# So, here is what I think is the actual reason why most new players quit after playing the new player experiance: **URL:** \ **Category:** Player Features & Ideas\ **Created:** [December 5, 2021, 6:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165 "2021-12-05T06:05:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 11:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165/61 "2021-12-06T23:45:12Z")
> [@Uriel\_the\_Flame](#): > > Not sure how true that claim is about players who get ganked early in their career tend to stay for longer. It isn’t and also isn’t what CCP claimed either, it’s a misrepresentation of CCP by players. What CCP said was that in their study of under 30 day players, those that stayed at least the whole 30 days had a (slightly) higher correlation of also having been exposed to PvP in some way, be it consensual or gank. This does not mean that ganking makes players stay longer, and also does not rule out that ganking drives players away, as it doesn’t correct the stats for other variables such as overall play time that make players that stay more likely to experience PvP overall anyway. Though I will allow that it hints that PvP exposure doesn’t impact on retention negatively. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 12:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165/62 "2021-12-07T00:44:18Z")
> [@Jumpdrive](#): > > I’d aim for enough newbie skills, so that if someone engages in a generally favorable matchup, a character skill difference alone cannot be sufficient for the target to brute force their way out of it. If everything between two players is equal, but one has 1% higher dps because of a skill, then the player with higher dps wins the fight. Ergo the only way to satisfy your aim is by making every player fully trained from day one. Your idea about schools is basically picking a ‘class’ which they’ve deliberately tried to avoid. A new player is a blank slate with infinite choice. By giving them ‘classes’ you would be forcing them to make a choice before they even know _how_ to make that choice and it would also be a choice they can’t take back. And whilst i almost agreed to giving new players Tech2 weapons out of the box because i appreciate how useful that flexibility is, i remembered that new players shouldn’t be using expensive gear like Tech2 mods because more expensive losses means fewer re-ships and/or more time spent grinding. New players should focus less on winning fights and more on learning the game and making allies. The best advice from veteran players has always been ‘_buy tons of cheap ships and **lose** them in fights_’ and never ‘_you need more bling_’. CCP already upped the starting SP from roughly 55,000 to 450,000. They gave you instant access to prop mods, warp disruptors and webs…items you used to have to buy skill books for and train from zero. You used to have to train weapon support skills like surgical strike and rapid fire from zero. Fitting skills from level 2 instead of 4 like now… Its not like i don’t think new starters could do with more skills. Like making Alphas wait over a week before they can use 5 drones and thus fill a Tristan’s drone bandwidth properly seems ridiculous to me, they should just start with drones to level 5…or better still, remove the skill altogether. I just want to demonstrate to you that it is not SP that is pushing away new players. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 2:07am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165/63 "2021-12-07T02:07:32Z")
What attracted me to EVE was the SP system. Offline training? Sign me up. I get it if you don’t got a life tho, how that would be bad for you 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Carmanah](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/carmanah/32/297347_2.png) [@Carmanah](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Carmanah)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 3:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165/64 "2021-12-07T03:41:52Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > What CCP said was that in their study of under 30 day players, those that stayed at least the whole 30 days had a (slightly) higher correlation of also having been exposed to PvP in some way, be it consensual or gank. I recall that study and, if it is the same one, I think there’s a specific element you’re forgetting. What I recall CCP saying was that when a new player experienced a significant loss (such as their first ship to a gank) that was followed up with a positive social experience within a very short window of time, such as said ganker sending some isk, a joke and a friendly salute, player retention went up. It’s the difference between ganking that led a new player to feel a social bond vs. ganking that led to a new player feeling defeated and alone. ---
**Author:** ![Leggone\_Stracks](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/leggone_stracks/32/290900_2.png) [@Leggone\_Stracks](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Leggone_Stracks)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 5:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165/65 "2021-12-07T05:57:37Z")
Study, shmudy. Make it clear and obvious they they have a way to vomit their complaints to someone when they rage quit and you will eventually know why. It certainly won’t be just one thing. But I dare say that burning up multiple hours and seeing almost no progress will be in there somewhere, usually brought to head by a surprise disaster. If I had known that the Trig/Edencom Monster Gun Obscenities would always be around, I would have absolutely avoided being involved. My good hauler account guy racked up a -2.7 Trig standing trying to prevent the inevitable. My reward is that that character can’t be trusted with expensive stuff anymore. Do you know how many Rogue Drones in Pochenhell have to die to correct that? It’s insane. That account will stay unsubbed. At least I don’t have to alt-tab anymore. Most of us have forgotten, but as noobs we didn’t know ANYTHING, and couldn’t even “find the joystick to fly this stupid ship.” Imagine how daunting it is now. ---
**Author:** ![Kylanti\_Hendar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kylanti_hendar/32/385538_2.png) [@Kylanti\_Hendar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kylanti_Hendar)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 8:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165/66 "2021-12-07T08:31:01Z")
> [@I\_boole\_Laentauka](#): > > Admit it, you once saw a ship that you had the isk to buy, but you couldn’t fly cause you didn’t have the skillpoints for it. When you realized this, you must have felt at least a but fustrated or annoyed. I’ve always seen this aspirational rather than frustrating. There is always something I can be working towards rather than just being handed something for free. > [@I\_boole\_Laentauka](#): > > Name one way you’ve actually benefited from it in-game. Just one. I’ll wait. There are plenty of people who benefit from having specialised in a certain area of the skill tree and then selling the services it opens up to other players. For example people with jump freighter skills, max refining skills etc. ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 10:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165/67 "2021-12-07T10:41:32Z")
> [@Carmanah](#): > > It’s the difference between ganking that led a new player to feel a social bond vs. ganking that led to a new player feeling defeated and alone. The study didn’t isolate elements like that with any kind of statistical analysis Some guesses were made around the PvP correlation & various other correlations related to social aspects of the game to make statements like that to guess that there was such a thing as a positive ganking experience by people at the time. Speaking purely personally it does seem believable that interactions like that can create positive experiences that help retention, and I don’t regard PvP as a negative in EVE, but the study doesn’t say anything at all, it was a preliminary level study which gave some interesting correlations but didn’t go into depth enough for any real conclusions. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/4/1/41ec4921cbaca7a6f9ea556e7cc20018461eae5e.png) [@system](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2022, 10:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-here-is-what-i-think-is-the-actual-reason-why-most-new-players-quit-after-playing-the-new-player-experiance/340165/68 "2022-03-07T10:42:25Z")
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