# Standings Should Not Work This Way **URL:** \ **Category:** Missions\ **Created:** [November 30, 2024, 2:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708 "2024-11-30T14:15:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![YHWH\_Is\_Lord](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yhwh_is_lord/32/444382_2.png) [@YHWH\_Is\_Lord](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/YHWH_Is_Lord)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2024, 10:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/44 "2024-12-01T22:08:11Z")
> [@Glenduil](#): > > Your entire post was lazy and contributed nothing What does your post contribute to? Nothing as well. Mine here contributes to tell others that yours doesn’t contribute to anything 😅 ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/46 "2024-12-02T12:10:12Z")
Why did you move this? I intended it to be in general discussion for a wider audience, and obviously it falls under the mantel of eve general discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/47 "2024-12-02T12:10:53Z")
I have been aware of this document for three years, but thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/48 "2024-12-02T12:13:37Z")
A little insensitive to tell someone with chronic issues falling and remaining asleep to prioritize sleep, but okay. My insomnia has no bearing on whether or not it’s good game design to punish a misclick this severely. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/49 "2024-12-02T12:16:15Z")
> [@YHWH\_Is\_Lord](#): > > doesn’t mean it all is trollish This is why I only block those who chronically argue in bad faith, not all those who disagree with me. The criteria is the motivation for the reply and the frequency in which a poster makes troll replies. I have no problem silencing these individuals and their content. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/50 "2024-12-02T12:17:54Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Those who don’t know that have no idea what it is. > Good thing is, alcohol can help. Or a joint. Depends on the person. > Also for me, having an ice cold bedroom. Alcohol is a cure worse than the disease in the long run. A joint works sometimes, but often times trees just make me more energized. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Except it does not work. You end up lying in your bed, in a state of delirium, with thoughts coming again and again, the visage of the dark future/past showing its face, you start delirium and your brain does not stop. This. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/51 "2024-12-02T12:19:52Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Trollish is not about making mistakes, but about making others do mistakes, for example with deception about what is a mistake. Trolling is about intent and frequency. If you intend is to act in bad faith and you do that repeatedly, it’s trolling. No mistake is required. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/52 "2024-12-02T12:22:21Z")
You clearly have a very limited understanding of sleep issues, but the nature of insomnia is not the topic of this post. Please save the advice for Home and Country Magazine, you’re not bringing anything of value to the table. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/53 "2024-12-02T12:24:06Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > I don’t know what OP suffers from - but at least I’m not pretending to know what he should do as a reason to judge him. And this is what makes your responses not troll responses, everyone take note. You can disagree and debate, but thinking you know someone’s struggles more than they do is fundamentally acting in bad faith. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/54 "2024-12-02T12:25:16Z")
This is why I have them ignored. They have a history of this spanning at least a few years. I’d recommend doing the same; they never have anything to contribute in good faith. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/55 "2024-12-02T12:25:53Z")
It contributes to keeping the discussion on point and discouraging trolls. ---
**Author:** ![YHWH\_Is\_Lord](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yhwh_is_lord/32/444382_2.png) [@YHWH\_Is\_Lord](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/YHWH_Is_Lord)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/56 "2024-12-02T12:30:28Z")
> [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > This is why I only block those who chronically argue in bad faith, not all those who disagree with me. I will try not to block anyone because Lord knows they may have a good idea in the future but my patience, although longsuffering, has its limits too. FYI I was able to fall asleep last night while reading Albert Einstein and now there’s a spit stain on the page 😅 But on topic, I agree that the whole standing system needs to be reviewed and adjusted. But CCP prefers wasting their time making sure that the players grind more for less fun. Then they wonder why players leave 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/57 "2024-12-02T12:33:51Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Note that I don’t have an opinion on the topic (mostly because there is no actual proposal, it looks more like a rant than a solution to a problem), and I expect people to actually provide one on the topic instead of making retarded statements as “it’s your fault there is nothing to change”. > Yes, he knows he made a mistake, deal with it and start answering on the topic or leave it alone. Thank you. I’m not a game designer so I’m not sure personally what the best solution is. One presumes at the very least it would involve making the rules regarding mission rats and standings uniform across all missions, and that the amount of loss should be reduced but NOT made trivial. Faction Navy rat X should be the same standings hit in every mission, not wildly divergent depending on which mission it is. Someone mentioned above the four hour rule, and I think perhaps that warrants some looking at but I’m not sure that really addresses the issue. Decoupling faction and corporation standings as it relates to mission agents might be another idea, but that has some unintended consequences regarding mission access. Maybe making the mission window more obviously display the opposing factions might be another (it already does this but it is not always obvious if you don’t know to look for it). In my case the error was entirely my own doing and there is some merit to the argument of ‘you’re too tired to play eve.’ That mistake should have consequences. The consequences should not be the destruction of months of work. The point of the thread is to say this system sucks and needs a update to me more in line with QOL and modern practices. I think standings choices SHOULD matter and SHOULD be meaningful. They should not be arbitarily punishing. Even the market windows have confirmation prompts for christ sake. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 12:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/58 "2024-12-02T12:37:17Z")
> [@YHWH\_Is\_Lord](#): > > FYI I was able to fall asleep last night while reading Albert Einstein and now there’s a spit stain on the page 😅 OOF. Every victory it seems comes with a cost haha ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 1:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/59 "2024-12-02T13:35:10Z")
> [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > Alcohol is a cure worse than the disease in the long run. Yeah but when the crisis are limited in time, drinking a very small glass of rhum heated in the microwave 10s with cane sugar can really helps. As much as it can be a poison for another person, even inducing worse thoughts and addiction. And even when it works, it’s difficult to stop as you are afraid of not sleeping -.- > [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > This. What was eye opening to me was how a friend told me she only need to close her eyes 5 min to sleep, anywhere, anywhen. And I was like : less than 4 hours to fall asleep ? Are you kidding me ? So I understand that other people may have actually no idea how it is, and be prone to judgement about an illness they can’t fathom. ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/510263_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 2:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/60 "2024-12-02T14:09:56Z")
@topic @Nascent3ch0 I perfer simple solutions. - If a mission doesn’t give a _faction standing gain_ on completion, it shouldn’t cost a _faction standing loss_ on failure/reject. Because why should an _empire_ care if you fail/reject a deal with a corporation, thats way below their sphere of interest. - However, if you decide to run the mission and kill another empire’s ships, you _should_ get a standing hit towards them. You basically attacked them and they couldn’t care less if it was part of a mission you accepted for their enemies. This way, an accidentally accepted faction mission could always be declined to avoid a faction standing loss. ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Lord\_Trump](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dark_lord_trump/32/411482_2.png) [@Dark\_Lord\_Trump](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dark_Lord_Trump)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 4:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/61 "2024-12-02T16:41:59Z")
> [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > but nearly three months of work wiped out because of one misclick? > [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > You do essentially have to do it or you just take another faction wide standings hit with a different faction. You don’t lose three months of standings gain from declining/aborting one mission. You might from attacking another faction though. > [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > Another mission with the same rats doesn’t incur such a severe standing hit. This is the only reasonable point you’ve made. IIRC shooting sentry turrets makes factions REALLY mad for some reason. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 9:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/62 "2024-12-02T21:30:17Z")
There is some merit to this strategy. It still locks down the agent for a few days while you wait for the offer to decay, unless you remove penalties for rejecting missions post accepting them altogether, but I suppose that’s better than losing a whole point of faction standings. ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/510263_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 9:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/63 "2024-12-02T21:45:25Z")
Why can’t you just live with the corp/agent standing loss? I mean, thats regained in a few hours and it doesn’t really matter for anything. And you probably don’t have such an ‘accident’ very often… ---
**Author:** ![Sentenced\_1989](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sentenced_1989/32/380733_2.png) [@Sentenced\_1989](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sentenced_1989)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2024, 10:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708/64 "2024-12-02T22:46:30Z")
It’s not corp / agent, its faction one that is the problem. As you said, corp / agent is easy to rework, however, faction one takes long time. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/standings-should-not-work-this-way/469708.md?page=4)