# Noctis Balance Pass **URL:** \ **Category:** Player Features & Ideas\ **Created:** [February 4, 2025, 3:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966 "2025-02-04T15:07:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/516281_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 6:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/21 "2025-02-19T18:18:14Z")
It is a T1 hauler, what does it need tank for? If it gets caught by a combat ship, it is dead no matter how much tank it has. If you want to add survivability, fly aligned, add a WarpCore Stabilizer and a Burst Jammer and pay attention to Dscan so you can hit warp before a bubbler is on grid. With a WCS and 2 Cargo Expanders it can hold around 2.4k m³ - for what scenario that isn’t enough? I really don’t know what you want to do with the ship? I have never in my whole EVE life lost a Noctis, because you can do all it needs to do under pre-alignment. So _what_ should happen that prevents you just hitting “warp” in case any hostile (or Combat Probes) appear on Dscan? ---
**Author:** ![Arthur\_Aihaken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arthur_aihaken/32/517614_2.png) [@Arthur\_Aihaken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arthur_Aihaken)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 6:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/22 "2025-02-19T18:49:24Z")
1. Tank and/or utility (I’ve previous stated the reasons for both). 2. For salvage (only), sure - 1460m3 is more than enough. But the Noctis is also a looting platform - and most L4 missions tap that without expansion. 3. A warp core stabilizer pretty much renders the ship useless by nerfing scan resolution, targeting range and halving the salvage drone component. If you want to make the argument that none of this is justified on a T1 hull - fine - it’s a valid one. My suggestions (and points) still stand for a T2 version - along with covert ops cloaking capacity. ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/516281_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 6:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/23 "2025-02-19T18:58:34Z")
> [@Arthur\_Aihaken](#): > > Tank and/or utility (I’ve previous stated the reasons for both). Still don’t understand it. Sorry. Even if it would have double or triple the tank it currently has, if a combat ship has tackle on you, you die. So tank simply doesn’t matter unless you fear being ganked in HS. But I have yet to see gankers hunting Noctis. And if you really want to fit tank, then fit tank. An 800er Plate, Trimarks, EANM + Damage Control and you exceed 35k eHP. How much tank do you need to “tank” whatever? > [@Arthur\_Aihaken](#): > > For salvage (only), sure - 1460m3 is more than enough. But the Noctis is also a looting platform - and most L4 missions tap that without expansion. I have 4 Noctis in HS, one for each Empire and regulary run L4 missions. In fact I have like a dozen Corps on 10.0 Standing from running missions. Thats probably _thousands_ of L4 missions. I have _never_ found a single L4 mission where you can’t carry all salvage and loot from one mission in the Noctis. Never. > [@Arthur\_Aihaken](#): > > A warp core stabilizer pretty much renders the ship useless by nerfing scan resolution, targeting range and halving the salvage drone component. If you used an MTU (which 99.99% of HS missionrunners will do) and the Noctis is only used for its Salvaging boni + Cargohold over a Destroyer, then Targeting Range doesn’t matter. If you want to improve ScanReso, just drop the WCS and fit a SeBo instead of a BurstJammer. Then you have to pay more attention to hostiles but are faster on the site. As it should be. Decisions have consequences. ---
**Author:** ![Arthur\_Aihaken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arthur_aihaken/32/517614_2.png) [@Arthur\_Aihaken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arthur_Aihaken)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 7:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/24 "2025-02-19T19:04:27Z")
> [@Syzygium](#): > > I have _never_ found a single L4 mission where you can’t carry all salvage and loot from one mission in the Noctis. Never. Enemies 5/5 and Damsel will tax the Noctis without buffing the cargo space. ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/516281_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 7:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/25 "2025-02-19T19:39:30Z")
> [@Arthur\_Aihaken](#): > > Enemies 5/5 and Damsel will tax the Noctis without buffing the cargo space. Then fit Cargo Expanders? Or just leave some of the completely worthless trash behind? (Sort MTU cargo by total price and take from the top). Or do like everyone else: Blitz Damsel and take only the tags from EB5. Or if you always want _everything_, fit Cargo Rigs at the cost of slower salvage. Why do you want a ship that can do _everything_ at once without compromises? ---
**Author:** ![Arthur\_Aihaken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arthur_aihaken/32/517614_2.png) [@Arthur\_Aihaken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arthur_Aihaken)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 8:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/26 "2025-02-19T20:40:39Z")
I just want it to excel at what it should: looting and salvaging, without being a flying brick with the EHP of a shuttle. I shouldn’t have to use every low and mid slot just to un-gimp it. ---
**Author:** ![Sticky\_Ham\_Hands](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sticky_ham_hands/32/450964_2.png) [@Sticky\_Ham\_Hands](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sticky_Ham_Hands)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 11:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/27 "2025-02-19T23:38:44Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > I don’t think more automation is a good option for EVE, especially not ‘dumb’ automation where a player might want to make intelligent choices instead. I don’t see how it would stop you from making intelligent choices - just give you an option that competes with the MTU. You don’t _have_ to turn it on if you’re really not into it. > [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > I am not in favour of more automation that removes parts of EVE gameplay. I really don’t think double-clicking cans in the overview is “gameplay”. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 7:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/28 "2025-02-20T07:21:14Z")
Just like double clicking NPCs to shoot them or rocks to mine them isn’t ‘gameplay’ either? Why is one gameplay but when it comes to looting wrecks it’s suddenly not gameplay? ---
**Author:** ![Sticky\_Ham\_Hands](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sticky_ham_hands/32/450964_2.png) [@Sticky\_Ham\_Hands](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sticky_Ham_Hands)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 10:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/29 "2025-02-20T10:14:14Z")
Those actions aren’t comparable. What you described can be done entirely without the mouse. I guess in that sense a keybinding to loot-all would also suffice - but double-clicking is carpal-tunnel inducing suffering and to my original point a _key benefit_ what the MTU provides over actively salvaging in space. Should the exploration sites of old with loot spew also come back? ---
**Author:** ![Arthur\_Aihaken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arthur_aihaken/32/517614_2.png) [@Arthur\_Aihaken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arthur_Aihaken)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 5:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/30 "2025-02-21T17:11:50Z")
It wouldn’t break my heart to see the MTU expanded to auto-salvaging as well. ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/516281_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 6:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/31 "2025-02-21T18:07:02Z")
Then why not have the combat ship auto-missionrunning as well? I mean, if we automate everything, why play the game _at all_? If you find looting and salvaging annoying and boring _simply don’t do it_? You would make more money flying other missions and just leave the wrecks anyway. But really nobody forces you to “clean up” all the mission sites if you don’t like that activity. ---
**Author:** ![Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/uriel_the_flame/32/490165_2.png) [@Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Uriel_the_Flame)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 6:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/32 "2025-02-21T18:12:20Z")
> [@Syzygium](#): > > why not > [@Sharing User Interfaces Between Characters](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/sharing-user-interfaces-between-characters/476595/38): > > What if CCP offered their own EULA permitted bots in the NES in exchange of an amount of PLEX per account each month? thinkingpsyccp innocent popcorn 😉 😈 😊 ---
**Author:** ![Arthur\_Aihaken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arthur_aihaken/32/517614_2.png) [@Arthur\_Aihaken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arthur_Aihaken)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 7:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/33 "2025-02-21T19:46:52Z")
> [@Syzygium](#): > > Then why not have the combat ship auto-missionrunning as well? Three words: Metanox moon drills. You’re going to have a tough time convincing anyone that an automated salvage function for MTUs somehow ruins the game when we have mass automation in the form of mining drills. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 8:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/34 "2025-02-21T20:12:27Z")
That’s a good point, you have convinced me. I’m fine with auto-salvaging MTUs if this means MTUs now require **Magmatic Gas as fuel** , you only get **40% of the loot** you would have gotten if you salvaged manually, are **banned from HS space** and are a 1-billion ISK target for groups to fight over as fun content. Okay, maybe 1 billion ISK is a bit much for a MTU. ---
**Author:** ![Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/uriel_the_flame/32/490165_2.png) [@Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Uriel_the_Flame)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 8:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/35 "2025-02-21T20:22:33Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > Okay, maybe 1 billion ISK is a bit much for a MTU. I’m sure MTU hunters would disagree. 😈 🤭 ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/516281_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 8:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/36 "2025-02-21T20:29:11Z")
> [@Arthur\_Aihaken](#): > > Three words: Metanox moon drills. You’re going to have a tough time convincing anyone that an automated salvage function for MTUs somehow ruins the game when we have mass automation in the form of mining drills. Not sure why you think those two are comparabe. One is a _personal_ deployable, that is cheap, remains in space only for a few minutes _and can be rescooped even under fire_. So if you are not intentionally abandon it, chances are pretty much _zero_ that you will lose it. The second is a _corporation asset_ that requires fuel, can only be used in unrestricted open-pvp areas and _cannot_ be scooped in case of an attack, so you _have_ to defend it or lose up to a billion ISK or more. And that means: One serves as a content generator, one does not. One requires effort (refuling runs, extraction runs), maintenanice costs (fuel) and defending it. The other does not. Thats why one can generate some passive income if you can keep it alive, and the other should not. ---
**Author:** ![Arthur\_Aihaken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arthur_aihaken/32/517614_2.png) [@Arthur\_Aihaken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arthur_Aihaken)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 8:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/37 "2025-02-21T20:43:40Z")
We’ve also got bots running around everywhere, so what do you have against legitimate automation? ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 8:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/38 "2025-02-21T20:49:16Z")
The fact that illegitimate automation is bad for the game doesn’t make legitimate automation a good addition to the game. CCP should get rid of both. ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/516281_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 9:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/39 "2025-02-21T21:04:12Z")
> [@Arthur\_Aihaken](#): > > what do you have against legitimate automation? The same I have against illegal automation. If you dislike a certain part of the game, simply _don’t do it_. It will make whaever you can grab there (salvage, loot, ice, ore…) more valuable and thus more attractive for others who do it. If you automate it, everything to gain there will become _less_ valuable, thus _hurting_ everyone who does it manually. ---
**Author:** ![Arthur\_Aihaken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arthur_aihaken/32/517614_2.png) [@Arthur\_Aihaken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arthur_Aihaken)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2025, 9:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966/40 "2025-02-21T21:17:54Z")
You know, I don’t get it. You rail against either buffing the Noctis or releasing an upgraded T2 version and you’re opposed to any kind of QoL improvement for single players. Drones are automation… auto targeting missiles are automation… MTUs are automation… multiboxing is automation. Automation already exists, so adapt or suffer. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/noctis-balance-pass/475966.md?page=3)