# Structure Hacking for more detailed manifests (docking times, saved fits, deposit history, etc.) **URL:** \ **Category:** Player Features & Ideas\ **Created:** [September 12, 2018, 1:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763 "2018-09-12T01:01:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 1:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/1 "2018-09-12T01:01:47Z")
Potential of structure hacking is woefully underutilized beyond just relegating it to displaying reinforcement timers. Here are five additions that could be included in the report after a successful structure hack. This info would only remain available for viewing as long a player is uncloaked and in range of structure. 1. Last 5 players (25 with max skills) to have docked with structure in prior 3 days 2. When players docked/undocked 3. Prior station(s) players visited before docking with target structure 4. Structure saves info on last ship docked/undocked with as a ship fitting. Max 25 players tracked. One fitting saved each. 5. ~~List of upwell cargo delivers~~ Estimated value of all items in the structure. Breaching this intel dossier triggers suspect status in empire space. ![Estimated%20Value](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/0/d/0ddcf8d2a0aef5fc6f8c17c30304c2fb26e23d22.png) Addendum: Players may pay CONCORD cyber security division a monthly fee to raise structures hacking difficulty by 1 or 3 levels depending on the payment package. Structure hacking difficulty is also automatically raised by 1 level for any defending corporation under war declaration. ---
**Author:** ![Careby](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/careby/32/467228_2.png) [@Careby](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Careby)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 1:07am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/2 "2018-09-12T01:07:23Z")
List of current industry jobs. List of pilots in the structure (logged in and logged out). List of assets in the structure. This could get nasty. ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 1:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/3 "2018-09-12T01:25:11Z")
Also possibly crash the client depending on the volume of the request. If CCP could find a balance to provide granular intel on transit activity without setting server on fire it would greatly expand counter intelligence gameplay opportunities. ---
**Author:** ![Krysenth](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/krysenth/32/58194_2.png) [@Krysenth](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Krysenth)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 6:03am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/4 "2018-09-12T06:03:12Z")
> [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](#): > > If CCP could find a balance They already have. That’s why you get what you currently get. Because it’s also information that does not change second to second and needs to be tracked and remembered. You want permanent TIDI in perimeter or something? ■■■■ no. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 4:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/5 "2018-09-12T16:04:06Z")
Holy cow!! No way. -1 First because of the data that would have to be tracked for 10 million useless structures and second the data is not even structure related it is player tracking. Major -1 on player tracking. If it was something like industry jobs that could be different. ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 4:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/6 "2018-09-12T16:15:48Z")
Players dock with structures. Scotty the docking manager keeps records of who docked, when they docked, and what they docked with. That makes it structure related in my eyes. If you don’t want to dock and leave an immediate record of your presence use the upwell structure deposit. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 4:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/7 "2018-09-12T16:19:21Z")
> [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](#): > > Scotty the docking manager keeps records of who docked RAWLLL!!! 🤣 When we talk about records we are talking about the RL load, none of that data is tracked. ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 4:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/8 "2018-09-12T16:28:29Z")
> [@Krysenth](#): > > You want permanent TIDI in perimeter or something? ■■■■ no. It’s a rolling list of 5 to 25 names with 2 to 3 data points each. Nothing too extreme. Data is only saved on a structure for 3 days. If a structure is unused it frees up space. The change of going suspect when hacking structures in empire space moderately mitigates this server call load. Sure some groups may try to group blitz for data hacks, however CCP could limit that by capping the number of people hacking structures to one at a time. ---
**Author:** ![Daoden](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daoden/32/271841_2.png) [@Daoden](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daoden)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 5:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/9 "2018-09-12T17:08:52Z")
Hell no. If you want that info man up and do the leg work. ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 5:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/10 "2018-09-12T17:30:47Z")
‘Man up?’ I’ll have you know that i identify as a female pleasure bot. No, this expands leg work opportunities to feel out possible ship fits of solo or gang targets, however this info doesn’t guarantee anything as the targets can refit in space. ---
**Author:** ![Krysenth](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/krysenth/32/58194_2.png) [@Krysenth](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Krysenth)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 7:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/11 "2018-09-12T19:22:31Z")
> [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](#): > > > [@Krysenth](#): > > > > You want permanent TIDI in perimeter or something? ■■■■ no. > > It’s a rolling list of 5 to 25 names with 2 to 3 data points each. Nothing too extreme. Data is only saved on a structure for 3 days. If a structure is unused it frees up space. > > The change of going suspect when hacking structures in empire space moderately mitigates this server call load. Sure some groups may try to group blitz for data hacks, however CCP could limit that by capping the number of people hacking structures to one at a time. It’s not going to be the request to _get_ the info that’s going to cause the performance issues. It’s going to be the _storage of the information required_. Take Jita 4-4 as an example. If the game had to “remember” who the last 25 people undocking from that station were, and only that, it’s going to cause a performance impact because that many people are undocking from the station at any given _second_. Enough systems and structures on a node, you’re _going_ to start seeing levels of data processing on par with blob vs blob fleet combat. Thus TIDI. There’s a reason many things only update/change at downtime. ---
**Author:** ![Old\_Pervert](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/old_pervert/32/149708_2.png) [@Old\_Pervert](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Old_Pervert)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 8:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/12 "2018-09-12T20:47:57Z")
To be honest, I’d be shocked if the logs didn’t already reflect dock and undock times. It’s just one row in a table, every time someone docks or undocks… even in Jita that’s not going to spike more than 10 inserts every second 95% of the time. But remember that Jita 4-4 isn’t a citadel either. Perimeter, different story but still really not an onerous query to run on the server (select top 25 from dockinglog). When we have 1000 in a citadel and we mass-undock to get on the titans, that’s still not going to be a huge problem because it can easily be run asymmetrically… you don’t need to wait for the log to write to proceed. As for saved fits… those are player things, not citadel things. But even if you did, which of the ~200 fits that I have saved are you going to base your choice on? The assets thing… that I actually do like and want. Evicting people from space is ■■■■■■■ annoying. Knowing which citadels their stuff is in offers more opportunity to attack the right structures. This in turn forces them to evac the structure (or show up and defend it, rather than just ignore the loss of an empty structure). ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 9:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/13 "2018-09-12T21:30:53Z")
Fair point. It doesn’t necessarily need to be an immediate check for the system to still convey relevant data. Server could poll in 5 minute delayed checks, grab player names on the tail end of those blocks. ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 9:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/14 "2018-09-12T21:42:34Z")
> [@Old\_Pervert](#): > > As for saved fits… those are player things, not citadel things. But even if you did, which of the ~200 fits that I have saved are you going to base your choice on? What I meant by saved fitting is a copy of the ship a player docks or undocks with, essentially a comprehensive ship module scan. The system would only save one entry at a time per player. E.g. group A of wormhole hunters want to get approximations on group B’s forces. When they docked/undocked and possible fleet size (capped at viewing 25) and composition. Of course, this info is also particularly handy for hunting miners and epithals, unless those resource gatherers forgo docking and instead use upwell cargo deposit to conceal docking times. ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 9:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/15 "2018-09-12T21:53:05Z")
> [@Old\_Pervert](#): > > Knowing which citadels their stuff is in offers more opportunity to attack the right structures. I was initially thinking more last 100 items placed in upwell deposit box, however your interpretation has more utility. How about instead of a list of items held in the structure it would display the **estimated value** of all items in the structure? ---
**Author:** ![Old\_Pervert](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/old_pervert/32/149708_2.png) [@Old\_Pervert](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Old_Pervert)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 11:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/16 "2018-09-12T23:01:11Z")
> [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](#): > > I was initially thinking more last 100 items placed in upwell deposit box, however your interpretation has more utility. How about instead of a list of items held in the structure it would display the **estimated value** of all items in the structure? If it was a reliable estimate, sure. What is CCP’s estimate of an Imp, though? I’ve yet to see much of anything with a reliable estimate. Just a giant dump of the items, so the player could copy and paste into evepraisal would be enough for my tastes. It would likely be computationally easier as well, because while they’d still be pulling the information they would not need to perform the summation of value once they pull the items. I’d probably add to that it’d be worthwhile to see contracts as well. Knowing that they’ve failed to restock a doctrine would be incredibly valuable knowledge, when you can bring something that they would have used that doctrine to counter. ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 4:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/17 "2018-09-13T04:12:37Z")
> [@Old\_Pervert](#): > > Just a giant dump of the items, so the player could copy and paste into evepraisal would be enough for my tastes. It would likely be computationally easier as well, because while they’d still be pulling the information they would not need to perform the summation of value once they pull the items. I’m curious if there’d be a overflow issue when listing more than 1000 unique items in a window. If anything, this would make for a novel experience as a hacker feeling exposed while you wait for the item list to download. ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/c/0/c01b9c50f727d5692d48f1ac1771d3bee9534041.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Lukett\_MyDabb](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lukett_mydabb/32/14034_2.png) [@Lukett\_MyDabb](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lukett_MyDabb)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 1:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/18 "2018-09-13T13:55:54Z")
ok, thred tldr, so i’ll mix what i read with what you got here and state what looks good and what doesn’t. 1. looking alright i guess 2. not sure if feasible but looking to know patterns with the particular structure seems like an allowable action 3. no. even if a player spent all day jumping from upwell to upwell, i don’t see, since you like to take to the in-lore side, why this information would be logged in one station. if you wanted to create a play by play on every movement a capsuleer made, you would just have to track them down the old fashioned way. 4. recieving a ship fitting with each of the 25 is a little sketchy of a proposal, from server workload to whether or not this seems to be TMI to reasonabl allow access to, if used against a lowsec pvper you could effectively know how to counter him and that allone sounds like a way to kill off solo pvp, which i thought LS was supposed to be “The place” for that. in short, i say allow access to what ship their flying, but nothing more. 1. that’s quite alright depending on asset safety rules in their area. 2. suspect flag is applied the second you make the first node click in the window, but only in Highsec. ---
**Author:** ![Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pleasure_hub_node-514/32/381326_2.png) [@Pleasure\_Hub\_Node-514](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pleasure_Hub_Node-514)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 6:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/19 "2018-09-14T06:57:09Z")
> [@Krysenth](#): > > If the game had to “remember” who the last 25 people undocking from that station were, and only that, it’s going to cause a performance impact because that many people are undocking from the station at any given _second_ . If we take tracking for docking times and ships flown off the table, would you see wealth tracking of combined assets value in a structure placing the same kind of load on the server? The tech is already there with player net worth stats on the character sheet (updated every 12 hours). ![Estimated%20Value](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/0/d/0ddcf8d2a0aef5fc6f8c17c30304c2fb26e23d22.png) ---
**Author:** ![Krysenth](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/krysenth/32/58194_2.png) [@Krysenth](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Krysenth)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 8:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763/20 "2018-09-14T08:00:17Z")
Estimated value would be pretty pointless because not everything in that amount would be a potential loot object. You’d have so much stuff getting trimmed out that the only thing of value you would get in the end is a value estimate of the structure’s fit itself, not it’s contents. [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/structure-hacking-for-more-detailed-manifests-docking-times-saved-fits-deposit-history-etc/105763.md?page=2)