# Proving of Kybernauts for Glorification in the Flow Unfolds **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** feedback, official, devblog\ **Created:** [June 29, 2020, 1:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073 "2020-06-29T13:03:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 7:20am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/223 "2020-06-30T07:20:42Z")
One question, would you still like the existing mode if your chance of winning would be 50-60% with optimal setup? Please be honest. ---
**Author:** ![Gustav\_Mannfred](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gustav_mannfred/32/392828_2.png) [@Gustav\_Mannfred](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gustav_Mannfred)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 7:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/224 "2020-06-30T07:25:07Z")
yes I would ---
**Author:** ![Soldier\_Forrester](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/soldier_forrester/32/404576_2.png) [@Soldier\_Forrester](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Soldier_Forrester)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 7:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/225 "2020-06-30T07:48:37Z")
I really hope this won’t be dead-on-arrival because the camera controls are as “immersive” as normal abyssal space. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 7:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/226 "2020-06-30T07:52:56Z")
> [@Salt\_Foambreaker](#): > > fake PvP Do not use “no true scotsman” informal fallacy. ---
**Author:** ![Zur\_Yanamas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zur_yanamas/32/215961_2.png) [@Zur\_Yanamas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zur_Yanamas)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 7:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/227 "2020-06-30T07:57:39Z")
To hell with those arenas. Eve is not like WoW, or any other form of RPG. It is all about open world and no FIGHT button that brings player in any kind of instanced zones, where no one can intervene. You are dragging the open world small-scale pvp even further down. Please don’t do this. ---
**Author:** ![Zur\_Yanamas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zur_yanamas/32/215961_2.png) [@Zur\_Yanamas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zur_Yanamas)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 8:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/228 "2020-06-30T08:01:33Z")
The quantity of the content in sandbox will be drastically reduced, because many fellas that were doing PVP will switch to arenas. Including many FCs, and small gang players. ---
**Author:** ![Tater-nuts](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tater-nuts/32/189043_2.png) [@Tater-nuts](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tater-nuts)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 8:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/229 "2020-06-30T08:06:00Z")
It’s a sad day for EvE. 😢 ---
**Author:** ![Sylvia\_Kildare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sylvia_kildare/32/416948_2.png) [@Sylvia\_Kildare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sylvia_Kildare)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 8:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/230 "2020-06-30T08:32:40Z")
Something told me there’d be lots of WOW mentions in the forum thread when I started reading the dev blog… > [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > “shall be glorified” huh > interesting > i thought the Triglavians weren’t too friendly towards us, but it looks like they’re willing to praise us when we best ourselves in combat? i wonder what purpose they have for that. 🤔 > > i guess they’re more welcoming of us since some of us have shown our willingness to help the triglavians with their invasion… interesting… I mean, they’ve been happily killing us and being killed by us in this abyss for what, nearly 3 years now? Until the Trig invasions began, they seemed plenty happy with us. I suppose when they’re in trig invasions they’re still in super serious mode but when they’re in the abyss, it’s back to just good fights and no hard feelings. ---
**Author:** ![Sylvia\_Kildare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sylvia_kildare/32/416948_2.png) [@Sylvia\_Kildare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sylvia_Kildare)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 8:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/231 "2020-06-30T08:41:30Z")
> [@Steve\_Ronuken](#): > > Here’s the thing: > > This doesn’t stop anyone roaming who wants to roam. > And it means people who have a short play time available, can get out there and have a quick fun fight. > > If you want an unfair fight (in either direction) go roam. These force ‘fair’ fights. It does mean there will likely be less PVPers out there for the roamers to find, though. Don’t the nullseccers spend 25% of their time on the EVE forums complaining about how empty most of nullsec is? Expect that to increase once this is put in. Unless no one uses it. ---
**Author:** ![Roime](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/roime/32/391509_2.png) [@Roime](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Roime)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 9:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/232 "2020-06-30T09:23:09Z")
This is not PVP, this is playfighting outside the sandbox. ---
**Author:** ![Azalais\_Selenica](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/azalais_selenica/32/354085_2.png) [@Azalais\_Selenica](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Azalais_Selenica)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 10:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/233 "2020-06-30T10:12:30Z")
What, afraid of a fair fight, are we? Just as i thought most of so called “pvp” players prey on a weak and wouldn’t want to fight without tactical or numerical advantage. Actually I didn’t like to pvp before but in this one i would most likely choose to participate. ---
**Author:** ![Nywax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nywax/32/432978_2.png) [@Nywax](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nywax)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 10:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/234 "2020-06-30T10:51:08Z")
Nice! I’ve always wanted some way to have a fair fight without having to roam lowsec for an hour or two, this will add the possibility of having short fun sessions of eve when I dont have the time to engage in the sandbox aspect of the game, can’t wait! ---
**Author:** ![Aphrodite\_Sexy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aphrodite_sexy/32/420261_2.png) [@Aphrodite\_Sexy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aphrodite_Sexy)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 11:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/235 "2020-06-30T11:32:59Z")
I’m just saying, I went to nullsec. I know a lot about PVP. Doesn’t matter whether I got killed or not (damn I got that covetor was at 10% hull when his friends warped in and jammed me damnnnn), it was fun. And the isk I spent on that hecate and the effort of finding a Thera exit that had people in it helped make it a fun experience. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 11:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/236 "2020-06-30T11:54:41Z")
> [@Zur\_Yanamas](#): > > The quantity of the content in sandbox will be drastically reduced, because many fellas that were doing PVP will switch to arenas. Including many FCs, and small gang players. That means the open world PvP being a sad excuse for the thing some people really want? Because it sounds like that. 🤔 EVE needs all forms of PvP, so to include as many player playstyles as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Kadesh\_Priestess](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kadesh_priestess/32/467993_2.png) [@Kadesh\_Priestess](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kadesh_Priestess)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 1:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/237 "2020-06-30T13:10:38Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > What will _actually_ happen is that try-hard fuckbois like me are going to optimize our game to such an extent that you aren’t even going to be able to tell what happened after the fight is over. I majored in math, and do it for a living. Not bragging, just a matter of fact; I’d make a rather terrible mechanic, or a chef. But I _am_ a good nerd. And there are others like me. Haven’t seen you in the AT, where you actually had alot of space to min-max and apply your math/analytical skills. Unlike in proving grounds, where space for minmaxing and analytical complexity are much smaller, at least in the announced metas. Regarding roaming - roaming in its canonical sense has been quite dead for a while. Roamers can fight someone else only consensually since secure channels ensure nobody (but someone sleeping or afk) gets unconsensual pvp. To make things worse, they get dunked non-consensually by running into camps or cynos. Groups who wanted to participate in both types of pvp have moved to c2-ns wormholes already, which is hardly “roaming” and needs quite a bit of infrastructure and organization. I am all for viability of roaming. CCP has improved quite many things in this regard recently (nerfs to caps and cynos come to mind), so you face various issues less often, but it is still an awfully low amount of encounters per unit of time (much worse than before, when people were bad/not so organized in general - did not have homedef doctrines and secure channels, did not anchor, overextended, allowing you to pick more fights without straight-up losing). CCP could do some magic trick to make roaming viable again, but i have very little confidence in that. So, maybe instanced pvp is an easier solution indeed. I am glad that CCP learned from (some) mistakes of previous iteration of PvP room, and introduced rotating meta to make things less stale. Although, looking forward to having more diverse/complex metas - with fewer hull restrictions and more people, such as 5x5 2 cruisers 1 destroyer 2 frigs or BS BC cruiser destroyer frigate. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 1:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/238 "2020-06-30T13:33:22Z")
> [@Kadesh\_Priestess](#): > > CCP could do some magic trick to make roaming viable again, but i have very little confidence in that. Needlejack filaments were the magic trick. ---
**Author:** ![Kadesh\_Priestess](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kadesh_priestess/32/467993_2.png) [@Kadesh\_Priestess](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kadesh_Priestess)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 1:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/239 "2020-06-30T13:38:23Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > Needlejack filaments were the magic trick. One-way wormhole without a way to gradually escalate the fight to keep the other party interested, with a cooldown of 15 minutes after the last encounter. You have a chance to catch someone with pants down right after the jump, and then lie low for 15 minutes or make a march into random direction, effectively turning it into conventional roaming. Both of which are not very enjoyable experience. So compared to c2-ns rolling (which i find an okayish-good way to get pvp in the modern meta): - high cooldown of 15 mins which allows you to pop up somewhere while not being spotted in secure channels - less non-consensual encounters - no gradual escalation - less chances to keep the other party interested during a (semi-)consensual encounter - no reshipping - super high chance to be countered and forced off by a few ships in the enemy gang So no, they are not the magic trick. To make roaming work in the modern null meta, you have to invest much more effort into intel tools, balance between the hunter and the prey, and small-mid scale conflict drivers. I would very much prefer that, but instanced pvp is fine too. ---
**Author:** ![Aramatheia](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aramatheia/32/383412_2.png) [@Aramatheia](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aramatheia)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 2:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/240 "2020-06-30T14:04:15Z")
> [@Aphrodite\_Sexy](#): > > Yes exactly, so what will happen to FW? Or anybody who does PVP? They will go to these instances. All we will see in Plexes now are NPCs. i cant speak for low or null but im pretty sure instanced pvp will do nothing at all in any capacity to existing high sec pvp. No ones taking haulers or mining barges into those new events, they will still die as usual in high sec. There will be zero change there. Also in the ongoing trig system battles, entirely in universe pvp that will carry on as usual. I just dont see why people think that a limited time, according to the blog, event which is entirely focused on pvp is somehow going to delete ALL pvp from the game. It wont, it wont change anything, it will probably increase pvp as players who want to try pvp without the obvious 50v1 issue, meanwhile 50v1’s will proceed as normal anyway as pve’ers wont be doing the arenas, and everyone else who doesnt do them, will also play as they have all along, because generic pvp isnt being removed/deleted. ---
**Author:** ![Syn\_Shi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syn_shi/32/242535_2.png) [@Syn\_Shi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syn_Shi)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 2:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/241 "2020-06-30T14:14:10Z")
So much salt…my eyes. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2020, 2:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/242 "2020-06-30T14:28:23Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > History is open to interpretation of what was the actual cause of SWG’s demise, but they did indeed, [say exactly that](https://games.slashdot.org/story/05/11/16/1633205/john-smedley-answers-your-questions): If CCP decided to completely change the way combat works in the game - say, from the existing system into some kind of on-the-rails shooter - and then claimed the reason they did it was to make it more accessible to new players (and veterans can ■■■■ off) then you guys would have a parallel. But that’s not what we’re talking about. There is nothing fundamentally game changing about this - it’s the repackaging of an existing mechanic to make the content less gated. That’s it. The last thing I need is lectures from anybody on what killed SWG. I know what killed it. I was there. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073.md?page=11) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073.md?page=13)