# Proving of Kybernauts for Glorification in the Flow Unfolds **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** feedback, official, devblog\ **Created:** [June 29, 2020, 1:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073 "2020-06-29T13:03:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 1\ **Showing post:** 648
**Author:** ![Alterus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/alterus/32/213825_2.png) [@Alterus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Alterus)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2020, 10:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073/648 "2020-07-05T22:26:47Z")
> [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > It’s only become less so because players have asked for that. They wanted war dec changes, bumping changes, and the like. Which players? How many and when were they asked? I certainly didn’t ask for my preferred gameplay to be removed ten years ago, and neither did any other can flipper. > [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > Because while there has always been legitimate highsec PvP, a large part of it was edge case gameplay that many players viewed as being little better than griefing. If highsec aggression games amount to illegitimate “edge case gameplay”, why have stealing in the game at all? The developers could easily remove the ability to steal from wrecks and cans, make MTUs and MDs protected by CONCORD, etc. but they don’t. That indicates that there is a place for highsec troublemakers in the game. I would argue that this kind of gameplay is essential for a vibrant, healthy highsec. > [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > There are other areas of the game where PvP is unfettered, and the players who really wanted PvP action without having to game the system to get around CONCORD and crimewatch could do so. So why spend time on something that’s already in the game somewhere else? Playing around CONCORD and Crimewatch is part of what makes highsec PVP fun for those who enjoy it. There are no criminals without laws and law enforcement, after all. In terms of piloting, highsec PVP is _not_ the same as null or low PVP by any stretch. The methods of selecting ships, fittings, and targets are completely different. As one example, highsec is the only place where Q-ships are regularly a thing, since the appearance of low threat is so important to getting the target to engage. Think of it this way: every MTU, every wreck, every unsecured can of ore, represents an R64 in miniature, a chance for players to fight over resources. This is legitimate, fun gameplay, not griefing. It is also unique to EVE. This is why I believe it should be promoted, not nerfed. > [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > I am aware of it. I know what it is. I don’t have to participate in it daily to understand what it is. I know what null fleet fights are, and I’ve even been in one or two, but that doesn’t qualify me to comment on changes that might affect them. > [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > And, again, I have never heard anybody say that highsec PvP is something you can jump in the game and both reliably and immediately get a fight where you’ve got a reasonable chance of winning. You can’t even guarantee that in nullsec, and we have no rules. If there’s some magic way you’ve figured out how to get highsec PvP content on demand, let me know. Ten years ago, it was reasonably possible to find a viable canflipping target in less than an hour during prime time. Was it as reliable or convenient as an instanced arena? No, but it was better gameplay for the reasons I have already set out. Again, the main issue with instanced PVP isn’t convenience or speed, it’s the effect it will have on the social ecosystem of the game. From the perspective of a bored nullsec resident who doesn’t want to have wait for 30+ minutes to undock for PVP, I can see the appeal. However, there is a larger context to consider here. --- _[View the full topic](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/proving-of-kybernauts-for-glorification-in-the-flow-unfolds/252073)._