# So Where is the Game Mechanic That Allows us to Flip a key Null System to Hi-sec? :psyccp: **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [August 21, 2020, 3:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847 "2020-08-21T15:57:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 8:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/149 "2020-09-29T20:42:29Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > I’m really just here to enjoy the tears from the usual carebears like you that cry for the help of CCP. 😂 Heh, thanks for confirming your only reason for posting in this thread is to troll others. > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > But in the systems flipped so far there hasnt been a change in resources or rats, or has there? Yeah, I realized that and posted this: > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > Soo yeah, guess the Exploration and Asteroid sites would remain the same, just the security level would be changed. ---
**Author:** ![Andresoni\_Janau](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/andresoni_janau/32/240452_2.png) [@Andresoni\_Janau](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Andresoni_Janau)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 8:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/150 "2020-09-29T20:45:09Z")
The way i’d see a it happening is, one of the 4 factions would establish a beachhead at the nullsec gate, setting up a few patrol ships and gate guns that would make life as a criminal in the system a little harder. Next, like the trigs, they’d warp in large fleets to strike at structures in the area, and if they were successful, they’d start construction of a station. If construction is completed, concord begins patrolling the system, and all remaining gates receive guns / patrol ships. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 8:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/151 "2020-09-29T20:45:10Z")
Ah sorry man, didnt see it. But yeah. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 8:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/152 "2020-09-29T20:53:54Z")
Well, the flipped system would have EDENCOM roaming Fleets and Gunstars on the gates, right? Doesn’t much matter, Alliance Sov holders would probably keep the system from flipping in the first place. Anyway for Null Sec, CCP should reactivate Blackout and have the Drifter Fleets attack everything again… ---
**Author:** ![Andresoni\_Janau](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/andresoni_janau/32/240452_2.png) [@Andresoni\_Janau](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Andresoni_Janau)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 8:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/153 "2020-09-29T20:54:58Z")
Nope this would be different from ecom vs trig, it’d be faction warfare against whatever pirate faction was local, or maybe a totally new type of event, empire expansion rather than faction warfare. New content yum! God yes make the blackout permanent… ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 9:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/154 "2020-09-29T21:18:38Z")
> [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > while an event that does so in null sec is bad, not because of any facts or evidence We’ve given the facts and evidence: nullsec is, by design, space dedicated to player-driven empire building. An NPC-focused event hijacking that space would contradict this design purpose, and “BUT LOL TEARS” is not enough of a justification to do that. > [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > “how dare high sec carebears think they have the right to do anything but wait to get ganked” You have plenty of options to do things besides wait to get ganked. You’re (collectively) just too dumb and/or lazy to use them. > [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > The thread is about creating a mechanic that can (even if temporarily) flip a null sec system to high the way the trig invasion flips them to null. You have a mechanic already: seize control with PvP forces, impose your own highsec-style rules complete with players in CONCORD faction ships attacking anyone who doesn’t follow the rules. What you are actually demanding is a way to shoot a few NPCs and flip a system because the existing sovereignty mechanics are too difficult for people like you. > [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > The way i’d see a it happening is, one of the 4 factions would establish a beachhead at the nullsec gate, setting up a few patrol ships and gate guns that would make life as a criminal in the system a little harder. Next, like the trigs, they’d warp in large fleets to strike at structures in the area, and if they were successful, they’d start construction of a station. If construction is completed, concord begins patrolling the system, and all remaining gates receive guns / patrol ships. Yep. Like I said, you’re too weak to take a system the way everyone else does so you’re demanding an NPC force to do it for you. And you’re not going to get it. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 10:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/155 "2020-09-29T22:13:54Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > Heh, thanks for confirming your only reason for posting in this thread is to troll others. Enjoying the tears of clueless carebears isn’t trolling. It’s more like enjoying a good wine > [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > God yes make the blackout permanent… I’m totally in favor of that. They should have never ended blackout. But the nullbear farmer trash isn’t really much better than the highsec carebears when it comes to crying a lot ---
**Author:** ![Andresoni\_Janau](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/andresoni_janau/32/240452_2.png) [@Andresoni\_Janau](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Andresoni_Janau)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 10:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/156 "2020-09-29T22:31:40Z")
Then stop encouraging them to cater to nullbears by acting like highsec ganking is the be all end all of the game. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 10:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/158 "2020-09-29T22:35:05Z")
> [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > highsec ganking is the be all end all of the game. It is just really relaxing ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 10:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/160 "2020-09-29T22:50:43Z")
> [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > Then stop encouraging them to cater to nullbears by acting like highsec ganking is the be all end all of the game. How is praising **highsec** ganking catering to **null** bears? You are aware that the “null” part of “nullbear” refers to playing in nullsec, right? That part of EVE that is not highsec and contains zero highsec ganks? ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2020, 10:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/161 "2020-09-29T22:51:51Z")
> [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > Nope this would be different from ecom vs trig, it’d be faction warfare against whatever pirate faction was local, or maybe a totally new type of event, empire expansion rather than faction warfare. New content yum! You need to think a little deeper than that. Let’s say that we start flipping null-sec systems to high-sec. Where do you think the null-sec guys are going to go after that? It’s not like they’d disappear into thin air (or the vacuum of space) once their homes become high-sec. So now you’d have a whole bunch of extra high-sec systems, with all of the farming benefits of null-sec systems, and also a whole bunch of bored (ex-)null-sec dwellers who have the skills to fly Catalysts. I appreciate the wishful thinking on your part, I really do, but it just wouldn’t end the way you expect it to. > [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > God yes make the blackout permanent… Insh’allah. ---
**Author:** ![Andresoni\_Janau](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/andresoni_janau/32/240452_2.png) [@Andresoni\_Janau](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Andresoni_Janau)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 12:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/163 "2020-09-30T00:27:58Z")
They bot in null, they play with high sec suicide ganks, just look at horde lately. ---
**Author:** ![Andresoni\_Janau](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/andresoni_janau/32/240452_2.png) [@Andresoni\_Janau](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Andresoni_Janau)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 12:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/164 "2020-09-30T00:29:15Z")
Those douches are forced into conflict with other nulls or forced into a grind to get their reputation back to a level where they can traverse high sec, great outcome. ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 1:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/193 "2020-09-30T01:15:27Z")
Anyway, to sum things up: if you want to argue for nerfs to suicide ganking you must argue that one of the following is true: 1. The state of suicide ganking has a minimal impact on player numbers and retention rates, and therefore the nerfs to suicide ganking are not responsible for the decline in player numbers. or 1. EVE’s player numbers and retention rates are better now than they were at times when suicide ganking was far more effective. Option #1 is a concession that the “BUT THINK OF THE NEWBIES” argument fails because nerfs to suicide ganking will not accomplish the goal of increasing new player retention, option #2 is a statement in direct contradiction to the indisputable facts of EVE’s player numbers over time. Pick your poison, either way your argument fails. ---
**Author:** ![Kearic1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kearic1/32/242553_2.png) [@Kearic1](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kearic1)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 2:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/196 "2020-09-30T02:47:23Z")
All the effort thats been put into whining about Niarja could have been spent on actually showing up to defend it. Choosing to ignore it then whine afterwards though was clearly the better choice. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 7:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/198 "2020-09-30T07:30:06Z")
EvE isnt growing because spreadsheets are boring Thats literally the only reason, ask anyone! ---
**Author:** ![Ridolph](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ridolph/32/346495_2.png) [@Ridolph](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ridolph)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 11:16am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/199 "2020-09-30T11:16:41Z")
@Andresoni_Janau Would you please stop with the kneejerk emotional reactions and use facts please ? Your allegations of botting are completely unfunded. You clearly have no experience whatsoever with ganking except being on the receiving end. Nor did apparently ever bother even once to travel trough lowsec into null. I can guarantee you that the camps found on the chokepoints there make Niarja look like kindergarten. On Topic: Yes null blocs came to help, but i detest the notion that it was all them. The content is invasion, lost territory was always going to be the consequence of failure to defend. Demanding compensation for your own failure now is just… ---
**Author:** ![Archer\_en\_Tilavine](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/archer_en_tilavine/32/461718_2.png) [@Archer\_en\_Tilavine](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Archer_en_Tilavine)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 2:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/203 "2020-09-30T14:48:11Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > EvE isnt growing because spreadsheets are boring > > Thats literally the only reason, ask anyone! Meanwhile… > **[Reddit - The heart of the internet](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/j21ap9/arins_guide_loyalty_point_offer_database/g75heav/)** [https://forum.eveuniversity.org/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=118945](https://forum.eveuniversity.org/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=118945) ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 2:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/204 "2020-09-30T14:54:09Z")
Case rests. But just say “EvE Online” outside a specific EvE forum and thats what someone will say. Any suggestion that ganking is some big reason for it remaining niche ignores that elephant. I think its best selling point is genuine non-instanced… Oh wait Its best selling point is perpetual item exista… Oh Yay spreadsheets! ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2020, 3:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847/205 "2020-09-30T15:54:27Z")
> [@Andresoni\_Janau](#): > > Impossible to reply since nullsec forum bots flag every post I make. That’s odd, many of your posts are visible just fine on my end. Perhaps your browser is suffering from some sort of display error? Or perhaps there’s something about particular posts you’ve made that is flag-worthy? Perhaps they could be considered off-topic spam, which is why your on-topic discussion (wrong as it may be) is not being flagged? Something to consider. > [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Anyway, I wouldn’t attribute EVE’s growth in its early period toward suicide-ganking. I don’t, I’m just extrapolating from the premise that suicide ganking is a decisive factor in player numbers and new player retention. If this is true then the conclusion is obvious: CCP must buff suicide ganking back to what it was when EVE was more successful, and the ganking nerfs the person making the claim is arguing for must be rejected because they will further damage EVE’s player numbers and new player retention. (And of course if suicide ganking _isn’t_ a decisive factor then their supposed justification for nerfing it disappears.) [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847.md?page=6) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/so-where-is-the-game-mechanic-that-allows-us-to-flip-a-key-null-system-to-hi-sec/261847.md?page=8)