# Proposal for Rebalancing of the Suicide Gank **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Tags:** high-sec\ **Created:** [June 24, 2022, 9:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013 "2022-06-24T09:28:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 56
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 4:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1330 "2022-09-28T16:55:37Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Nope. I’ve stated repeatedly that ganking is performed by a very small group of people but because it’s ludicrously easy and overpowered, the number of people they affect is far greater than their numbers. How about some actual data…you know…that thing that terrifies you… Out of 150 Ventures lost today… 11 were lost in highsec 6 were lost to NPCs 5 were lost to players ( and we dont know it it was ganks or other combat ) _Once again_ ( as I posted similar for a day a few weeks back ) more highsec Ventures were lost to NPCs than to players. Why aren’t you calling for highsec NPCs to be banned ? I mean, think of all those poor noobs losing more Ventures to rats than to Aiko’s crew ! And think of the sheer trauma those poor noobs must get, not even having a ‘gf’ at the end of it. All alone in a pod. How could a caring person such as yourself stand for that ? ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1332 "2022-09-28T17:08:11Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > To camp gates though you have to actually be able to field a fleet that can withstand counterattacks, and there simply wouldn’t be enough of her “crew” to cover the amount of gates that would need to be covered. Who’s doing the counter-attacking ? Blobs of carebear noobs in corvettes ? I mean, all your highsec noobs are not gonna have or even need any combat ships. They wont have any combat experience…having lived in a 100% safe environment where the only explosions will be fireworks. So who is going to challenge the lowsec gate camps ? I’ll be right there fighting _with_ Aiko in that scenario…and so will _many_ others. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1334 "2022-09-28T17:19:40Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > It doesn’t terrify me, it’s just that I know that every single time you pull out “data” you’ve carefully cherrypicked what you’re looking at to push a given agenda. I chose today totally at random. It is a FACT that on average just as many Ventures are lost in highsec to NPCs as to Ventures. Anyone can check it. The point is more that you _never once_ mention all the noob Ventures lost to NPCs. If you really _genuinely_ cared about noobs losing their ships you’d have long noted that every bit as much Ventures are lost to NPCs as to ganking. Yet you have never ever mentioned it. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1336 "2022-09-28T17:25:07Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > You say FACT but you’re basing your FACT off of incomplete data… Oh God…its just sickening the way you weasel out of everything. You are either a troll or doing your very best to impersonate one. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1338 "2022-09-28T17:26:45Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > and I’m the problem You nailed it. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1340 "2022-09-28T17:33:39Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > That’s nice dear… I love when you give up 😃 It ain’t my fault you’ve made yourself into this situation bruv. _Also_ did you find it on the box or > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > A gank-free high sec is needed to save the game. CCP knows this, and steps are already being taken to see how to approach it and implement it. How? The only players getting ganked are the bad ones 😃 > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Again, at no point have I ever said “it’s impossible for a noob to stay” And you’re doing everything in your power to make sure they don’t 😃 Like griefing a newbro on the fourms 😃 > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > A different generation is playing Eve now, and the developers have to understand that. As people grow older and out of Eve for good and new players come, change, and adjustments will always be needed. > > No one needs to HTFU, they are paying for the game, and they should get a say, they can soften up if they want. Mmm no. If they do, EVE wouldn’t be EVE. Nah, they do need to HTFU. Stardew is that way 😃 > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > A new space for a new feel to get those less risk-adverse players in the game. Risk adverse people don’t belong in EVE 😃 > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Well from a family of gods, you were poorly named. Or where you servents? Oof, that casual racism. > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Calm, breath in, calm breith out… you are going to be fine I know it you are such a determined hardcore player. You’re saying be calm but are typing so fast you can’t spell? Maybe you should calm down 😃 > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > I want the playerbase to not say “HTFU. Don’t like it, don’t play it”. But instead say “Go back to High-sec you Carebear!”. New Eden is big enough for the filthy casuals as well. This right here also exposes their absolute ignorance 😃 > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > two categories of gankers, one of which he labels “griefers” and they are not safe. Actually ganking isn’t griefing. I know you don’t understand this cause of your limited MMO knowledge. What you did to Altara was griefing 😃 > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Someone on reddit summarised their stance pretty well when they said: Drop the post then 😃 Link it 😃 Cause you “know a guy” right? ROFL. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > I’m glad to know my existence is so important to you. In return I’ve begun work on creating a market hub just for you. Oh? Where? Drop the system so we can verify 😃 Or this like your guide? ROFL. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Ask him though. And when he proves you wrong, are you gonna get nuts again too? LOL. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Nope. I’ve stated repeatedly that ganking is performed by a very small group of people but because it’s ludicrously easy and overpowered, the number of people they affect is far greater than their numbers. Cause the people they gank suck at the game 😃 > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > I’m certainly a problem for gankers who want to have their easy, overpowered gameplay without anyone pointing out how bad for the game it is. But thanks for demonstrating how you cherrypick to misrepresent. Bro, you don’t even have an impact on the game 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Raylan\_Yutani](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/raylan_yutani/32/312133_2.png) [@Raylan\_Yutani](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Raylan_Yutani)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1341 "2022-09-28T17:34:19Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > that still doesn’t change the FACT that CCP have stated that ganking is affecting new player churn That’s not what CCP said at all. They said **griefing** is affecting churn. How many times does this need to be pointed out to you? Are you deliberately being thick? ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1342 "2022-09-28T17:36:39Z")
> [@Raylan\_Yutani](#): > > That’s not what CCP said at all. Indeed…you are now the umpteenth person to have told him that…but he just carries on with the lies regardless. To the extent that I’m **so** sick of it that all his posts are now simply ‘View 1 hidden reply’. Bye bye Lucas. ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1344 "2022-09-28T17:47:41Z")
Back to the topic at hand. I would like to entertain the idea for CONCORD to instead be replaced by Empire “FOBs” that spawn increased-response-time diamond NPC fleets, which are theoretically combatable today by organized players, but are functionally “the new CONCORD”. Gone is CONCORD, here are diamond empire rat fleets to fight off instead. FOBs would move around in empire space so every once in a while people would have to actively check to make sure their system is covered by a FOB to begin with (I think today it’s 3 jumps out). Or if that’s too harsh, vary the response time by FOB distance so daily people have to check their risk tolerance, and gankers have to scout geographic opportunities. This would invite a lot of new gameplay options for gankers and anti-gankers alike. And fits with CCP’s new “PvEvP” mindset they’ve been trying to create with Desolate Asteroid Belts and CRAB Beacons and ESS’s and now FW event sites. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 6:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1346 "2022-09-28T18:17:07Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Except, what they were calling “griefing” is part of what people currently call ganking. They were not talking about what is currently griefing under the EULA. Except it isn’t. This again exposes your lack of knowledge of MMOs 😃 Ganking isn’t griefing, but griefers may use in game methods to grief others. Like creating a throwaway account to stalk someone in game 😃 ---
**Author:** ![T\_Elliot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/t_elliot/32/453851_2.png) [@T\_Elliot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/T_Elliot)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 6:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1347 "2022-09-28T18:21:05Z")
> [@Altara\_Zemara](#): > > Well that’s odd…as you go on as if every noob in every system in Eve is ganked 10 times a day by Safety. Now _by your own admission_…ganking is just a small local issue. So there’s no need to alter the entire game because of it. > > See how you keep tripping yourself up ? Keep at it ! No, no, no, no, you just don’t understand the _context_ of Safety. You see they are horrible killers that snap their fingers at newbs and drive them away from game with sobs of “grifers”. There is no counterplay at all to this. However they are not real pvpers. Suicide gankers could never carry out something like multiple gate camps. Only _real_ pvpers could do that. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 6:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1349 "2022-09-28T18:35:49Z")
> [@T\_Elliot](#): > > There is no counterplay at all to this. A claim that is of course utter nonsense. I’ve mined in a Venture, in several different accounts, for over a year now. Even in Uedama…that hotspot of ganker activity. I’ve never been ganked while mining. It is _easy_ to avoid being ganked. I’ve mined in 0.6 systems like Isanamo, and there’s more danger from NPCs than there is from gankers. ---
**Author:** ![T\_Elliot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/t_elliot/32/453851_2.png) [@T\_Elliot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/T_Elliot)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 6:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1350 "2022-09-28T18:39:45Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > What’s wild is the only person I seen griefing a newbro in like the past 6 months is Lucas ROFL. It is weird that I have noticed a lot of accusations directed towards new people on the form coming form someone, whose name I don’t quite remember. I think it is the same person who has explained the flaws in Sun Tzu and Machiavelli, and how their master treatises of warfare could never be applied to video game combat. Hmm, the name is on the tip of my tongue. I hate it when I can’t remember things. ---
**Author:** ![T\_Elliot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/t_elliot/32/453851_2.png) [@T\_Elliot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/T_Elliot)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 7:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1351 "2022-09-28T19:01:19Z")
> [@Altara\_Zemara](#): > > A claim that is of course utter nonsense. I’ve mined in a Venture, in several different accounts, for over a year now. Even in Uedama…that hotspot of ganker activity. I’ve never been ganked while mining. It is _easy_ to avoid being ganked. > > I’ve mined in 0.6 systems like Isanamo, and there’s more danger from NPCs than there is from gankers. It is weird that with some simple precautions one can avoid being ganked at least 99% of the time. I do a lot of AFK mining. I don’t mean I’m watching a movie on the other browser and I’m tabbing back in forth afk mining. I mean I set my skiffs up, then leave the computer room and cook the family waffles afk mining. I have never once been suicide ganked in high sec yet. The stupid diamond rats got me once, but that just factors into the cost of overhead, and is a small price to pay to lower the wife agro over me playing that pretend space game too much! But of course there is no _counterplay_ to high sec suicide gankers. Because, you see, _I_ define the word _counterplay_ to mean whatever I want it to. I have learned a lot of word tricks that mean I am always right and people who don’t agree with me are wrong because I define things that way. If people prove me wrong, it is just that they did not understand me, then I change the subject quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 7:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1352 "2022-09-28T19:16:26Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > And to be clear, I’m not joking, I genuinely don’t know how someone’s brain could take in all these pieces of information and then conclude that he was just reiterating that the EULA bans griefing of newbies in rookie systems. I’m not joking either, Oh Great Kellian Entity. Did it ever occur to you that he _might_ refer to better systems to assess griefing ? No? Thought not. Rather than catering to the likes of you he _may_ actually be planning something you couldn’t imagine. After all, he’s not you. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 7:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1354 "2022-09-28T19:28:02Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Again though, if you want to delude yourself you are welcome to do so. It only means CCP won’t have feedback from many gankers when they do look to make changes and it means your reaction will be that much more hilarious as you don’t see changes coming. You mean the thing you say is so OP that you easily avoid it? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 7:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1355 "2022-09-28T19:33:57Z")
That lens you are looking through is of the same quality as that mirror. Kellybaby, you are wrong. 🤡 🤡 🤡 🤡 🤡 The man wants to reduce rookie griefing that is now slipping through the EULA nets. It may not be what _you_ want, but it is what _you_ will get. I can’t blame you for not thinking out of the box (as I’m sure ccp does). You have to come out of the box first 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 7:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1357 "2022-09-28T19:45:45Z")
Wrong again, I’m not telling _me_, I’m telling _you_ 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Kell](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lucas_kell/32/393556_2.png) [@Lucas\_Kell](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lucas_Kell)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 7:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1358 "2022-09-28T19:50:05Z")
(post deleted by author) ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 8:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1359 "2022-09-28T20:04:50Z")
I’m not in the habit of repeating what others have already pointed out to you about said video. Your interpretation is irrelevant, it’s wrong. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > applying a clearer focus on reducing ganking and _patati & patata_ hey man, if that is what ccp thinks it needs to do, and turn the sandbox into a litterbox, that’s what they’ll do. Whether that’s the right thing to do, the PCU and the revenue will tell. I don’t think they can afford one other major mistake of the level of scarcity and changes to industry. The certainty if they would make that decision, and stab EvE at its pvp heart, is that they will lose subs - which they can’t afford. The rest, the thousands and thousands of new subs “that will join”, are birds in the air. When those birds land in the game, and go through the “unintuitive stuff”, see how bleak the pve landscape really is, they’ll take flight again. That, Kellybaby, you can count on. Without danger, risk at every step, and people to help out this game is literally not worth its price. But hey, they do as they do, and you be as you are. But I’m pretty confident that cooler heads than yours prevail at CCP HQ… And if I lost - oh dear what now - my “credibility” in your opinion because I’m starting to take exception to your obnoxious behavior, thank Bob for that. No one needs your approval, in case you were under that illusion. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013.md?page=55) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013.md?page=57)