# Orcas should never have been turned into mining vessels **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [October 8, 2019, 7:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526 "2019-10-08T19:08:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Von\_Roshi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/von_roshi/32/164083_2.png) [@Von\_Roshi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Von_Roshi)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/21 "2019-10-08T20:28:40Z")
> [@Kezrai\_Charzai](#): > > He’s providing a target to anybody who wants to come along and start nuking him. I’ll have to disagree with you on this point. He is not providing a good target to anyone who wants to nuke him. People don’t just go around killing 400k ehp orcas in high security space. It’s suicide. Don’t believe it? Those orca pilots don’t even show up on zkill, never been involved in pvp. On it being broken and or bad for the game. Do you think it is encourages other players to keep subbing when they see a guy with 20 orcas afk mining every roid in the anom? I guess your average guy mining in a single barge might feel like quitting. Especially since this guy with 20 orcas will have his buddies gank you. ---
**Author:** ![Kezrai\_Charzai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kezrai_charzai/32/394578_2.png) [@Kezrai\_Charzai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kezrai_Charzai)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/22 "2019-10-08T20:32:21Z")
Then the issue becomes something more like “Orcas shouldn’t be allowed to mine in high sec”, rather than “Orcas shouldn’t be mining vessels”. Or perhaps, “Orcas should only be allowed a substantially reduced yield while in high sec, and be mostly a mining support vessel there. But when in low sec (or lower) they should have access to higher yield tools.” That still begs the question though - you addressed one issue: that he isn’t a feasible gank target. You haven’t said why a guy paying for 20 accounts and 20 Orcas and the SP to skill into those should _not_ be allowed to multi-box his account to do AFK mining in high sec. ---
**Author:** ![Von\_Roshi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/von_roshi/32/164083_2.png) [@Von\_Roshi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Von_Roshi)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/23 "2019-10-08T20:33:24Z")
I disagree again. For years Orcas were not mining vessels, they were support vessels. Then one day CCP went a bit crazy in buffing them and took it too far. Their intention was for it to be a top support vessel, but they went too far and gave it mining capabilities. You think CCP was right to give a ‘support ship’ with a near 200k ore hold good mining capabilities? Does CCP have a good history of making wise design decisions? Look to the problems with nullsec, rorqs online and capital proliferation. ---
**Author:** ![Solecist\_Project](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solecist_project/32/479741_2.png) [@Solecist\_Project](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solecist_Project)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/24 "2019-10-08T20:41:10Z")
Look up bump ships and fittings, buy and fit one, start bumping them. The usual ships are Stabber, Tornado and Machariel. ---
**Author:** ![Kezrai\_Charzai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kezrai_charzai/32/394578_2.png) [@Kezrai\_Charzai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kezrai_Charzai)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/25 "2019-10-08T20:42:04Z")
You can disagree all you like, but you still haven’t made a case for why someone who’s paying for 20 accounts and 20 Orcas and 20 pilots who can fly them shouldn’t be allowed to multi-box mine in high sec. Would it somehow be better if 20 friends got together with 20 Orcas and decided to go mine an anomaly? ---
**Author:** ![Von\_Roshi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/von_roshi/32/164083_2.png) [@Von\_Roshi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Von_Roshi)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/26 "2019-10-08T20:45:19Z")
I never said he shouldn’t be able to multibox mine. The issue is he shouldn’t be able to AFK mine out entire anomalies totally afk and risk free. Why can he do this? Because a 400k ehp, 200k ore hold support ship being used as mining ship makes it possible. It’s broken gameplay. And it’s damages perception of the game for new players. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/27 "2019-10-08T20:48:12Z")
> [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > The issue is he shouldn’t be able to AFK mine out entire anomalies totally afk and risk free Why not? Who are you to dictate how someone else plays the game? ---
**Author:** ![Von\_Roshi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/von_roshi/32/164083_2.png) [@Von\_Roshi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Von_Roshi)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/28 "2019-10-08T20:50:10Z")
> [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > > [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > > > The issue is he shouldn’t be able to AFK mine out entire anomalies totally afk and risk free > > Why not? Who are you to dictate how someone else plays the game? Read up. You’ll find it. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/29 "2019-10-08T20:50:40Z")
> [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > Read up Nah. You tell me who gave you the right to say who can and who can’t play the game they want. ---
**Author:** ![Compo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/compo/32/167680_2.png) [@Compo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Compo)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/30 "2019-10-08T20:54:49Z")
![trolls](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/2/4/2449095f4d049147333051454d56b697e9f27df4.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Von\_Roshi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/von_roshi/32/164083_2.png) [@Von\_Roshi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Von_Roshi)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/31 "2019-10-08T20:55:18Z")
> [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > > [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > > > Read up > > Nah. You tell me who gave you the right to say who can and who can’t play the game they want. It’s broken gameplay. And it’s damages perception of the game for new players. I highly doubt it was CCP’s intention that players would be able to use the new orca to mine large amounts of isk completely risk free. You don’t agree with that? Blackout was meant to add more risk to nullsec because too many players are farming masses of isk essentially risk free. That’s clearly not what CCP want. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 8:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/32 "2019-10-08T20:57:58Z")
> [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > It’s broken gameplay. Proof? How is it broken? You’ve never answered this. > [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > And it’s damages perception of the game for new players Counterpoint, New players see this and get inspired at the idea of commanding so many ships and they work hard to do the same. > [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > I highly doubt it was CCP’s intention Cool. I don’t care what you doubt. Show me some proof that CCP’s intent was like you are claiming. > [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > You don’t agree with that? I don’t and will not agree until you show me some proof. > [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > Blackout was meant to add more risk to nullsec because too many players are farming masses of isk essentially risk free This doesn’t even make sense. Please stay on topic. ---
**Author:** ![Von\_Roshi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/von_roshi/32/164083_2.png) [@Von\_Roshi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Von_Roshi)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 9:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/33 "2019-10-08T21:03:54Z")
Last time I respond to you. You’re just annoying and probably deliberately so. So please don’t consider my lack of response to you any further as meaning that I agree with anything you have to say. CCP clearly don’t agree that people should be able to make large amounts of isk risk free, which is why they added blackout. Do you understand my point or must I explain it for you? 20 400k hp orcas afk mining in high-sec gives you a large amount of isk risk free. It’s basically the equivalent of botting because it delivers the same benefits while being technically legal because no program is used. I guess EVE’s sub numbers are very healthy these days then since so many new players have clearly been encouraged by the current gameplay to stay subbed. Oh wait, EVE’s population has been in a downward trend for years now hasn’t it. I guess your ‘counterpoint’ that new players are being inspired to stay doesn’t hold much weight. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 9:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/34 "2019-10-08T21:17:10Z")
> [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > CCP clearly don’t agree Proof? > [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > Do you understand my point or must I explain it for you? You can first explain how this is broken. And no, your hurt fee fees aren’t valid reason to call it broken. > [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > I guess EVE’s sub numbers are very healthy these days You guess wrong and now you’re just talking about unrelated things to try and distract people from the point that you don’t know what you’re taking about lol. Enjoy your hurt feelings. Maybe one day you’ll accept that people being better than you at a video game doesn’t mean something is broken. ---
**Author:** ![Kezrai\_Charzai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kezrai_charzai/32/394578_2.png) [@Kezrai\_Charzai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kezrai_Charzai)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 9:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/35 "2019-10-08T21:19:18Z")
> [@Von\_Roshi](#): > > 20 400k hp orcas afk mining in high-sec gives you a large amount of isk risk free. Since you have no problem with multi-box mining, then Orcas still aren’t the issue. I’m pretty sure that a support Orca, 18 tanked Skiffs and a freighter would be just as risk-free, just as ISK-rich, and would require only a fraction more attention than 20 Orcas. It sounds like your issue is really with high-intensity mining in high sec, which is a somewhat different kettle of fish than Orca balancing. ---
**Author:** ![Solecist\_Project](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solecist_project/32/479741_2.png) [@Solecist\_Project](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solecist_Project)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 9:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/36 "2019-10-08T21:26:46Z")
> [@Solecist\_Project](#): > > Look up bump ships and fittings, > buy and fit one, > start bumping them. > > The usual ships are Stabber, Tornado and Machariel. Is emptyquoting still not allowed? ---
**Author:** ![Solecist\_Project](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solecist_project/32/479741_2.png) [@Solecist\_Project](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solecist_Project)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 9:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/37 "2019-10-08T21:29:19Z")
Edit: I was wrong. Drones don’t need a lock on a roid beyond the initial ones and Orcas can’t fit mining lasers, which I didn’t know. Never looked at the hardpoints. A solo Orca should fit Links, which is what I did, so I never checked. A fleet of Orcas doesn’t need a fleet full of Links, though. I was wrong about the ECM part, sorry. * * * Hey, I got more! If he’s truly afk mining, then all you need is a couple of free alpha chars skilled for ecm until you can safely break his target lock. Then you simply start rotating through the characters jamming a few Orcas per character. When he’s truly afk, he won’t notice and will find that he mined exactly nothing. It cost you nothing and you actually do something about it, instead of complaining to higher powers. Bumping of course also is an option. You only need to bump the ships out of mining range, which isn’t particularly hard. Their lasers shut off and when he’s afk, he won’t be mining anything. Either way, you’d be channeling your energy into a better direction AND playing the game! We used to call this content. ---
**Author:** ![Avaelica\_Kuershin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/avaelica_kuershin/32/478139_2.png) [@Avaelica\_Kuershin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Avaelica_Kuershin)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 9:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/38 "2019-10-08T21:40:18Z")
Would a using smartbombing destroyer be a useful tactic? ---
**Author:** ![Solecist\_Project](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solecist_project/32/479741_2.png) [@Solecist\_Project](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solecist_Project)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2019, 10:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/39 "2019-10-08T22:22:12Z")
Against the drones? In case of Drones: No, because they’re moving out of your range pretty quickly and you can’t possibly web enough of them at once, while being close enough, to make this worthwhile. Would require a ship big enough to encompass the whole roid plus the drones’ orbital range … or several destroyers, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Votineque](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/votineque/32/380137_2.png) [@Votineque](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Votineque)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2019, 12:18am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526/40 "2019-10-09T00:18:44Z")
If he’s in a corp with a structure, can’t he be war-decced? That would be more fun than mining anyway. Nothing wrong with what he’s doing as long as it’s not botting. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/orcas-should-never-have-been-turned-into-mining-vessels/194526.md?page=3)