# POCO make PI non viable **URL:** \ **Category:** Mining & Extraction\ **Created:** [May 12, 2023, 11:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439 "2023-05-12T11:17:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 8:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/22 "2023-05-13T08:30:23Z")
> [@Fifie\_Brindacier](#): > > I read up on it, watched a couple of videos and decided I wasn’t going to do PI, not the way it’s set up now anyway. It costs too much to set up and the returns aren’t worth the hassles. The set-up costs of PI are pretty low. About 17M for a well-fit Epithal, and less than 10M per upgraded planet including command center. For ISK making in EVE, that’s a very low entry cost. The returns were worth the hassles for me, and have been paying the majority of the costs of my ships in the past few years. But if it’s not for you, that’s fine. PI does require some investment in skills that are otherwise useless, you would preferably enjoy the game of figuring out your setup and finding the right planets, a bit of hauling and the regular resets. The main drawback of PI to me is that it requires a lot of clicking to set it all up, which is a pain when you want to move your PI to another region to follow your alliance. ---
**Author:** ![Fifie\_Brindacier](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fifie_brindacier/32/373279_2.png) [@Fifie\_Brindacier](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fifie_Brindacier)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 11:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/23 "2023-05-13T11:09:49Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > you would preferably enjoy the game of figuring out your setup and finding the right planets, a bit of hauling and the regular resets. True, I would. But I still wouldn’t be liking the POCO system and wouldn’t use one, which would mean I would only be able to move materials and transfer them to orbit once every 24h and that’s not acceptable to me. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 1:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/24 "2023-05-13T13:14:48Z")
What do you mean, ‘once every 24h’? If you ignore the POCO and instead use the command center to launch your stuff to orbit, the cooldown is only 1 minute. It launches 500m3 max, and expedited transfers from launchpad or storage to the command center have a cooldown too, but by upgrading the link you can bring that down to 5 minutes. ---
**Author:** ![Fifie\_Brindacier](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fifie_brindacier/32/373279_2.png) [@Fifie\_Brindacier](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fifie_Brindacier)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 1:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/25 "2023-05-13T13:47:24Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > If you ignore the POCO and instead use the command center to launch your stuff to orbit, the cooldown is only 1 minute Not according to this thread, what I read and what I was told. It’s about more than launching stuff to orbit and that’s what I looked at, everything to do with PI & POCOs. > [@Expedited Transfer timer](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/expedited-transfer-timer/152106): > > Can someone please tell me the use of the timer/cooldown of Expedited Transfer between storages on planetary production? Is it just to make our PP life more miserable than the gazillion clicking needed to change things around already does? I just want to move stuff, like now. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 3:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/26 "2023-05-13T15:05:21Z")
That person didn’t know you can upgrade the links between your buildings to reduce expedited transfer time. ---
**Author:** ![Fifie\_Brindacier](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fifie_brindacier/32/373279_2.png) [@Fifie\_Brindacier](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fifie_Brindacier)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 3:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/27 "2023-05-13T15:10:52Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > That person didn’t know you can upgrade the links between your buildings to reduce expedited transfer time I will start a PI operation and see for myself. 😃 Thank you… and a ❤ to you since I’m out of regular ones. ---
**Author:** ![Sarah\_Olson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sarah_olson/32/377582_2.png) [@Sarah\_Olson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sarah_Olson)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 5:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/28 "2023-05-13T17:02:34Z")
I find PI is a lot more worthwhile in low sec, customs offices generally have more favorable taxes in low and the planets have more resources than high sec. A cheap Epithal minimizes risk and a well setup low sec PI can generate quite decent isk. ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Lord\_Trump](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_lord_trump/32/411482_2.png) [@Dark\_Lord\_Trump](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Lord_Trump)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 9:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/29 "2023-05-13T21:42:57Z")
How do you figure that it’s “non viable?” For instance, P1 is taxed based on it being worth 400 ISK as a base value, but most products are more expensive than that. So really you’re actually paying about 15% of the value of your production. Highsec POCOs also charge a 10% NPC tax as well, which you can get down to 5% with skills. Suddenly that “30%” is looking a lot more like 12.5%. The problem isn’t the poco, it’s that you’re greedy and risk-averse. I’ve seen loads of cheapo POCOs in lowsec. You can also join a nullsec corp (for instance, the alliance I’m part of has POCO tax that tops out at 10%, while barren and temperate planets are at 2% for factories) and get access to better resources. ---
**Author:** ![Wes\_Wyhunnan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wes_wyhunnan/32/409400_2.png) [@Wes\_Wyhunnan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wes_Wyhunnan)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 10:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/30 "2023-05-13T22:25:12Z")
You can also throw a single small stick in WH and make crazy passive isk off of PI. They almost all have pocos already up, and everyone I have seen is usually 5-10% tax rate. I make around 1.6b a month in PI for about 30 minutes a week of work. You just have to leave hisec sometimes. ---
**Author:** ![Scootiesan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scootiesan/32/374618_2.png) [@Scootiesan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scootiesan)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2023, 8:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/31 "2023-06-13T08:23:44Z")
When i decided to do PI in HS I searched around Jita for a system that had low taxes(low I mean =/lower then 15%). It’s not that far away and can make the trip fast. Reseting your PI is a hard choice I know but if you want to make some profit it’s crucial that you do it in a system with low POCO taxes. ---
**Author:** ![Rocket\_Hellfire](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rocket_hellfire/32/396905_2.png) [@Rocket\_Hellfire](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rocket_Hellfire)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 7:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/32 "2023-08-01T19:32:15Z")
> [@Dimitra\_Onatopov](#): > > The way it works right now is stacked against the hard working little guy and makes the big corps money Just legacy CCP/Nullcorp corruption. It’s a microcosm of the TTT. Just null/low blocs bullying highsec players for easy profit, aka CAREBEARING. They should require weekly or monthly maintenance. I think Interbus should absolutely do takeovers. CCP is nothing but double speak… they want players to do industry, but they also don’t want industry to be productive for anyone… .except their low/null friends… which is the status quo in my 14 years of playing. It literally never changes. It’s just a cup game, fix one glaring problem of clear collusion while giving their friends another. ---
**Author:** ![Rocket\_Hellfire](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rocket_hellfire/32/396905_2.png) [@Rocket\_Hellfire](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rocket_Hellfire)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 7:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/33 "2023-08-01T19:37:31Z")
> [@Dark\_Lord\_Trump](#): > > You can also join a nullsec corp Imagine, if you will, the desire to NOT serve a nullsec corp… Where a dozen tools make literally all the decisions for the tens of thousands who play in nullsec. ---
**Author:** ![Arya\_Yeshe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arya_yeshe/32/397211_2.png) [@Arya\_Yeshe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arya_Yeshe)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2023, 7:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/34 "2023-09-05T19:54:01Z")
If you do on highsec you will pay 5% of empire tax, even if the poco is yours. The way to fix the issue of paying too much taxes is leaving highsec, or at least bringing a huge war to bash all the pocos and anchor your own pocos Just don’t be bad at diplomacy like Bjorn Bee was, he made his 10k poco thing and never offered shares, neve offered tax excemption, etc, didn’t have the right army to do the thing, no SRP, no nothing, fought a battle he knew he wouldn’t win I believe that someone who is willing to offer shares and very very reduced taxes, would get a lot of support in such endeavour ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/4/1/41ec4921cbaca7a6f9ea556e7cc20018461eae5e.png) [@system](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2023, 7:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/poco-make-pi-non-viable/405439/35 "2023-12-04T19:54:09Z")
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