# One Way to Balance High-Security Space 🗡 **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [September 24, 2022, 4:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999 "2022-09-24T16:27:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 29
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 8:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/625 "2022-09-30T20:57:22Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > go… bully people out of the game ok! 💁‍♀️ ---
**Author:** ![Codename\_Razorback](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/codename_razorback/32/486427_2.png) [@Codename\_Razorback](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Codename_Razorback)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 9:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/626 "2022-09-30T21:53:53Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > None of the AG groups are war-eligible. The current mechanics have no incentive for a player taking action against ganking. You can kill a -10 Catalyst a hundred times and have nothing to show for it. While risking a real PVP ship. Gankers on the other hand risk nothing of value with the potential for reward in the billions. Add to that the fact that targets are so random it’s rather difficult to determine who’s next. HS ganking is totally lopsided in its current state. Only people that profit from it argue that it’s “fair play”. Real World Policing doesn’t pay much, but it pays something… ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 9:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/627 "2022-09-30T21:55:55Z")
Antigankers appear unhappy with their rewards: neutron blasters and magnetic field stabilizers. In this game, risk = reward, so they will need to try something more challenging than clicking on Catalysts that are already scrammed by NPCs. Perhaps they should try going to lowsec? I’m sure the antigankers can find a faction warfare guild to teach them how to play the game. Antigankers should also consider trying something like mining or gas huffing, it requires more skill and has more risk, but the additional challenge is compensated by additional rewards. ---
**Author:** ![Omnis\_Decline](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/omnis_decline/32/335677_2.png) [@Omnis\_Decline](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Omnis_Decline)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/628 "2022-09-30T22:04:14Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > Antigankers should also consider trying something like mining or gas huffing, it requires more skill and has more risk, but the additional challenge is compensated by additional rewards. As a miner, I’m torn between thanking you for the kind words, and… …pretending Lucas was right all along and throwing a fit over being given a compliment about my playstyle by one of the very people trying to “chase me away” from the game? That doesn’t sound right somehow… …oh right… I’m not doing the second one, because I consider my attempts at escape and yours at preventing me from doing so to be part of the intended gameplay loop. Carry on! Also, thanks! o7 ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/629 "2022-09-30T22:05:25Z")
> [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > Real World Policing doesn’t pay much, but it pays something… Real-world policing is funded by taxes levied on the beneficiaries of the services rendered by police. If you want to get paid, then obviously the money needs to come from the people you’re protecting. Your solution is to create a legitimate organization, and then offer people protection if they pay a modest fee (payers can be tracked via standings). Then you market your services properly, on the forums, in-game, Reddit, wherever. Protect _only_ the people who pay the fee. Work hard, practice, and become efficient at your profession. There’s your income right there. Implementing some kind of easily-exploitable “gimme” mechanic for NPC bounties on player characters will never work, and isn’t the way forward. ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/630 "2022-09-30T22:08:57Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > then offer people protection if they pay a modest fee I propose this protection proof be put into purchasee’s bios for quick and easy verification. ---
**Author:** ![Arya\_Yeshe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arya_yeshe/32/397211_2.png) [@Arya\_Yeshe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arya_Yeshe)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/631 "2022-09-30T22:13:26Z")
Well… I am back to Ultima Online, I was an crazy griefer in the 90s, then I learned that while I wasnt playing the Trammel update added safe zones in UO! Safe zones!! I can’t put live explosives in people’s bags anymore making them walking bombs around the banks commiting mass genocide so I can loot everybody with my alt! Trammel destroyed Ultima Online for me, but I will still play… someone has to kill all those miners afk macroing and running scripts around caves and mountains. Also if you player kill enough people like I used to, now you have to pay a fee of 10,000 gold to be ressurected!! I rejoined Ultima Online now and there are still people crying about how much they were griefed in the 90s, I SWEAR TO GOD it’s 2022 and they are still crying about it! Now even with the safe zones they run antiganking patrols to hunt the -10 players like a bunch of piranhas! DO NOT LET THIS HAPPEN TO EVE ONLINE! ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/632 "2022-09-30T22:13:27Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > the money needs to come from the people you’re protecting. Miners and haulers just don’t like antigankers. They prefer to pay me, and I’m sorry if that makes someone jealous, but that’s how it is! Mining permits are a great deal! ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/633 "2022-09-30T22:18:29Z")
You should be _ashamed_ of yourself for enabling Big Griefing to muscle out the mom-and-pop protection rackets from the communities that they’ve been a part of for so many generations. 😡 ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/634 "2022-09-30T22:23:00Z")
Of course. Ganking is a legit playstyle supported by in game rules. HS is balanced. > [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > The current mechanics have no incentive for a player taking action against ganking. You can kill a -10 Catalyst a hundred times and have nothing to show for it. While risking a real PVP ship. What is a “real PvP” ship? Cause yennoe you can easily kill that cata with a t1 frig right? Like it won’t even touch you LOL. For an 03, you sure are bad at this game 😃 > [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > Gankers on the other hand risk nothing of value with the potential for reward in the billions. > > Add to that the fact that targets are so random it’s rather difficult to determine who’s next. > > HS ganking is totally lopsided in its current state. > > Only people that profit from it argue that it’s “fair play”. > > Real World Policing doesn’t pay much, but it pays something… They aren’t random tho. You just aren’t good at the game nor at meta data 😃 > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Your solution is to create a legitimate organization, and then offer people protection if they pay a modest fee (payers can be tracked via standings). Then you market your services properly, on the forums, in-game, Reddit, wherever. Protect _only_ the people who pay the fee. Work hard, practice, and become efficient at your profession. There’s your income right there. > > Implementing some kind of easily-exploitable “gimme” mechanic for NPC bounties on player characters will never work, and isn’t the way forward. You know he won’t. That’d require work and actual playing LOL. > [@Arya\_Yeshe](#): > > Trammel destroyed Ultima Online for me, but I will still play… someone has to kill all those miners afk macroing and running scripts around caves and mountains. If you run into mine, I’m not AFK 😃 And my miner has combat skills 😃 Already killed 2 PKs with him hehe. And another weird miner who tried to murder my poor pack llama.. > [@Arya\_Yeshe](#): > > I rejoined Ultima Online now and there are still people crying about how much they were griefed in the 90s, I SWEAR TO GOD it’s 2022 and they are still crying about it! Now even with the safe zones they run antiganking patrols to hunt the -10 players like a bunch of piranhas! > > DO NOT LET THIS HAPPEN TO EVE ONLINE! Such is my intent. ---
**Author:** ![Arya\_Yeshe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arya_yeshe/32/397211_2.png) [@Arya\_Yeshe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arya_Yeshe)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/635 "2022-09-30T22:28:43Z")
Well… if i could have a fleet of 70-100 gankers I would use T1 guns and modules and kill anything I could. Who knows, if a fortunate turn of events happen in my life and my online life I will achieve such dream one day. Numbers help a lot in a gank, that’s for sure. ---
**Author:** ![Codename\_Razorback](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/codename_razorback/32/486427_2.png) [@Codename\_Razorback](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Codename_Razorback)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/636 "2022-09-30T22:43:27Z")
Still the same tired rhetoric from Aiko’s alts and shills. * * * > [@Arya\_Yeshe](#): > > now you have to pay a fee of 10,000 gold to be ressurected!! That’s hilarious!!! Eve used to have a similar fee to renew your clone. Of course now it’s free. As far as taxes go…miners, haulers, and mission runners already pay taxes. Those taxes should be used to actually protect HS playes by paying to police it. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/637 "2022-09-30T22:45:54Z")
> [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > As far as taxes go…miners, haulers, and mission runners already pay taxes. That’s a lie. The only forced tax is for market transactions. > [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > Those taxes should be used to actually protect HS playes by paying to police it. Those taxes already pay for CONCORD, and you’re getting quite the value for your money. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 10:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/638 "2022-09-30T22:46:33Z")
> [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > As far as taxes go…miners, haulers, and mission runners already pay taxes. Those taxes should be used to actually protect HS playes by paying to police it. HS already has a punishment force. Simply form up an alliance, have an indy/krabbing wing to fund your AG. It not hard 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 11:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/639 "2022-09-30T23:16:28Z")
Antigankers must hate knowing that miners refuse to pay them, and instead the miners are paying me. Hahahaha, it’s pretty funny tbh. I guess charisma is an important attribute! ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 11:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/640 "2022-09-30T23:20:37Z")
> [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > HS ganking is totally lopsided in its current state. > > Only people that profit from it argue that it’s “fair play”. Not at all. I fly Freighters, Jump Freighters, Orca, Bowhead, DSTs, Blockade Runners and even T1 Haulers (rarely) over the entire cluster and believe ganking is fine. If anything, the cat and mouse game is lopsided too far in my favour, but the balance is where CCP thinks it needs to be so ok. Ganking provides risk and challenge in the hauling game that at least gives some differentiation between different hauling services and allows the good ones to charge a premium for services. > [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > Real World Policing doesn’t pay much, but it pays something… CONCORD are bots. They don’t really need to be paid, but Lore wise, I’m sure they are pretty well off. Absolutely 0 risk to themselves as well. That’s a pretty good gig. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 11:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/641 "2022-09-30T23:25:50Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > CONCORD are bots… lore wise, Some people think that CONCORD is a humanoid force, but if you pay attention to lore you will notice numerous references to rogue drones, autothysian lancers, and sleepy space alien trigsolarians. The awful truth, hidden from the plebians, is that CONCORD is an illegal terrorist bot network. It automatically attacks and engages lawful police forces, and protects those who destroy our natural asteroid environments. ---
**Author:** ![ResonanceOfWar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/resonanceofwar/32/408654_2.png) [@ResonanceOfWar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ResonanceOfWar)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 11:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/642 "2022-09-30T23:26:57Z")
O what about if AG’s become the G’s and only gank people with mining permit’s. Much harder blow to G’s. Soon the miners will give up on buying mining permits because they will get ganked either way. Concord destroy all who oppose their system, they are Tyrants. ---
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 11:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/643 "2022-09-30T23:48:47Z")
Biomassing an alt with a negative sec status is a surefire way to attract the attention of a GM; they’ll want to know why, and you’d better have a good reason. Rolling 3 alts on an alpha account, getting them to -10 and then just moving onto another alpha account and repeating on the other hand… /scuttles back into the darkness ---
**Author:** ![Galaxy\_Pig](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/galaxy_pig/32/374625_2.png) [@Galaxy\_Pig](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Galaxy_Pig)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2022, 11:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999/644 "2022-09-30T23:49:21Z")
> [@Codename\_Razorback](#): > > One of the most significant drawbacks to anti-ganking is that there’s no money to be made from preventing a gank. Where ganking is highly lucrative and much easier to accomplish. I won’t get into all of the advantages that gankers have, as there are too many to list. I always find that it’s best to cry it all out before addressing the problem. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999.md?page=28) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/one-way-to-balance-high-security-space/377999.md?page=30)