# PvE only systems shouldn't be a thing, but -- **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [November 1, 2022, 11:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729 "2022-11-01T23:23:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![x123xxx](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/x123xxx/32/247890_2.png) [@x123xxx](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/x123xxx)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 11:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/109 "2022-12-01T11:57:50Z")
> [@Bladewise](#): > > bait streams Why am I not surprised? * * * > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > is most certainly biased beyond belief. Yes, 99% biased. They’re either unable or unwilling to see another point of view. * * * > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > my primary income comes from trading for example which is not a PvE mechanic EVERYTHING IN THIS GAME IS PVP DUDE!!! j/k 😜 ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 12:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/110 "2022-12-01T12:00:41Z")
FYI, don’t really care to listen to your hyperbole bullcrap. The only thing you’ve ever contributed to this community is post sarcastic troll replies. More importantly, you’ve proven yourself to be nothing more than a lying troll pudknocker desperately trying to instigate a forum flame war… Now you can sod off too… ---
**Author:** ![x123xxx](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/x123xxx/32/247890_2.png) [@x123xxx](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/x123xxx)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 1:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/111 "2022-12-01T13:17:19Z")
Congrats are in order for @Destiny_Corrupted … her new movie is out! * * * ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/e/7/f/e7f7d94802c53533125e256f0b5e36635f7cb94f.jpeg) * * * > **[Troll (2022) - IMDb](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11116912/)** > > Troll: Directed by Roar Uthaug. With Ine Marie Wilmann, Kim Falck, Mads Sjøgård Pettersen, Gard B. Eidsvold. Deep in the Dovre mountain, something gigantic wakes up after a thousand years in captivity. The creature destroys everything in its path and... * * * ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 2:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/112 "2022-12-01T14:47:32Z")
> [@x123xxx](#): > > Which is it, no one is there OR is there 50-man gangs? If you’re completely incapable of metaphor, I guess I can be a bit more direct: null-sec is nearly devoid of anyone who treats EVE Online as an actual game, which necessarily entails the absence of the desire and/or ability to treat each other as content. In a literal sense, null-sec of course has players in it. But that 50-man gang isn’t looking for a fight, or even for a _kill_ (because it knows that I’m not willing to fight it either); it’s just the optimal expression of the intent to ensure that the ISK printers continue operating smoothly. > [@x123xxx](#): > > Been there, done that. Absolutely not. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > And you’ll continue to have zero evidence as I have no reason to provide any. I don’t need to justify myself to you, and the fact that this is what you guys keep falling back to suggests you aren’t discussing in good faith. You’re the one who keeps bragging about all the stuff you do. If you didn’t make those claims all the time, we wouldn’t be asking for evidence. But if you insist on constantly bragging without backing it up, we’ll keep calling it out to publicly embarrass you. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Fact is I do lowsec and nullsec roams, some highsec wars, some structure bashing, etc. Yeah, I’m sure that goes really well with > [@So when does the new mechanic for ganking and standings drops take effect?](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-when-does-the-new-mechanic-for-ganking-and-standings-drops-take-effect/385377/391): > > Neither would I, and as I’ve pointed out multiple times, my main is an industry guy that had most of his combat skills wiped when skill injectors were released. > [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > They aren’t forced to shoot rocks, or engage in any PvE. You can’t necessarily bank on income from combat PvP but my primary income comes from trading for example which is not a PvE mechanic and is comparatively low effort. That’s great, but by its very nature trading isn’t an activity that everyone can generate income from, and the more people that engage in it, the less they all make. In practical terms, the majority of PvPers are effectively _required_ to do PvE. Yet you find this completely fine. Why? If you want PvE players to not be susceptible to forced PvP, PvP players shouldn’t be susceptible to forced PvE either. How about we start by seeding the market with free ships and modules in order to accomplish this? Then PvP players can concentrate on fighting each other, while PvE players can focus on their PvE content in peace. I think it’s a reasonable compromise. > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > FYI, don’t really care to listen to your hyperbole bullcrap. The only thing you’ve ever contributed to this community is post sarcastic troll replies. > > More importantly, you’ve proven yourself to be nothing more than a lying troll pudknocker desperately trying to instigate a forum flame war… > > Now you can sod off too… For someone who’s made threats of real-life violence against other community members, you’re quite inclined to talk about how bad other people are. It’s much more likely that the reason why you don’t want to listen is because you know that you have nothing rational to say in response. That’s the thing with you carebears, isn’t it? You all brag about all the stuff you do and have accomplished, but there’s never much substance in what you try to convey to other people aside from the expression of your autonomic desire to be continuously fed and kept warm underneath the wing of the motherly authority figure. ---
**Author:** ![Bladewise](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bladewise/32/394387_2.png) [@Bladewise](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bladewise)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 2:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/113 "2022-12-01T14:52:50Z")
I know you’re lying because you refuse to prove it and had you done any of this you’d have a much better disposition. The fact of the matter is an actual knowledgeable PvP capable pilot wouldn’t be scared to post on their main (like myself, hell I even tell you who my alts are, ■■■■ at this point I’ve given y’all enough information to find me irl lol). Face it Lucas, your lack of any spine is all the proof we need that you’re nothing but an angry, entitled, manchild, carebear forum troll. ---
**Author:** ![Bladewise](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bladewise/32/394387_2.png) [@Bladewise](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bladewise)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 3:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/114 "2022-12-01T15:13:08Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Fact is I do lowsec and nullsec roams, some highsec wars, some structure bashing, You mean you’ve done a lowsec roam before in a cheap frigate in a 20 man fleet. You mean you did an NPSI fleet in null sec and whored on a couple killmails. Structure bashing isn’t worth mentioning. You don’t PvP and we can tell. Also, you don’t really need to post on your main. We can tell you’re lying/stretching the truth because your attitude projects how little experience you have. I’ve heard so many entitled crybears here and in game that I can tell pretty easily what activities you ACTUALLY participate in by your attitude and understanding of game mechanics. FWIW I’d assume you run HS missions all day if you even play anymore. I’d say abyssals but I don’t think you have the combat skills just judging by how much you cry about ganking. ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 3:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/116 "2022-12-01T15:47:03Z")
a dog knows if you are a dog or a sheep or a sailor knows another sailor wen one comes with an elaborate story those who live the day to day reality can read between the lines and most of the time identify if its legit or not ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 3:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/117 "2022-12-01T15:58:39Z")
> [@x123xxx](#): > > There are none, pretty simple. Er, your arrival on the thread was precisely why I made the comment about “people who haven’t a clue what the penalties and consequences for ganking actually are.” ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 4:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/118 "2022-12-01T16:13:53Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > If PvE players should be able to be forced into PvP against their will, why should you not be forced into PvE against yours? Double standard? The usual Lucas hypocrisy and twisting of things. There is really no such thing as a pure ‘PvE Player’. Not only because most people do PvE _and_ PvP, but also because large areas of supposed PvE merge with PvP. Mining is one such merge, as you are actually competing for resources with other players. And the ‘against their will’ bit is pure Lucas double standards…as belt rats daily gank miners totally against the will of those miners. In fact _more_ noob Ventures are lost to NPCs than to actual players ! None of the noobs losing Ventures in such manner ‘willed’ the belt rats to appear. CCP are effectively ganking their own players…so why shouldn’t anyone else ? As Bladewise commented earlier…and worth repeating… _“You do not have the perspective required to offer any valuable insight on PvP topics and even here are only presenting lies and misinformation that fit your narrative”_ ---
**Author:** ![x123xxx](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/x123xxx/32/247890_2.png) [@x123xxx](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/x123xxx)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 4:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/119 "2022-12-01T16:25:08Z")
Nothing worth replying to, honestly. The topic is “PvE only systems”, which should be all of **Empire Space**. We pay taxes and expect better security. CCP will eventually lock all -10’s of of HS and disable the safety button…as they should. Crying won’t save ganking, you guys need to learn a new skill. * * * ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/0/7/4/0743b1c3ef16b3ef13272fe40df035dd82c02901.gif) * * * ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 4:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/120 "2022-12-01T16:29:12Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > They aren’t forced to shoot rocks, or engage in any PvE. A totally dishonest perspective, given that PvE lies at the very heart of the highsec ganking mechanic. I mean, it is a PvE response in the form of Concord that destroys ganker ships. The entire gank is centred around PvE response times. It is a PvE mechanic that demands ratting or clone tags to raise security status again. Even things like pulling Concord…a PvE mechanic. Your division of things as if everything were just pure PvE or PvP is just utmost dishonesty. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 5:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/121 "2022-12-01T17:02:04Z")
> [@Bladewise](#): > > an actual knowledgeable PvP capable pilot wouldn’t be scared to post on their main Yah, people who PvP are proud of it and want to share. None of them hide behind an alt and pretend they have some super secret mystery PvP going on. ---
**Author:** ![Kezrai\_Charzai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kezrai_charzai/32/394578_2.png) [@Kezrai\_Charzai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kezrai_Charzai)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 5:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/122 "2022-12-01T17:06:29Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > Now if you’re just hypothesizing by looking at KB records, then you obviously aren’t seeing the complete picture. True enough, I can’t prove it with published data. That’s why the post you’re replying to essentially states I’m supposing it from looking at a lot of KB records. I also got interested enough in the HS kills issue: data vs. perception notion to post an entire thread looking at the stats. And concluded what you’ve pointed out here - that the data we have available outside of CCP isn’t sufficient to determine the state of HS ganking with regards to new players, low value kills, etc. There’s too many variables that only CCP has access to. That said, long experience with the game, and lots of data reviewed, has led me to believe ganking is more likely to lose players _after_ they’ve played for a few months - not newbies. (Note: this was not my original opinion on the issue. I originally expected that players getting ganked in their first few weeks would be a thing.) Once they’ve put some time and ISK into something they think is going to be “a new stage” of the game for them (first hauler, first barge, first BS, whatever) and _then_ get ganked… that’s when I see players saying “Screw this I’m out”. I’d also point out that never seen conflicting data posted - either hundreds of legit newbie killmails in say a month’s time, or frequent forum posters or even help channel commenters saying “My Heron/Venture/Coercer/Moa just got ganked, I’m out”. I _have_ seen examples of those, just not in substantial numbers. Again, I freely admit - these are my opinions, not facts. My own personal conclusion was that the ganking in high sec issue needs further looking into on CCP’s part (they have the data), but that the effect it has might not be the obvious one people think of. Even if my own view is correct (ganking focuses on not-new but not-vet players), that may turn out to be significant in it’s own way. These are players who got past the startup phase, got interested enough to play more and probably pay… and _then_ potentially lose their early stake in the game to some bored vet ganker. Which could potentially be costing EVE more valuable players than random newbies. ---
**Author:** ![Kezrai\_Charzai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kezrai_charzai/32/394578_2.png) [@Kezrai\_Charzai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kezrai_Charzai)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 5:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/123 "2022-12-01T17:24:27Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > There were no “PvP players” or “PvE players” fifteen years ago; there were just “players.” I recall quite a few ganker/griefer/PvPer vs. carebear/farmer/PVEer threads from quite far back in the day. Perhaps your memory isn’t what it used to be, or perhaps you’re just making crap up on the spot to support your agenda (as usual). And, let’s be honest here… the type of PvP players EVE attracts were never really into “fighting each other over and over again”. EVE attracts a certain type of PvP because it’s designed and advertised in a certain way - that hasn’t changed in 15 years. ‘Griefers’ vs. ‘carebears’, circa 2006: [https://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=438694&page=1](https://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=438694&page=1) ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 5:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/124 "2022-12-01T17:31:12Z")
Yeah, I pretty much agree with everything you said… in both posted replies!!! ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 5:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/125 "2022-12-01T17:45:58Z")
> [@Kezrai\_Charzai](#): > > ‘carebears’, circa 2006: so the carebears are complaining for 16 years dammmm ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 6:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/126 "2022-12-01T18:06:07Z")
They’ve always complained, pretty much since the first day. The difference between back then and today is that in the past they were nearly universally ostracized for complaining, while today the non-complainers are in such a small minority that they’re effectively viewed as social deviants by everyone else. Players back then were also generally much more inclined to fight in various situations and scenarios than they are today, instead of sitting there and just taking it, or rage-quitting on the spot. Doing wars back in the day was actually much more difficult than it is today, for example. Target groups would routinely put together gangs to try and kill us, and sometimes succeeded, or were at least able to camp us in, denying us content and making us shift away from them because they were perceived as too hard to be worth the effort. Meanwhile, today I can fly around and get dozens of kills in a Venture because they simply give up instantly. The amount of times I’ve caught targets, and then realized that they could’ve easily killed my tackle-heavy setup had they only fought back, is staggering. ---
**Author:** ![Bladewise](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bladewise/32/394387_2.png) [@Bladewise](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bladewise)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 6:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/128 "2022-12-01T18:20:33Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > And this began in earnest when CCP first released high-sec incursions, which led to the first **major** wave of ganking/wardec complaints from the wave of turbo-farmers that infested the game like cockroaches at that time. It also marks the start of plex prices going completely bonkers. I’m pretty sure we’re still paying a pretty hefty fee because of the inflation caused by overly safe Incursions. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 6:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/129 "2022-12-01T18:21:02Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > Wait, are you classifying yourself and other pro-gankers as “non-complainers”? That’s a laugh, all you lot do is complain about other people having opinions you don’t like. As always, make sure to provide clear examples when making such accusations. ---
**Author:** ![Bladewise](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bladewise/32/394387_2.png) [@Bladewise](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bladewise)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2022, 6:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729/130 "2022-12-01T18:23:53Z")
> [@Lucas\_Kell](#): > > all you lot do is complain about other people having opinions you don’t like. Carebears rarely present opinions regarding this topic. I don’t actually think you’ve presented a single one. Rather, they present lies they’ve gaslit themselves into believing. You can’t have an opinion that contradicts a known fact. That’s not an opinion afterall, rather a **delusion**. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729.md?page=5) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-only-systems-shouldnt-be-a-thing-but/382729.md?page=7)