# NPC corporation tax should be removed **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [January 14, 2021, 10:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027 "2021-01-14T10:36:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 3:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/225 "2021-01-19T03:12:12Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > You are claiming there was no abuse. That’s dishonest, you know wardecs were made to shoot defenseless targets, and to abuse weaker players - that is, to make them leave the game. > > Such a nice mechanism to be able to harass players legally… no wonder people left the game when they discover what your “engaging gameplay” actually amounts to This isn’t abuse nor harassment. The purpose of wardecs was just to allow pvp in hi-sec. That is all it is. When i shoot a weaker player in lowsec, it’s not abuse. When i camp someone elses wormhole it’s not harassment. When i burn down the homes of a null bloc it’s not abuse. Nor is it abuse or harassment when you do the same in hisec (with 24 hour notice i might add). How weak the targets were was irrelevant. How one sided the wars are was irrelevant. Players have always had a decision to make before **opting into** wardecs. All that is needed is that this decision comes with meaningful choices. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 3:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/226 "2021-01-19T03:19:36Z")
A waste of words, honestly. These people _will_ view it as abuse and harassment, and there’s nothing you can do to change that. As these mechanics get nerfed and neutered, they will move on to the next most offensive gameplay element they dislike (or whichever element affects them at any given time). Their fundamental issue is with the _existence_ of nonconsensual PvP in any and all of its forms. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Deveron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/max_deveron/32/245870_2.png) [@Max\_Deveron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Max_Deveron)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 3:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/227 "2021-01-19T03:26:46Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > I can’t even wrap my mind around how CCP finds this acceptable. meh it is what it is…and they (CCP) ■■■■■ about nullsec anom ISK running and Ore distribution rates…CCP’S scarcity plan is whacked and untenable. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Deveron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/max_deveron/32/245870_2.png) [@Max\_Deveron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Max_Deveron)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 3:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/228 "2021-01-19T03:30:54Z")
yep which was the point of my post about it being able to do it consistently, like in a single day…I did it once to see…after several hours, and 5-6 Billion in the bank…i said never again Im happy with just a bill or two a day and doing it much slower. ---
**Author:** ![Hlamon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hlamon/32/241936_2.png) [@Hlamon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Hlamon)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 8:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/229 "2021-01-19T08:14:00Z")
But they have trade-offs, namely they can’t anchor own structures, so they have to pay for station services offered by other players or use even less efficient NPC station services. You are thinking what this is not enough of drawback? What drawbacks will be enough then? And why it will be good for the game and for CCP? ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 9:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/230 "2021-01-19T09:25:02Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > If you need further examples of this paradigm shift, note the difference in how real-life wars were covered decades ago, compared to modern times. In the past, it was much more visceral, despite the propaganda. Today, it’s very white-washed, subdued, and most importantly, _distant_. Disagree rather entirely tbh. Either way, no one has directly addressed the question. Which means they either dont know or wont answer, which raises even more questions. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 9:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/231 "2021-01-19T09:27:36Z")
> [@Hlamon](#): > > so they have to pay for station services Or use the Aliance they are part of’s holding corp structures. ---
**Author:** ![Hlamon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hlamon/32/241936_2.png) [@Hlamon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Hlamon)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 9:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/232 "2021-01-19T09:30:43Z")
If they are part of alliance with structures - they are war eligible. And even if they not, structure holding corp is war eligible anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 9:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/233 "2021-01-19T09:34:13Z")
Ok? How does that affect them using stuff they havent anchored for free without risk? Plently of folk are in SICO and have never anchored a thing in their lives and are undeccable. They set their coalition up so attempting to war on any one part has no effect on the rest. Clever? Maybe. But it makes war against members of their alliance almost impossible while they still gain all of the advantages of structures. ---
**Author:** ![Hlamon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hlamon/32/241936_2.png) [@Hlamon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Hlamon)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 9:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/234 "2021-01-19T09:36:39Z")
Just kill their structures, ruin their business, make them fight of lose stuff? If all players what use this structures are not part of alliance they cannot defend them. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 9:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/235 "2021-01-19T09:43:54Z")
The structures are disposable, and the siege effort for the core isn’t worthwhile. It’s better than absolutely nothing, but is still a cop-out mechanic. ---
**Author:** ![Hlamon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hlamon/32/241936_2.png) [@Hlamon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Hlamon)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 9:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/236 "2021-01-19T09:51:01Z")
Well, it is valid way to get legal PVP in high-sec with players who have reasons to fight instead of simply logging off for few days or forever. Such conflict have defined value for attacker - sum of all cores net worth available for attack, and even more value for defenders - net worth of all cores, plus structures themselves, plus modules installed plus time investment on setting up structures, industry and research jobs. If you think this activity not worth your time - it’s up to you. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 9:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/237 "2021-01-19T09:57:55Z")
There’s no “fight” and no “PvP.” You go and shoot a static object three times, and then cash in a few hundred million and split it a couple of ways. It’s more PvE-like than most PvE activities in the game. You have to understand the thought process involved from _both_ sides: the attacker decides whether it’s worth pursuing the attack, and the defender decides whether it’s worth pursuing the defense, based entirely on the opposition’s strength. If the defender expects the attacker to siege successfully, they simply won’t come to defend. If the defenders suddenly show up with a fleet of 50 people, the attackers won’t continue with the siege. It’s an entirely consensual transaction, unlike in wars _before_ citadels, when the focus was on attacking each other’s ships, and the battles were much less predictable. This whole “citadels create meaningful fights in high-sec wars” is only good on paper. In reality nothing of substance happens. CCP’s just quantifying it as a success because they see that more wars result in ISK losses, but this is solely due to the destruction of undefended Upwell structures and POCOs. Meaningful battles in this environment are exceptionally rare. ---
**Author:** ![Hlamon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hlamon/32/241936_2.png) [@Hlamon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Hlamon)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 10:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/238 "2021-01-19T10:00:24Z")
I don’t see how it’s worse than players logging off to never come back. I know, you think “this players not needed anyway”, but CCP disagree with you. Meaningful battles was very rare before changes to wardecs, unless you take clueless carebear gank as meaningful battle. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 10:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/239 "2021-01-19T10:05:37Z")
What CCP thinks is not my problem. They own the game and make their own decisions. All I can do is tell them what I want, and other people can tell them what they want. If CCP swings in the direction of safety and elimination of non-consensual PvP in favor of the people who are “leaving,” well, that’s their decision. But then it doesn’t make much sense that they would kill off wars, but not stuff like ganking and scamming. If they were to hit everything equally, they would get a bigger player base, guaranteed. So obviously, the player count isn’t the only factor in their decisions. ---
**Author:** ![God\_Emperor\_Kane](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/god_emperor_kane/32/399336_2.png) [@God\_Emperor\_Kane](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/God_Emperor_Kane)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 10:13am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/240 "2021-01-19T10:13:07Z")
I think you guys are now just talking in circles around each other repeating the same thing. And wars were always one sided for the most part. Even back in the day when it costs 2 mil with 3 war limits. Null block under war could easily comes with a 100/200/300 man fleets and destroy the war HQ. the things is they generally don’t care about their people being killed in highsec. Smaller corps… they can always hire groups for defense. I see that as a healthy way of doing business. We get paid a lot to take out structures or defend structures. Wars is not always about self interest. Sometimes other people want something gone. Like that little indy corp that has a rivalry with another in system. ---
**Author:** ![Hlamon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hlamon/32/241936_2.png) [@Hlamon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Hlamon)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 10:13am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/241 "2021-01-19T10:13:09Z")
Difference between old wars and acts of ganking/scamming is what latter don’t make masses of players go offline and leave the game, at least CCP don’t think they are. If CCP one day will change their mind and decide, what ganking/scamming make more bad than good for the game - they will act and no tears of gankers/scammers will stop them. Similar, tears of ganking/scamming victims don’t worry CCP for 17 years already, ---
**Author:** ![Hlamon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hlamon/32/241936_2.png) [@Hlamon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Hlamon)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 10:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/242 "2021-01-19T10:15:59Z")
This is sounds like healthy mercenary business. How many actual fights you get this way? ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 10:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/243 "2021-01-19T10:22:42Z")
> [@Hlamon](#): > > Difference between old wars and acts of ganking/scamming is what latter don’t make masses of players go offline and leave the game, at least CCP don’t think they are. They do, it just happens on an individual level instead of in easily-quantifiable blocks. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2021, 10:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027/244 "2021-01-19T10:53:01Z")
> [@Daichi\_Yamato](#): > > When i camp someone elses wormhole it’s not harassment. When i burn down the homes of a null bloc it’s not abuse. It is. Stop saying harassing someone is not harassment. > [@Daichi\_Yamato](#): > > Nor is it abuse or harassment when you do the same in hisec (with 24 hour notice i might add). It is harassment, but legal. Precisely my point. Try to harass players in HS without a war and you’ll get a warning. > [@Daichi\_Yamato](#): > > How weak the targets were was irrelevant. No it’s not. Wardecs were used to harass weaker corps out of the game. > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > unlike in wars _before_ citadels, when the focus was on attacking each other’s ships, and the battles were much less predictable. it was literally exactly the same. Just instead of not showing up, it was log off for several weeks. > [@God\_Emperor\_Kane](#): > > Smaller corps… they can always hire groups for defense. it’s more expensive than the structure you want to defend. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027.md?page=11) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/npc-corporation-tax-should-be-removed/290027.md?page=13)