08Z")
![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/4/5/453d67d5e5856dc4f90ca4993d94d41131d3efb5.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/73 "2018-06-25T13:53:10Z")
> [@Dark\_Engraver](#): > > And look where it got us today… > > A dying shity old game with an aged playerbase which it will never retain It looks stable and healthy to me. How many 15 year old games are there which can say the same? ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Engraver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_engraver/32/45178_2.png) [@Dark\_Engraver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Engraver)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 1:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/74 "2018-06-25T13:56:30Z")
You do realize alot of the so called active players you see online are alts right?Literally everyone I know in game has at least 3 accounts they use at same time ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/75 "2018-06-25T14:00:28Z")
The player population is still stable. There is nothing that says that there are more alts than used to be. And since alphas can’t use alts there are probably more unique players today. ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Engraver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_engraver/32/45178_2.png) [@Dark\_Engraver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Engraver)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/76 "2018-06-25T14:02:17Z")
Yes there are more cuz of skill farming yet we don’t have concurrent numbers on the server of 50-55k we used to have before this was added. Don’t lecture me on player numbers not declining because they are year by year ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Engraver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_engraver/32/45178_2.png) [@Dark\_Engraver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Engraver)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/77 "2018-06-25T14:03:16Z")
Your last sentence about alphas you know nothing ---
**Author:** ![mimi45](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mimi45/32/77591_2.png) [@mimi45](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/mimi45)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/78 "2018-06-25T14:09:54Z")
what ccp really want: Hilmar: _EVE is famous for that but actually there are a lot of people who play EVE Online relatively solo. It’s a misconception that hardcore PVP is all EVE is. That’s what gets the headlines and what the game is known to be unique for. But playing EVE as a solo player in the tapestry of all that political drama is a lot of un. I mostly play EVE Online like that. It’s hard for me to play in the top end PVP because you have to be on voice and mine is very recognisable and that just wouldn’t work. And I’m also running a company as my day job, I have three kids and family. It’s not like I have a lot of time, so I mostly solo play. But I love doing that in a dangerous world where all these things are going on – I’m sneaking around while Titans are flying above. A lot of EVE players solo play inside a massive virtual universe._ ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/79 "2018-06-25T14:13:30Z")
> [@Dark\_Engraver](#): > > Don’t lecture me on player numbers not declining because they are year by year No they are not. They are stable for over a year now ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/80 "2018-06-25T14:26:11Z")
> [@Dark\_Engraver](#): > > A dying shity old game with an aged playerbase which it will never retain You and @mimi45 both have a pretty advanced case of bitter vet syndrome. CCP is by no means perfect developer. Mistakes have been made, unsatisfying compromises agreed to in the name of profit, and things have been neglected that shouldn’t have been, and in general there just aren’t enough developer resources to address everything people would like. That said, there is no reason to believe CCP didn’t analyze the data they have access to to the best of their ability, nor are developing the game largely in good faith the best they can. There isn’t any conspiracy here, and the simplest explanation for failures in improving and fixing the game are just a lack of time and people to do everything that needs to be done, and the realities of being a for-profit business. But by all accounts the population is relatively stable and CCP still profitable so we are still on track for Eve Forever. When Eve finally does die, some people are going to say it died because CCP didn’t do that, while other people will say it died because they did too much of the very same thing. It really is a no-win situation in many respects for CCP. But really, why do Eve players spend so much time worrying about the health of CCP or player numbers? I get there is some impact on the game experience by player counts, but it really shouldn’t be the primary concern for the players, nor the goal of any changes we suggest to the game. If you aren’t having fun or deriving satisfaction from the game, feel free to express to CCP why that is, but I don’t get this fixation of people on trying to run CCP’s business for them with practically no insight to the underlying player and business metrics that CCP keeps close to the chest like most private businesses. Claiming you speak for hordes of other customers/players, either current or potential, or your ideas will make CCP rich, is an incredibly transparent ploy. Just speak for yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2018, 2:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056/81 "2018-06-25T14:30:27Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > But really, why do Eve players spend so much time worrying about the health of CCP That reminds me I have to write to Iceland to receive financial report from CCP. They are supposedly available to public. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056.md?page=3) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/new-players-have-no-reason-to-sub-and-keep-playing/85056.md?page=5)