# Proposal for Rebalancing of the Suicide Gank **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Tags:** high-sec\ **Created:** [June 24, 2022, 9:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013 "2022-06-24T09:28:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 63
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 2:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1514 "2022-10-03T14:21:02Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Beyond a launch phase, the only noticeable growth in the game is the opening of alt characters How long did that launch phase take ? The peak was reached somewhere in 2011, the game was launched in 2003. Are you saying that the biggest growth phase is due to alts being created ? And how do you know ? Data ? But the most worrying suggesting you make seems to be that there have been no new players in that growth area at all. So it must be alts dropping out again after 2013 ? Or ? > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > that was abused and eventually removed for good reasons. Oh, I’m not questioning the decision to curtail hisec wardec’ing. I’ve had my experience with it, and it looked formidable to someone who started playing and had joined a hisec corp. But, while we were wardec’d for two months I’ve never seen one of attackers. Odd. Location must have had something to do with it. > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Like everything else being taken out of the game, old players that suck at the game I think you mean veterans, who are not necessarily “old” in real life. But I do get your mindset of “it’s all too much effort for me, let’s lower the barrier (that better players took successfully) instead”. Yeah, this game isn’t for just anyone. No game is, btw. ---
**Author:** ![T\_Elliot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/t_elliot/32/453851_2.png) [@T\_Elliot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/T_Elliot)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 2:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1515 "2022-10-03T14:29:52Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > I have played for well over a decade and can honestly say I have never said…“OMG the PvP this is going to be so exciting”… This sounds similar to my favorite pilot Altara Zemara, ganker, thrill seeks in a T1 Industrial, always excited about the cat and mouse. > > I believe the comments in here are to generalize the want for it. If you were high sec and really wanted that excitement of the cat and mouse game, you can easily go to low, there are plenty of things to do there with plenty of NPC stations to dock in safely. > > JJ I guess we are going to have to agree to disagree on this JJ. The PvP in EvE is the only thing that keeps me coming back. I like that there is a meaningful loss on death (ship that may have taken me a while to build blowing up), and possible my pod being shot. EvE is one of the few games that offer a wide variety of non consensual PvP. EvE’s PvE is mostly boring as sin once you figure out how to do it. There is very little variety compared to PvE oriented games. Playing against other human players adds excitement and variety to these games that is just not there with coded encounters. Sure I could go to low sec (And I do for faction warfare or moving items there), but high sec is just so mind numbing. There is nothing new in any of the high sec. The only thing interesting in highsec at all is the possibility of some kind of ganking. ---
**Author:** ![T\_Elliot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/t_elliot/32/453851_2.png) [@T\_Elliot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/T_Elliot)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 2:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1516 "2022-10-03T14:40:55Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > No that is how you measure everything. Projecting your power in game that runs off paying Customers is not ideal for business. > > If you owned a store, and I stood outside of it hitting everyone with a bat, cops pick me up and release me after 5min and I go back and do again, how successful do you think your business will be? > > Same in Eve, ganking has to go, it is crap game play. It needs to go, and being worked to be pushed out of the game. > > JJ I am confused by that idea of projecting power and denying resources is “crap gameplay”. To me that seems like the main point of Eve’s gameplay and its pull. From large null sec blocks claiming these systems are theirs, and trying to chase out anyone else, to smaller pirate corps attacking anyone in their area, to syndicates in highsec trying to protect “their belts” from non syndicate miners, to individual industrialists starting price wars over a single market, most of EvE’s game play is all about projecting power and driving others from resources that one wants. To my ears JJ, you just said that the thing that EvE is built around is “crap game play”. What do you think the big draw of EvE is? Do you think that people would flock to EvE instead of Wow, FF, or any of the PvE centric games for the thrill of ice mining or belt ratting? ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 2:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1517 "2022-10-03T14:47:42Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > ganking has to go You know there’s another solution ? ---
**Author:** ![Vanessa\_Warwind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vanessa_warwind/32/423909_2.png) [@Vanessa\_Warwind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vanessa_Warwind)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 3:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1518 "2022-10-03T15:40:04Z")
just give freighters mid slots and low slots and fitting like every other ship according to its class i guess would be around like a bs in it can fit large mods. but that would need to be firgured out they cost nowadays 2.5 b to build at least. then let people failfit them themself (wich they will anyhow) and those who put the time in to fit them properly may live the others die. that entire catas are to effective thing funny to read but in the end they are as effective as ccp wants them to be. that is kinda my only grief with that topic freighters are way to easy prey atm. if that is ever adressed i mabye buy one again but till then nope ---
**Author:** ![Vanessa\_Warwind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vanessa_warwind/32/423909_2.png) [@Vanessa\_Warwind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vanessa_Warwind)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 3:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1519 "2022-10-03T15:47:38Z")
Dont make me laugh ccp made changes that forced us to attack holding corps sift through their dead bodys just to find someone that would engage in combat. Since everbody nowadays uses those shellcorps we have no other choise then to engage them indiscremenetly to find our content. so guess what ccps changes are to blame for all the colleteral damage that we cause. At lest for our group i can not talk for others. The change to one timer for medium structers does not help guess what we hit more small corps to refinance the costs of our hqs. We do pvp but on the end of the day we also need to cover our operating costs and we do that with what we are good at unfutunatly for many poor structure that is killing things. On the end of the day all ccp done is accelerated the process and froced our hand to be more effecient with killing structures. Edit: on the flipside though i only need to go twiche to a medium sctructure to finish it so i guess that is that more time to refinance war hqs i guess. Edit2: for readabiltiy hope at least ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 3:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1520 "2022-10-03T15:59:56Z")
With a standard fit on a provi you can get 560k EHP. Even in a 0.5 system, with a concord response time of 19 seconds, that would require almost 29.5k dps of optimally mixed damage type (in reality it will have to be higher). Isn’t it more a matter of wrong place at the wrong time ? ---
**Author:** ![Vanessa\_Warwind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vanessa_warwind/32/423909_2.png) [@Vanessa\_Warwind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vanessa_Warwind)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 4:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1521 "2022-10-03T16:06:46Z")
that would be true if you had any say in the place you need to haul your stuff to a market markets are fixed so there is no way to avoid some systems. Also if you gave the things mid and low slots that would not be their base hp. that would be silly. i hoped it would be clear that this would be a rebalancing of the ship not just a slap on slots. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 4:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1522 "2022-10-03T16:18:32Z")
So what’s the acceptable level of EHP that would make it ok in a rebalancing of Freighters? ---
**Author:** ![Posh\_Wynoa\_Spice](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/posh_wynoa_spice/32/455534_2.png) [@Posh\_Wynoa\_Spice](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Posh_Wynoa_Spice)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 4:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1523 "2022-10-03T16:33:28Z")
You mean a terribly inefficient fit that sacrifices cargo hold and agility for HP – which is a non-starter. You might as well say that the best way to avoid ganking is to not play the game. That entirely defeats the purpose. ---
**Author:** ![Vanessa\_Warwind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vanessa_warwind/32/423909_2.png) [@Vanessa\_Warwind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vanessa_Warwind)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 4:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1524 "2022-10-03T16:40:23Z")
dont know i am no dev also i am not even starting about this. it is more a give the player the freedom to fit their freighters according to their need. Like nearly every other ship so people an change the resist profile favor cargo to tank and wise versa give it higher resist and lower raw hp or other way round. what the max should be i guess would be then the desicion of the the dev they have way more data to this and what so ever. ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 4:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1525 "2022-10-03T16:43:25Z")
> [@Vanessa\_Warwind](#): > > markets are fixed so there is no way to avoid some systems. Aye, just like there are ways to avoid ganking in those systems. So you are asking for even more ehp to be virtually ungankable ? Why ? Btw, there’s no freighter loss registered on your name, so it’s impossible to figure out what happened to the one you are not willing to replace _unlesss_ ccp _does something_. > [@Posh\_Wynoa\_Spice](#): > > You mean a terribly inefficient fit that sacrifices cargo hold and agility for HP – which is a non-starter. You have the choice, at least. And why don’t you use an alt or a buddy in the same corp, to web you ? He can scout at the same time too. > [@Posh\_Wynoa\_Spice](#): > > You might as well say that the best way to avoid ganking is to not play the game. But that isn’t what I said nor will ever say. The best way to avoid ganking is to improve the knowledge of how stuff works in EvE. ---
**Author:** ![Vanessa\_Warwind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vanessa_warwind/32/423909_2.png) [@Vanessa\_Warwind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vanessa_Warwind)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 4:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1526 "2022-10-03T16:45:02Z")
you are not reading what i write you are procecting what you think that i write but its alright read it again might helps ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 4:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1527 "2022-10-03T16:45:59Z")
Answer scipio’s question perhaps. It was very clear. Or are you just here to complain about freighters not being ungankable in hisec ? ---
**Author:** ![Vanessa\_Warwind](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vanessa_warwind/32/423909_2.png) [@Vanessa\_Warwind](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vanessa_Warwind)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 4:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1528 "2022-10-03T16:47:50Z")
ups well yeah got mixed up but i at no point was asking for anthing like more hp more flexibilty in what i can do with the freighter mabye but what the max is gone be is nothing that any player realy should have a say in anyway ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 5:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1529 "2022-10-03T17:35:06Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > I have played for well over a decade and can honestly say I have never said…“OMG the PvP this is going to be so exciting” So you’re bad at the game. Just lead with that 😃 > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Projecting your power in game that runs off paying Customers is not ideal for business. You realize you’re playing an open world PvP game, right bruv? > [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > If you owned a store, and I stood outside of it hitting everyone with a bat, cops pick me up and release me after 5min and I go back and do again, how successful do you think your business will be? Bro, you know you’re playing a vidya game right? ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 5:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1530 "2022-10-03T17:55:49Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Projecting your power in game that runs off paying Customers is not ideal for business. What the…? It’s what the frikin game is all about ! As a paying customer I am paying to _have_ the carnage that was advertised on the box. It’s a PvP massive multiplayer game…fer crying out loud ! Comments like the above make it very clear you simply don’t have a clue. ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 6:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1531 "2022-10-03T18:24:29Z")
> [@Jesse\_W\_James](#): > > Projecting your power in game that runs off paying Customers is not ideal for business. > [@Altara\_Zemara](#): > > Comments like the above make it very clear you simply don’t have a clue. Ah, but he does have an _agenda_, Altara. Apparently that relieves him of any obligation to be factual, coherent, honest and (dare I say it? I dare!) _sensible_. This thread will go the way of others, I think, and for the same reasons. In with a Bang! Out with a whimper. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 6:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1532 "2022-10-03T18:29:45Z")
> [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](#): > > This thread will go the way of others, I think, and for the same reasons. Yes, but it’s a bit like the dungeons of Skyrim. Just when you think you’ve blapped all the headless zombies…more show up. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2022, 6:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013/1533 "2022-10-03T18:51:46Z")
> [@Altara\_Zemara](#): > > It’s a PvP massive multiplayer game…fer crying out loud ! Yes, but the argument inherent to their platform is that _no game should be._ [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013.md?page=62) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proposal-for-rebalancing-of-the-suicide-gank/368013.md?page=64)