# PvE Roundtable - Saturday 31st of March **URL:** \ **Category:** Assembly Hall\ **Created:** [March 15, 2018, 5:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188 "2018-03-15T17:56:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 11:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/203 "2018-03-29T23:35:31Z")
May be something a bit unrelated, but I think modules of tech I origin should turn into scrap metal if they are burned completely. Would bring demand for them somewhat higher, still being quite cheap, but not dirt cheap. Also meta modules production please. ---
**Author:** ![elitatwo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elitatwo/32/373473_2.png) [@elitatwo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/elitatwo)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2018, 12:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/204 "2018-03-30T00:19:25Z")
> [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > I think modules of tech I origin should turn into scrap metal if they are burned completely. Then by all means, all faction, deadspace and officer ones too, > [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > Also meta modules production please. Yep, why you want a module when you can just do missions in all four empires to get the materials you need and be killed on your way back to make the modules that could have been used to not be killed on your way to do missions to get the materials you need to make one module. Why have it easy, when you can make it complicated amirite? ---
**Author:** ![Jin\_taan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jin_taan/32/381307_2.png) [@Jin\_taan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jin_taan)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2018, 1:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/205 "2018-03-30T01:02:35Z")
Yup, I always list EVE times. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2018, 3:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/206 "2018-03-30T15:37:55Z")
> [@elitatwo](#): > > Then by all means, all faction, deadspace and officer ones too, I mean those should be excluded as some advanced meta modules that could be repaired. Scrap metal only for those that are named with compact and scoped and such, and tech 1. ---
**Author:** ![Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/chainsaw_plankton/32/256180_2.png) [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Chainsaw_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 6:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/207 "2018-03-31T06:36:09Z")
> [@Jin\_taan](#): > > Whilst this might be your personal, subjective opinion, the stats very much do not back you up - they’ve been consistently one of the more popular PvE activities and continue to be so. I think the events are popular when they are new as the rewards are most valuable then, but people either get bored or the rewards drop in value as the event goes on. Also there’s usually been pretty decent gaps between events, seems like they are getting more and more frequent. > [@Jin\_taan](#): > > Also I must say that this thread is doing a marvellous job of showing just how hard CCP’s job here is, as even players who enjoy the current PvE do not agree on what is fun about it, or what even makes PvE worth running. I’m trying to pick out common trains of thought, but the only major one is “Must be equivelant or better than L4 payouts to appeal to L4 runners”. For sure. What I would like to note is that you can choose between things like full clears or blitzing for a bunch of missions, although a bunch of blitzes got broken/nerfed. > [@Jin\_taan](#): > > If you think RW & FoBs weren’t designed based on large scale player surveys where they attempted to - using as many resources as they could - find out what players thought PvE should be, i.e, Challenging, Dynamic, Unpredictable & Rewarding - You’re hopelessly naive about how companies work. Hell, my last roundtable of 30~ people had a hard consensus that what they wanted was more Social PvE that had a lower barrier of entry. I want that too, but it has to pay. There’s also the issue of focus groups going for big cool ideas that don’t actually work. or you get so much advice that goes in so many directions the result is super bland and uninteresting. There’s an episode of The Simpsons where homer designs a car, it’s a bunch of things that sound cool, but the end product is completely unmarketable. > [@Erethond](#): > > Similar to missions: sit still and shoot red crosses that never challenge you is boring. Then the only thing that is engaging is wondering how big you can make that tick and that leads to the over-focus on isk/hr. If a game is fun, you can play it without worrying about amassing resources because it’s fun. Take any game that you just play one-off sessions. If a game is a grind, then the only incentive is the pleasure of getting the reward, so people focus on the reward. Make things fun! not fun and not rewarding, that’s no good, might get a play through by a few people out of curiosity but it’s not going to catch on. (guristas anomic base) fun and not rewarding it’s good for a number of plays, then it gets boring and there’s nothing to bring you back (destiny 2) rewarding but not fun, people will grind it, but probably burn out. A bunch will stick with it to grind wealth (I think most eve pve falls here) fun and rewarding gold mine! willing to take suggestions for what goes here. > [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > I propose to include escalation mechanics to missions. Sort of randomly appearing “mini epic arcs”. that could be cool > [@Buoytender\_Bob](#): > > Creating a mission generator that determines opponent,style of objective, variation within mission level toughness to complete, and reward. Now, I can hear the bitzers and mini/maxers screaming “but, but!..”, so make them like the anomic/burner missions: add them to increase the total number of missions and make them no penalty for rejection. Maybe we could give them a specific objective so there would be blitz potential. And/or specific descriptors to know which are good for blitzing or full clearing. I also think that just being somewhat random isn’t necessarily interesting, as long as it is within normal mission levels I mean what difference is it really from normal missions? Plus or minus a handful of npc ships to kill, is it really worth spending however long it takes to make a system to do that? > [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > One thing, why do so many people hate the agency window? > > I like it as a one stop shop for all the PvE stuff, including the map. There are two things to be improved, agent filter/search and performance. The old agent finder was bad UX, but the new lacks options (range restrictions, and no filter for available to me). Just too much stuff in one place, also don’t really care for the star map being in the window. I’d much rather just get a location and then scout it on dotlan, or with the full in game map. And like you say there’s a handful of filters it could use. sec status, storyline, available to me, better range filter. Then when they moved incursions from the journal to the agency they dropped a bunch of info I’ve also heard of some issues with escalations, but I don’t run those > [@Erethond](#): > > Actually, looking at the MER, it’s everyone’s income that has increased a lot (isk in keeps rising) while production is steady. The effect is that everyone has more money to spend but there are not more goods, therefore what goods we have increase in price. Giving players even more money will do nothing but further increase the prices. The right way to address this is to increase production/drops, but of course, that will reduce the income of people who get the drops/make the goods. not quite. Production has almost always outpaced destruction, so while we have more isk there are also more goods available, and prices in general have almost always been going down in eve. Very recently CCP changed moon mining and introduced a new class of citadel, this massively changed moon goo, salvage, and PI prices. I believe these are all in the secondary producer index in the MER. This recent activity has been the only blip of inflation in years, the last blip showing up when CCP changed mineral costs of almost all ships. All things considered prices are still pretty dang low in general. You can see in this image from the latest Monthly Economic Report. ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/2/9/29d23d0d9c1d100b6169833622ae8952fbdde807.png) beyond that there are some smaller price changes, like when CCP rebalanced t3cs most of the medium faction/deadspace loot jumped in price for a while as people came up with new fits. And now with the AF rebalance many frigate sized mods have increased in price. And of course LP store prices change depending on what’s going on with incursions and FW. > [@Iwo\_Sh\_ivah](#): > > Ai that point you’re partially right. If you only look at the mission payouts they haven’t change for years. Meanwhile Dull sec is pulling staggering amounts of isk with mining an ratting, and its hard to cope with that when u live in HS. Introduction of marauders made isk/hr slightly better but it’s still nothing compared to current dullsec payouts. > > Only consolation is that it created bigger demand on stuff which resulted in contionous rise of prices of, for example, deadspace loot that we farm in HS. Mission payouts haven’t changed, but ship strengths and player tactics have changed making overall income higher. Then between burners and incursions I’d say highsec is in a very competitive place with null. I can make more in highsec than most players can make in null. If you can’t well that’s on you, adapt or die. > [@Penance\_Toralen](#): > > In 2010 the price of a Ferox was about 15mil. Today it is around 50mil. > > Over the same period of time, the ISK and LP rewards of missions are static having never changed. Not exactly what DeMichael said, but it will do. in 2007 I bought a t2 bcu for 10m as that was the price, now they are 900k, everything is cheaper now! /s for real though scroll up a little bit on this post and read the bit about the CPI > [@elitatwo](#): > > I think they are talking about their imagined sales of LP and are assuming the LP store I work for has stuff that is worth selling. > > The thing is this LP store has stuff but the tags you would need to get the stuff drop nowhere in the game, so my 3 million LP won’t do you much but help me get a +3 or +5% implant every now and then. > > So there is this one guy in EVE that sells every LP for 6 trillion isk or something are calculates some 5000000 bazillion isk per second in revenue, now EVERYONE will do this since there is no other way and when he does it, EVERYONE does it and since EVERYONE earns 5000000 bazillion isk per second, 500 million isk HACs are much cheap or something. which LP store do you work for? I really doubt what you are saying. also there’s nothing preventing you from switching corps. If you are just now realizing it isn’t a good corp to work for well the rational thing to do would involve switching. the 200m/hr number is with SoE and is probably the easiest LP store in game to convert. > [@Sean\_Roach](#): > > Then imagine the windfall as you find a long forgotten portion of the game, complete it, and find yourself a good chunk of a billion ISK richer there’s a few COSMOS missions that drop shiny implants and/or blueprints. so some content like that may be around. well that got long, yall post too much 😛 ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 6:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/208 "2018-03-31T06:39:11Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > The sites are gated, which means -10 criminals cannot enter and reach a target without the faction police exploding them. They are like mining mission sites in that regard, essentially immune from criminals. -10 security status is easily fixed with Security Tags. Suicide Gank characters can and will do criminal actions without being -10 so those event sites and mission sites as well do not make players immune to attack. ---
**Author:** ![Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/chainsaw_plankton/32/256180_2.png) [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Chainsaw_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 6:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/209 "2018-03-31T06:51:44Z")
I’d guess the standings gating and ship restrictions are more limiting than sec status for ganking resource war runners. It takes the faction police a while to show up, so -10s can move around pretty well in highsec. that said it’s still kinda hard to believe ganking is a huge problem with RW as opposed to everything else that has been gone over above. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 6:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/210 "2018-03-31T06:57:29Z")
I don’t know if it actually happens or not. I haven’t tried Resource Wars because the rewards is crap. However I do know that those who constantly say ‘bla bla bla can’t happen due to being -10’ are only talking sheit. ---
**Author:** ![elitatwo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elitatwo/32/373473_2.png) [@elitatwo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/elitatwo)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 7:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/211 "2018-03-31T07:06:00Z")
> [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](#): > > the 200m/hr number is with SoE Those SOE agents want me to shoot my Amarr buddies, so that’s a hard no. But can you point me to the missions that pay 200 million isk in bounty? I will give those a try. I do not know any level 4 mission that pay 200 million in bounty. Call me intrigued. The time it takes to complete a Worlds Collide or Angel Extravaganza is more than an hour. Then I head back to the agent and get my Noctis to collect metal scraps and some salvage. Worlds Collide pay around 40 million isk in bounty and Angel Extravaganza pays 45 million isk. The collection iof salvage and metal scraps pays zero isk but I don’t have to buy t1 rigs, so yeay. > [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](#): > > while we have more isk there are also more goods available Well that would be cool but the bounty payout of Angel Extravaganza or Worlds Collide did not change and remains the same. However you may be right that everything is cheaper. I only have to do 2000 level 4 missions to by the same stuff for more isk than ever before. Battleships are an awesome example. Insurance only costs 55 million and if you don’t fit it, you almost get 70% of the buy price back when you lose it. Looking at it, command ships only cost 4 times as much as before, so they almost did not increase in price. Looking at HAC price tags makes me dizzy. And I only have to do more than 5 times as much pve to do 99% less pvp. Prices are almost good. ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 7:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/212 "2018-03-31T07:14:36Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > -10 security status is easily fixed with Security Tags. Suicide Gank characters can and will do criminal actions without being -10 so those event sites and mission sites as well do not make players immune to attack. I never said they were immune, at least in L1 sites (although arguably they are in the higher ones), but they are immune from criminals (in the -10 outlaw sense; and if I wasn’t clear on that I take your point and apologize for not being clearer). That makes them some of the safest sites in the game as most characters that mess with miners are outlaws. Security status may be easily fixed with tags, but they aren’t cheap. No one is going to tag-up to shoot a Venture in a L1 resource wars site just like practically no one uses security tags to tag-up so they can enter mining mission sites and shoot miners there. There are Ventures all over the place to shoot if you want and they rarely have anything of value, and probably never are worth spending hundreds of millions of ISK on clone soldier tags just to explode. It may be quick to fix security status these days but you have to pay others for their time to collect those tags. That large cost serves its purpose as a financial disincentive to mess with non-combatants in highsec as intended. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 7:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/213 "2018-03-31T07:22:54Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > No one is going to tag-up to shoot a Venture in a L1 resource wars site just like practically no one uses security tags to tag-up so they can enter mining mission sites and shoot miners there. Saying it doesn’t happen or that no one is ever going to do it is incorrect, especially when increasing KM stats is usually the prime directive. ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 7:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/214 "2018-03-31T07:32:28Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > Saying it doesn’t happen or that no one is ever going to do it is incorrect, especially when increasing KM stats is usually the prime directive. You assume a lot. I would wager ISK that if CCP is able to collect the statistics we would see that zero, or a number statistically indistinguishable from it, people have been ganked in a Resource Wars site in the last 90 days. Yes, there is theoretically a risk if you want to be pedantic, but they are still the safest sites ever put into the game, and require the most effort/cost to PvP there than anywhere else, so it is really border-line insane to claim that safety was a factor in why they failed. I think all reasonable people here will agree that Dryson’s assertion that Resource Wars failed because there were too open to attack by gankers is unequivocally wrong. There were several much more serious problems that kept them from being successful and a widely-used mechanic than the fact that even though they were mechanically the safest sites ever put into the game, there was still a theoretical window for a determined attacker to score a kill at great financial cost. If that was the case, how come people do the other PvE in highsec, all of which is much more risky that the gated site design that Resource Wars uses? ---
**Author:** ![Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/chainsaw_plankton/32/256180_2.png) [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Chainsaw_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 7:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/215 "2018-03-31T07:34:19Z")
> [@elitatwo](#): > > Those SOE agents want me to shoot my Amarr buddies, so that’s a hard no. > > But can you point me to the missions that pay 200 million isk in bounty? I will give those a try. > > I do not know any level 4 mission that pay 200 million in bounty. Call me intrigued. > > The time it takes to complete a Worlds Collide or Angel Extravaganza is more than an hour. Then I head back to the agent and get my Noctis to collect metal scraps and some salvage. > > Worlds Collide pay around 40 million isk in bounty and Angel Extravaganza pays 45 million isk. > > The collection iof salvage and metal scraps pays zero isk but I don’t have to buy t1 rigs, so yeay. you can decline the kill amarr missions and while you are at it decline the worlds collides and angel extravaganza too. Just run the burners and a few other missions. With good social skills and faction standings you can decline almost every normal mission, and the few I accept pay very well. You post on the forums enough I’m sure you’ve seen a post with more details and oh yea you’ve seen the post, but you dismissed it right away rather than trying it. (or deliberately tried to spread misinformation) > [@Blitz and Burner Guide v1.2.3](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/blitz-and-burner-guide-v1-2-3/8974/48): > > This is very misleading and states the following: Make 5 accounts Buy 300 billion isk worth of cheat-stix Make trade alt Make 3x mission alt Make pvp alt with infinite isk Make raid LP for SOE launchers and probes and sell with trade alt Make trade alt use software scripted hax to make isk by magic Then and only then you get to your “200 million per hour”. > [@elitatwo](#): > > Well that would be cool but the bounty payout of Angel Extravaganza or Worlds Collide did not change and remains the same. > > However you may be right that everything is cheaper. I only have to do 2000 level 4 missions to by the same stuff for more isk than ever before. > > Battleships are an awesome example. Insurance only costs 55 million and if you don’t fit it, you almost get 70% of the buy price back when you lose it. > > Looking at it, command ships only cost 4 times as much as before, so they almost did not increase in price. Looking at HAC price tags makes me dizzy. > > And I only have to do more than 5 times as much pve to do 99% less pvp. Prices are almost good. Like I just said mission running tactics have changed, and most mission running ships have been buffed over the years. Plus burners pay out a ton of isk + lp. If you still don’t like mission payouts maybe go try incursions. And you are looking at prices of specific items, you have to look at a large basket of items, sure a bunch of hulls have gone up and down in price over the years, but many of the fittings have mainly trended down. And as I said in an earlier post many of the t2/salvage/pi markets got jacked up with the Moon mining changes, that’s going to be a short run blip, long run I expect the prices to start heading down again. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 8:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/216 "2018-03-31T08:25:20Z")
I’m not gonna debate if it does or doesn’t happen because I don’t know one way or the other. Personally I don’t care what sort of stats CCP would present, nobody can verify it and because of that, CCP can say whatever they want. I merely stated there are tools available to easily get rid of -10 security status and that criminal actions are done by characters regardless of their security status. You assume a lot by speaking for all gankers in the game when you say it will never happen. The fact that hardly anybody runs the sites is mainly due to crap rewards and secondly, those sites force players to do mining. Now why is that? Why is CCP so hell bent on having players do mining? More importantly why make it require a fleet op to complete those sites? Now if those sites had great rewards like the other event sites, then a lot more players would be doing them. And if that was the case, there would be some sort of awox / gank attempts being done on those running the sites, despite the accelerator gate restrictions to gain entry. Why? Because there would be a fleet of mining ships all gathered together in one place that’s easily located. Basically we’re talking fish in a barrel. Adding Resource Wars to the game because players wanted more Social PvE content in Eve? Maybe my Tinfoil hat is on a bit tight right now but that just sounds like a crock. And those 30 players who said it at a previous roundtable don’t represent the playerbase, they definitely don’t represent me or the player I know. Hell I can easily find 30 players to say they want more solo PvE content. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 8:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/217 "2018-03-31T08:28:15Z")
> [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](#): > > I think the events are popular when they are new as the rewards are most valuable then, but people either get bored or the rewards drop in value as the event goes on. Also there’s usually been pretty decent gaps between events, seems like they are getting more and more frequent. The events are still the single most profitable PvE in highsec, including all of their aspects. Plus they require minimal effort, undock, run site, snatch reward, dock up, 5-10min. I don’t see a decline in popularity, rather the opposite, uncontested sites in my area are rare even late in the events. … before people want to give me advice, I run them on purpose in the most crowded areas because site completion time is much faster and I get the loot anyway. ---
**Author:** ![elitatwo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elitatwo/32/373473_2.png) [@elitatwo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/elitatwo)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 1:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/218 "2018-03-31T13:12:29Z")
> [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](#): > > Just run the burners and a few other missions I did try them. It cost me 88 million isk, so I will not do them again. > [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](#): > > most mission running ships have been buffed over the years Which ships would you include it that? > [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](#): > > If you still don’t like mission payouts maybe go try incursions. I did. Turns out 536700857657956767567256956706 characters on grid confuse me too much and I cannot focus anymore. Those incursion Sanshas are so very weird and do things only blood raiders or guristas would and a few of them do more damage than a 500 character machariel gang. > [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](#): > > burners pay out a ton of isk + lp Only if you can complete them. My agent does not want me to complete them but go on a roam in lowsec. 12 jumps is a long way and on my way there, I make 0 isk per hour or any time frame. I still have little to no use for my millions of LP and I will not move to high populated areas. > [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](#): > > mission running tactics have changed You mean, since one guy sold all of its 2 SOE LP for 400 trillion isk, it is now they way of doing things. There is no other. Everyone must comply. If you do not sell your LP for 400 trillion isk you suck so bad and should go home and biomass amirite. ---
**Author:** ![Jin\_taan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jin_taan/32/381307_2.png) [@Jin\_taan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jin_taan)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2018, 10:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/219 "2018-03-31T22:02:20Z")
[Hey all, here’s the recording of the roundtable](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7Ab5nLqRUE) ---
**Author:** ![Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/chainsaw_plankton/32/256180_2.png) [@Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Chainsaw_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2018, 6:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/220 "2018-04-01T18:01:44Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > The events are still the single most profitable PvE in highsec, including all of their aspects. Plus they require minimal effort, undock, run site, snatch reward, dock up, 5-10min. > > I don’t see a decline in popularity, rather the opposite, uncontested sites in my area are rare even late in the events. … before people want to give me advice, I run them on purpose in the most crowded areas because site completion time is much faster and I get the loot anyway. not 100% sold on that, sure when they have nice drops like the current event’s c3-x BCU they can remain valuable, but with most of the events the accelerator and skin values drop rapidly as the event goes on. Usually better off blitzing missions or running incursions and buying a few accelerators than running the sites. > [@elitatwo](#): > > I did try them. It cost me 88 million isk, so I will not do them again. it’s cost me more, I also have a series of cap stable fits that should be hard to lose. Can find them in this forum post. [Burner Mission - Ship advice to solo them including fittings - #7 by Chainsaw\_Plankton](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/burner-mission-ship-advice-to-solo-them-including-fittings/9580/7) > [@elitatwo](#): > > Which ships would you include it that? Almost every ship has been buffed via ship tiericide, the pirate ships gained huge buffs along the way, and nearly every weapon system has gotten a positive balance patch at some point, damage boosts, cap reductions, range boosts, and the t2 ammo boosts. If we want to go way back most missions were in game before rigs were a thing, so just adding the rig slots was a pretty big buff to mission ships. There have been a few nerfs over that time too, but I feel in general mission ships have gotten stronger over time. > [@elitatwo](#): > > I did. Turns out 536700857657956767567256956706 characters on grid confuse me too much and I cannot focus anymore. > > Those incursion Sanshas are so very weird and do things only blood raiders or guristas would and a few of them do more damage than a 500 character machariel gang. can’t blame you there, I tried some myself and wasn’t a fan. > [@elitatwo](#): > > Only if you can complete them. My agent does not want me to complete them but go on a roam in lowsec. 12 jumps is a long way and on my way there, I make 0 isk per hour or any time frame. > > I still have little to no use for my millions of LP and I will not move to high populated areas. yea the burner spawn’s are a bit wonky, can go to the next constellation so it’s a lot easier to end up in lowsec compared to normal missions. It also tries to find empty systems so it will probably try and send you to that lowsec often. > [@elitatwo](#): > > You mean, since one guy sold all of its 2 SOE LP for 400 trillion isk, it is now they way of doing things. > > There is no other. Everyone must comply. If you do not sell your LP for 400 trillion isk you suck so bad and should go home and biomass amirite. You can check the market history for prices and trade volume and figure out what the historical isk/lp conversions have been. The LP store costs don’t change, and the mineral basket to build items usually stays pretty constant, but if you really wanted you could calculate it with those prices included too. SOE has mostly been between 1200-2000 isk/lp Right now it’s mostly in the 1200-1500 range. you used to have to build your own spreadsheet to figure out isk/lp but now [LP Store - Return on ISK](https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/lpstore/) does it all for you. It’s usually accurate but can have some lag if prices are rapidly changing. ---
**Author:** ![elitatwo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elitatwo/32/373473_2.png) [@elitatwo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/elitatwo)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2018, 9:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/221 "2018-04-01T21:24:43Z")
Cheers man, appreciate it. ---
**Author:** ![Kiddoomer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kiddoomer/32/260329_2.png) [@Kiddoomer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kiddoomer)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 10:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188/222 "2018-04-02T10:39:20Z")
I listened to the roundtable and there’s something I would like to talk about the scout sites that hasn’t been mentionned. I personaly don’t mind the logis, with one to 3 ships I can shoot through as long as the target is correcly slowed down and focused, but I have a big issue with the ECM ships. Scout sites are for 3 to 5 five players, but you can have up to 3 ECM ships against you in scout sites. Any kind of remote rep/cp is horrible to do, leaving purely self-repairing drone ships or marauder viable imo, which is not at all how the vanguard assault and HQ work. A minor thing to add is that there is bit too much HP to munch through on average, takes more time for less isk with less choices of fleet viable to run them [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188.md?page=10) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/pve-roundtable-saturday-31st-of-march/63188.md?page=12)