# State of The Game, 2020 Edition **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [November 26, 2020, 10:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992 "2020-11-26T10:37:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 10:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/1 "2020-11-26T10:37:28Z")
![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/4/d/4d9cf2f2ca41176486b388850e7734ecb46a4de4.png) Most of you already know this. If you don’t, go to [https://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility](https://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility) to find out more. The game basically peaked 2012 to 2013, with 2014 marking the beginning of its visible decline. We can see the beginning of the effects caused by changes implemented by CCP during the post-[CrimeWatch 2.0](https://www.eveonline.com/article/patch-notes-for-retribution-1) era … … or carebear-era if you want to call it that. It wouldn’t be inaccurate to do so. Noteworth is the fact that highsec local got much quieter in 2013 already … … but many of you probably have no idea about this, because you don’t use local much. Anyhow … there’s a clear, visible decline. Everyone’s free to go through all the releases in that era, to learn what changes caused this massive decline over the years. Most people will notice, or already know, that it’s been changes which reduced PvP in favour of PvE, safety and wealth generation. **Apparently that didn’t work out too well.** ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/7/a/7abf0e58b835a35866a663c55612e4d5a17a0ce4.png) From 2015 on the chart then shows relatively stable sideways movement … … with one big upswing in late 2016, which flattened out again relatively quickly. Years later BlackOut hit the game. Interestingly enough, the chart does not actually show any indication of BlackOut actually being a problem. On [Friday, July 12th 2019](https://www.eveonline.com/article/pufecw/48-hour-warning-nullsec-local-blackout) the BlackOut began … … and it lasted until [the 16th of September.](https://www.eveonline.com/article/pxx548/2019-09-16-nullsec-blackout-concludes) I’m not the only one saying that the doom scenario didn’t actually exist. [This OP on /r/eve](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/ceqsvv/some_nullsec_blackout_facts/), for example, agrees. The comments showing absolutely no sign of the OP not being truthfull. Interesting tidbit: Player numbers dropped in the USTZ, which makes sense, because that’s where most carebears and farmers are coming from. I’d love to see official data proving/disproving my theory, but I digress … So let’s look at the first year of the post-BlackOut era: ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/e/3/e39597d2dd4c06b6f409dd243e96d4f4554b2bb4.png) There’s clearly a dip in September 2019, which is being overshadowed by a slow, lasting upswing. We can see people, who aren’t carebears or farmers, regaining confidence in CCP. I can with absolute certainty claim that it’s definitely not carebears/farmers who are regaining confidence, because [of the massive amount of whining](https://forums.eveonline.com/c/eve-information-portal/announcements/82?order=activity) by [people who dislike all these changes literally kicking them in the balls](https://forums.eveonline.com/c/eve-information-portal/dev-blogs/84). For [everyone to see](https://updates.eveonline.com/date/2019-10-08/), all the changes since BlackOut have been doing nothing but nerfing farming and wealth generation, which is what carebears and farmers are all about. That’s a clear sign of CCP actively trying to get rid of them, and as each and every new release/announcement thread makes it abundantly clear, CCP is _[still on this very same track](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/upcoming-changes-to-drone-aggression/281713/456)_. Everyone around here knows that with every nerf, the bears keep crying about he game dying. Everyone does that, sure, but unlike during the carebear-era, where one side had actual evidence of it happening, the other side (the bears and farmers) of current times, have _nothing_. _ **Nothing!** _ N O T H I N G. You don’t need to believe _me_. Believe the numbers! In Feburary 2014 there [was a great, great battle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloodbath_of_B-R5RB) going on … … which, in hindsight, appears to mark the beginning of the decline. This goes from B-R5RB until the sudden increase in late 2016 … ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/c/9/c9c87a3a98c74d7a9ffd47f8975493b8656bd7e7.png) … and here’s the spike: ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/1/5/152a0b6a995dd0481837f2697c3660e34a06f450.png) [Ascension](https://www.eveonline.com/article/eve-online-ascension-coming-november-8th-2016) brought us Alphas. That’s why there’s a spike. It’s not a particularly helpful spike, though, because it just flattened out again after just six months: ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/a/6/a6abd350211589c73bb4e392ad80e5517ce29451.png) So here we are, one year ago. BlackOut ended and the first PvP event in _forever_, … _(please correct me if I’m wrong)_ … “Trick or Treat” … … officially marked the end of the era of the carebear. I consider the BlackOut to be the “unofficial” end of it, because it wasn’t a release per se. And this is what happened ever since CCP started kicking carebears and farmers into the nuts _every single month_: ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/e/8/e8b14ddbf649845bd901468bfbdb12bf89e59fa1.png) It went up. It went up despite massive amounts of people (claiming they’re) quitting. It went up despite massive nerfs to carebears, safety and farming. We’re currently in a phase of stable sideways movement. Now there’s those who scream “CORONA” and there’s little doubt that it helped increasing the number of active players … … but what they’re not considering, or deliberately not mentioning, is the fact that _all these players could be playing something else._ **But they’re not!** They’re happy about the direction the game has taken … … otherwise they’d be playing something else. There is zero evidence of all the carebears and farmers … … who keep crying about CCP killing _the_ game … … actually quitting, _or that it actually matters_. So either there are far more people coming in … … than there are leaving … … _or the amount of people leaving isn’t actually significant at all_ … or the carebears aren’t actually quitting. In the end it doesn’t matter if they’re quitting or not, though it’s a significant upside to all the changes CCP has implemented so far. All that matters is that _based on evidence we can look at_ … … CCP isn’t killing _the_ game … … it’s killing _their_ game. And _their_ game was ■■■■ anyway. For everyone to observe with his own eyes … … the _carebear era_ didn’t do the game any good at all, for pretty obvious reasons, too. Please feel free to link to this thread whenever useful. I’d honestly appreciate it, because every time you just link to it … … you prevent them from having a platform where they can spread their lies and ■■■■■■■■ on. Thanks! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 10:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/2 "2020-11-26T10:44:01Z")
There’s not a single mentioning of “assholes” in my post. ---
**Author:** ![Rekindle](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rekindle/32/382332_2.png) [@Rekindle](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rekindle)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 10:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/3 "2020-11-26T10:56:41Z")
Dream on pal. ---
**Author:** ![Danielle\_Sexbang](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/danielle_sexbang/32/242545_2.png) [@Danielle\_Sexbang](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Danielle_Sexbang)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 11:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/4 "2020-11-26T11:06:18Z")
nice graphs I didn’t look at, your attachment to this game is noted OP. LOL ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 11:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/5 "2020-11-26T11:17:38Z")
Completely agree with the post. Though the current min-maxed farmers bot-aspirants get severely kicked in the nuts, rightfully so, in the long run this isn’t actually a nerf for industry, mining or ratter. It is a long needed re-balancing of resources and risk/reward issues the game had for a very long time. All this shows is that CCP still cares about the long term future of the game and makes the right choices (finally!!) even at the risk of some push back from a small but very vocal minority. And it also shows that the community at large actually rewards their work now they are doing the right thing. Unlike in the times when they listened to the carebears and took the game on a slide downhill in the process ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 11:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/6 "2020-11-26T11:22:54Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > All this shows is that CCP still cares about the long term future of the game Arrendis has something valuable to add to this: [CONCORD introduces the Dynamic Bounty System - Communications Center / General Discussion - EVE Online Forums](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concord-introduces-the-dynamic-bounty-system/275498/805) CCP, well Hilmar, never actually not cared. He just _had_ to do what he _had_ to do. This is further underlined by the rapid pace of kicks into the balls of farmers. Back in the post-CrimWatch 2.0 era, changes were softer and slower. CCP tried hard not to pissing off to many people who didn’t agree with the pandering to farmers. Now, on the other hand, they don’t seem to care much about people quitting … … as evidenced - yet again - by the amount and impact of the releases/changes this year. A kick in the nuts for bears and farmers. Every single month. ---
**Author:** ![ExcalibursTemplar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/excaliburstemplar/32/383837_2.png) [@ExcalibursTemplar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ExcalibursTemplar)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 11:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/7 "2020-11-26T11:33:20Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Completely agree with the post. > > Though the current min-maxed farmers bot-aspirants get severely kicked in the nuts, rightfully so, in the long run this isn’t actually a nerf for industry, mining or ratter. It is a long needed re-balancing of resources and risk/reward issues the game had for a very long time. > > All this shows is that CCP still cares about the long term future of the game and makes the right choices (finally!!) even at the risk of some push back from a small but very vocal minority. > > And it also shows that the community at large actually rewards their work now they are doing the right thing. Unlike in the times when they listened to the carebears and took the game on a slide downhill in the process ![■■■■ off](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/8/b/8b158dc2aad582695e3a7e6238cd9fd99e2614b5.jpeg) Yeah it’s all about rebalancing the game and it’s long term future /s ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 11:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/8 "2020-11-26T11:34:01Z")
Interesting post from Arrendis > [@Solstice\_Projekt](#): > > Now, on the other hand, they don’t seem to care much about people quitting … A miner or farmer is replaced fast. It’s nothing special, it’s not difficult. You can train an animal to do it. I think they may have realized that losing this people isn’t a tragedy for the game. On the other hand, losing a content creator is what will drain the game of actual content. That is what happened when the catered to the carebears. We all said this for years and now finally CCP seems to have either gotten the message or as Arrendis said, are in a position to act on something they knew all along. ---
**Author:** ![Red-Sonja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/red-sonja/32/254178_2.png) [@Red-Sonja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Red-Sonja)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 11:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/9 "2020-11-26T11:34:32Z")
So EVE is as healthy as a horse… I don’t see how that’s any of my business. ---
**Author:** ![Mevatla\_Vekraspek](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mevatla_vekraspek/32/377519_2.png) [@Mevatla\_Vekraspek](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mevatla_Vekraspek)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 11:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/10 "2020-11-26T11:36:43Z")
Always wondered why cancer was named cancer… Krabs are a symbol of decline. ---
**Author:** ![Lloyd\_Roses](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lloyd_roses/32/244283_2.png) [@Lloyd\_Roses](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lloyd_Roses)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/11 "2020-11-26T12:06:44Z")
Seeing the same thing, eve was healthier when losing assets actually meant something and to make money, you had to either risk a thing or be happy with a very meager income. While the ore situation is unfortunate and I’d personally rather see nullsec suffocating in rocks and harvestables with NPCs to be cleared to allow for harvesting itself (like FOBs in empire space), the split of ressources across low and null is a fair step up. This year brought a number of adjustments that were necessary after five years of buff after buff to income streams, sadly it seems we’re not even getting close to how expensive it all used to be. ---
**Author:** ![Dictateur\_Imperator](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dictateur_imperator/32/452018_2.png) [@Dictateur\_Imperator](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dictateur_Imperator)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/12 "2020-11-26T12:15:07Z")
You realise 2020 number are totaly weird due to pandemy and fact all 0.0 block recall layer who have stop to make the great war right ? Ok perfect. ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/13 "2020-11-26T12:19:38Z")
> [@Mevatla\_Vekraspek](#): > > Always wondered why cancer was named cancer… Krabs are a symbol of decline. This might be of interesting to you: [Why Do Things Keep Evolving Into Crabs? - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvfR3XLXPvw) ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/14 "2020-11-26T12:22:32Z")
Do you realize that carebears predicted the opposite of what actually happened to the live player numbers for up to a decade? And do you realize that when confronted with that fact, they always made up some silly reason why the numbers show the complete opposite of what they are saying? Obviously the resolution to the made up situation that miraculously screwed the numbers to the complete opposite never came. So do you realize that you making up yet another of this stories sounds completely ridiculous and full of shite? Ok perfect. ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/15 "2020-11-26T12:23:16Z")
Don’t do this. It’s a waste of time, energy and a good thread. Go through his posting history and you will learn why. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/16 "2020-11-26T12:24:08Z")
He sounds a bit like french Balos ? Is he a game developer by any chance and has authority on the topic? ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/17 "2020-11-26T12:25:12Z")
The drone-changes thread is better suited for this. And yeah, it’s that guy. ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/18 "2020-11-26T12:34:10Z")
> [@Mevatla\_Vekraspek](#): > > Krabs are a symbol of decline. If they are cancer, what are you then? According to your killboard you do nothing but prey on crabs. On the first 3 pages of your killboard, I can only find a single kill that is not a crab. > [@Solstice\_Projekt](#): > > There is zero evidence of all the carebears and farmers … > … > … actually quitting, _or that it actually matters_. Every single graph that you linked is trending down. > [@Solstice\_Projekt](#): > > It went up despite massive nerfs to carebears, safety and farming. The numbers only went up since April because of Covid. And if you look at the last picture, the numbers are trending down since then. They are even trending down despite winter which is traditionally the time when EVE player numbers went up. ---
**Author:** ![Mevatla\_Vekraspek](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mevatla_vekraspek/32/377519_2.png) [@Mevatla\_Vekraspek](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mevatla_Vekraspek)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/19 "2020-11-26T12:35:22Z")
Very interesting indeed, thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Mevatla\_Vekraspek](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mevatla_vekraspek/32/377519_2.png) [@Mevatla\_Vekraspek](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mevatla_Vekraspek)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 12:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992/20 "2020-11-26T12:36:20Z")
Well, a cure? I work hard to maintain the price of exploration loot high… [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/state-of-the-game-2020-edition/281992.md?page=2)