# Proving of Kybernauts for Glorification in the Flow Unfolds **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** feedback, official, devblog\ **Created:** [June 29, 2020, 1:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073 "2020-06-29T13:03:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 50
**Author:** ![Gustav\_Mannfred](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gustav_mannfred/32/392828_2.png) [@Gustav\_Mannfred](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gustav_Mannfred)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2020, 7:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1062 "2020-09-18T07:50:14Z")
Imagine you used to like and enjoy the old Cruiser 1v1 arena very much and then CCP just takes it away, would you not be angry too? TBH, I had to pay a lot of attention not to post anything wrong in here that can get me into troubles. I am still angry that this great content is gone. I also dont understand, that CCP did not listen to player feedback on the old arena right when it came out. There was a lot of stuff brought up. I even brought stuff up to the CSM, and what happened? CCP removed the great content and replaced it with limited time events, where you only can bring cheap t1 ships. The reason the old arena became less popular was that CCP did not listen to players right when it came out. Already in the first week there were problems like time zone restrictions(which got fixed in SEPTEMBER 2019!!! after having brought it up many times) or stalemates(25% drop is not enought, and thus ended up in the Ikitursa becoming so superior). There are examples where CCP at least listen to players a bit, for example the small buff to edencom ships or the change to structures to reduce spam and making it worth to destroy. Why did CCP not do that after the old arena was released in 2018? Why was there not a patch afterwards where all these issues were adressed? And now it is gone, sh\*\*\*\*\*\* on those who loved it. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2020, 7:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1063 "2020-09-20T19:01:42Z")
> [@Gustav\_Mannfred](#): > > CCP at least listen to players a bit, for example the small buff to edencom ships You mean the one that happened right after CCP devs tried flying the EDENCOM ships on TvE? ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2020, 7:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1064 "2020-09-21T07:52:23Z")
Obviously they changed this after feedback, rather than planning it so that ENDCM ships were more attractive once every one had their Trig ships, right? Right? ---
**Author:** ![Tiger\_space\_Thedark](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tiger_space_thedark/32/373728_2.png) [@Tiger\_space\_Thedark](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tiger_space_Thedark)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2020, 10:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1065 "2020-09-21T10:52:42Z")
Frigate and cruiser deal more damage so they are more attractive now The thunderchild on the other hand still have receive no buff ---
**Author:** ![Sylvia\_Kildare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sylvia_kildare/32/416948_2.png) [@Sylvia\_Kildare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sylvia_Kildare)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2020, 8:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1066 "2020-09-24T08:34:55Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Yeah, don’t expect that. CCP hasn’t gone to all the effort of the new Jita 4-4 model to risk Jita going liminal and getting cut off before the new station’s even fully assembled. The Trigs will use the new 4-4 station model as their HQ in k-space, don’t worry. ---
**Author:** ![Karoli](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karoli/32/251258_2.png) [@Karoli](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karoli)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 4:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1067 "2020-10-20T16:11:04Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > - Ahtila > - Angymonne > - Archee > - Arvasaras > - Harva > - Ichoriya > - Ignebaener > - Kaunokka > - Kino > - Komo > - Konola > - Kuharah > - Nalvula > - Nani > - Niarja > - Otanuomi > - Otela > - Raravoss > - Sakenta > - Skarkon > - Senda > - Tunudan > - Urhinichi > - Vale > - Wirashoda Thank you for the list of systems… ---
**Author:** ![Karoli](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karoli/32/251258_2.png) [@Karoli](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karoli)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 4:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1068 "2020-10-20T16:11:50Z")
Thank you for the list of systems. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2020, 6:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1069 "2020-10-20T18:18:12Z")
> [@Sylvia\_Kildare](#): > > their HQ in k-space, T-space. 😉 or maybe ∆-space… ---
**Author:** ![TheCorrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/thecorrupted/32/462246_2.png) [@TheCorrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/TheCorrupted)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2020, 10:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1070 "2020-10-26T22:09:46Z")
> [@Burner proving grounds as a replacement/relaunch for the old 1v1 arena at the end of abyssal sites](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/burner-proving-grounds-as-a-replacement-for-the-old-1v1-arena-at-the-end-of-abyssal-sites/256913/17): > > This is just stupid DEV at CCP Taking a shortcut with our old proving ground Adding graphics on tops of it Same solarsystem , same spot, same arena They stop the code sending the people in the pit to build a new code that work with those bad formats filaments. From CCP, on DEV stream, they state that both cannot live at the same time From my view, define arena for pit#1 and pit#2 is EASY, not much DEV. 1 to 100 for one content, 101 to 200 for another content. For the old proving ground 15 … ---
**Author:** ![Abyssal\_Hawk](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/abyssal_hawk/32/340421_2.png) [@Abyssal\_Hawk](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Abyssal_Hawk)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2020, 4:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1071 "2020-10-27T16:50:19Z")
btw, the removeal of the old proving grounds was most likely the first time in the entire EVE history where CCP removed a whole feature(or ingame activity) as a whole, without giving an equivalent replace, nor giving good reasons for. This is completely different to the removeal of static DED sites in 2012. Back then CCP gave reasons and an equivalent replace. This is not the case with the old arena. If they decided to give an equivalent replace, they either left the old arenas alone or gave us filaments to get to the old arenas(see the thread @TheCorrupted linked above). From an IT point of view, all CCP had to do was to leave like 20(5 with each visual) of the old arenaspots alone, and then take the code from the old arena, copy it and paste it elsewhere where they wanted it to have and do the stuff they did with the new filaments. That would have taken 5 minutes longer. This would not have had much impact on the events, since there is a queue anyways, and the old arenas were never fully used, but had reserves for some events that increase activity in the abyss. I am not a programmer, but according to what I read in some streams, this could have been the solution. I mean, CCP finds ways to keep low used features like level 5 missions, fobs or ressource wars in game(and yes, even the pos still exists), why not the same for the old proving grounds? And possibly to bring it back, all that is needed is: 1. Copy code from older release 2. Paste it in actual release 3. take away 20 new arenaspots and add them to the old arena code 4. done, in the end we would have 180 spots for the events, 20 for the old arena I dont know if CCP or the CSM still reads that after months, but I assume CCP must have had good reasons for, which some players want to know. If it was low usage, what is with the stuff I put up above. If it was the Ikitursa meta, what is with PVE, where the same ships and fits are getting used for years now? If it was only because the same 15-20 people did it, why didn’t you listen to the players in late 2018/early 2019 and fixed the stuff back then? By the way, I recommend not to do the same thing with Pochven again ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2020, 5:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1072 "2020-10-27T17:09:02Z")
> [@Abyssal\_Hawk](#): > > _most likely the first time in the entire EVE history where CCP removed a whole feature_ > [@Abyssal\_Hawk](#): > > the first time haha … … ahahahahahaha … … AHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA Man, ■■■■ off. 😃 > [@Abyssal\_Hawk](#): > > _From an IT point of view_ … _take the code from the old arena, copy it and paste it elsewhere_ HAHAHAHAA you’re being hilarious 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2020, 5:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1073 "2020-10-27T17:11:49Z")
> [@Sylvia\_Kildare](#): > > The Trigs will use the new 4-4 station model as their HQ in k-space, don’t worry. Their HQ is in the New Eden system. You can look that up in their info. ---
**Author:** ![Abyssal\_Hawk](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/abyssal_hawk/32/340421_2.png) [@Abyssal\_Hawk](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Abyssal_Hawk)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2020, 6:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1074 "2020-10-28T06:43:25Z")
so you find it funny when CCP takes away content people enjoyed? ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2020, 8:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1075 "2020-10-28T08:38:41Z")
I’ve been experiencing CCP removing game-play or features for _over ten years_ … … and _you **seriously** think that one time was “most likely” the first time!_ YOU are being unintentionally hilarious! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Abyssal\_Hawk](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/abyssal_hawk/32/340421_2.png) [@Abyssal\_Hawk](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Abyssal_Hawk)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2020, 8:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1076 "2020-10-28T08:55:38Z")
On the way CCP did, yes 1. CCP gave us no reason why it was taken away 2. There was no replace proof me wrong, but on what kind of features are you referring to? ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2020, 9:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1077 "2020-10-28T09:34:04Z")
What do you mean they gave you no reason? Why did you expect it was a permanent feature in the first place? There was no way _that_ was going to stay! How did you not know this?? Anyhow … yay I can use this: ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/2/4/248588adc750dee56dbfa3f43744399ac8113075.png) - Captains Quarters. 😊 - The ingame-browser. People got upset about this. It’s a feature and was part of peoples’ game-play, because they didn’t have to alt-tab out. That sounds weird and I agree, but it counts. - The ingame-jukebox. People got _very_ upset about this one. - Industrial Teams. No one misses that one, but “being missed” isn’t a requirement here. - SP loss of getting podkilled in an uninsured clone. I hated that one a lot, but that’s _exactly_ what was so good about it. It punished you for a severe mistake, so you better not do that ever again! The only part I wasn’t too fond of was that clone insurance costs went up way too high. - Learning Skills. Counts. Been in the game for a long time and eventually they’ve removed it without replacing the mechanics. It’s probably the dumbest example, but it provided game-play. _(you have to spend time thinking about it and had to buy them. When you lost your pod, you had to rebuy them, etc.)_ - Technically: can-flipping The can-flipping experience was considerably different to that of the suspect state. It was _personal_ between two players (for most practical cases, as can-flipped players most often did not have a corp around to defend them anyway). Suspect state is more of a thing where you’re being punished for “breaking out of the behavioural norm” as if can-flipping was a bad thing. Can-flipping, on the other hand, was \*underlining the fact that stealing loot is perfectly normal behaviour. That’s why I’m including it here. - Technically: The warning you get when you forgot the cargo of a distribution mission. This one is very weird. Most people like this, but that’s because they’re weak. Consider this: You get a distribution mission that takes you ten jumps there and back in a hauler. These ships aren’t particularly quick to align, so a lot of time is sunk into the mission. Back in the old days, _when you forgot the cargo, you had to do the whol trip again_. It was a well deserved punishment for those too careless to be doing their “job” right. _Nowadays_ people get a warning, preventing them from experiencing not only a very important lesson _(stay focussed on what you’re doing)_, but also from the game-play which results from their ■■■■-up. That game-play includes the potential for getting ganked for no reason, too and, of course, the fact that they had to do the same trip again. _Deservedly_ punishing game-play, though, because it’s the players’ fault. I’m sure there’s more, but I never particularly cared about remembering this stuff. The last two are probably a stretch for some, but they’ve _provided game-play_ which got removed and not replaced. No, suspect state is not a replacement for the old can-flipping mechanics. If it was, people wouln’t be complaining about that fact. There. Maybe the definition of “game-play” and “features” is too loose … … but if we tighten it, we’re probably unintentionally removing game-play from the considerations. … and please freshen up on your EVE History. ---
**Author:** ![Tiger\_space\_Thedark](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tiger_space_thedark/32/373728_2.png) [@Tiger\_space\_Thedark](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tiger_space_Thedark)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2020, 10:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1078 "2020-10-28T10:33:38Z")
much elite such ■■■■ wow ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2020, 2:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1079 "2020-10-28T14:51:18Z")
You’re a man of intelligence and wit, it seems. ---
**Author:** ![Gustav\_Mannfred](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gustav_mannfred/32/392828_2.png) [@Gustav\_Mannfred](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gustav_Mannfred)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2020, 4:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1080 "2020-10-28T16:01:11Z")
> [@(Champions) of the Abyss - Results](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/champions-of-the-abyss-results/276540): > > Since there is no discussion topic on that here: [https://www.eveonline.com/article/qivufi/champions-of-the-abyss-the-results?origin=launcher&utm\_medium=app&utm\_source=launcher&utm\_content=en](https://www.eveonline.com/article/qivufi/champions-of-the-abyss-the-results?origin=launcher&utm_medium=app&utm_source=launcher&utm_content=en) From the last few days of the 2nd Cruiser 2v2: You find similar things on the BC 2v2, the Slicer 3v3 and the free for alls, and in timezones with less activity during more popular events such as the frig 1v1. How do you feel about that many people massqueued with alts in empty ships to f… 🤮 ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Azariah](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mike_azariah/32/512626_2.png) [@Mike\_Azariah](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mike_Azariah)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2020, 9:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/1081 "2020-10-28T21:10:09Z")
If we removed the ad hominins this might not be the 1000th post in this overly long thread but I am still trying to keep up m (looking into his coffee) [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073.md?page=49) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073.md?page=51)