# Suggestion for new player acquisition and retention **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [February 24, 2020, 10:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930 "2020-02-24T22:11:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nicolai_serkanner/32/358049_2.png) [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nicolai_Serkanner)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 7:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/201 "2020-02-28T19:47:49Z")
> [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > removing that is basically pure newbie nerf Man, you really have ■■■■ for brains. I have rarely met anybody as daft as you are here on these forums. ---
**Author:** ![Sabus\_Narian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sabus_narian/32/147677_2.png) [@Sabus\_Narian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sabus_Narian)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 7:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/202 "2020-02-28T19:52:04Z")
> [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](#): > > Man, you really have ■■■■ for brians. I have rarely met anybody as daft as you are here on these forums. Says the person who wants newbies to leave the game. ---
**Author:** ![Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nicolai_serkanner/32/358049_2.png) [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nicolai_Serkanner)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 7:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/203 "2020-02-28T19:55:20Z")
> [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > Says the person who wants newbies to leave the game. Please continu to confirm you’re an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![Th0rG0d](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/th0rg0d/32/181225_2.png) [@Th0rG0d](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Th0rG0d)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 8:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/204 "2020-02-28T20:46:16Z")
These kind of posts have been around since I started in 2008. The short answer is Eve isn’t for everyone. The whole “alpha” clone F2P thing is circumventing a huge barrier to entry that Eve vets had to overcome. If I didn’t have to pay for my first 5M sp, I would’ve likely quit. Keeping my subscription going heavily incentivized me to continue my journey learning the game. I participated in null sec fleet ops as a frig tackler, low sec roaming and scouting in t1 frigs, and when wormholes were introduced, moved into exploration. Eve has been “dying” for over a decade, and CCP has always been “ruining the game”. Yet here we are, having the same conversations, but the game is more robust and exciting as ever. I’ve come back from a very long break, and have enjoyed it. Sure, the peak numbers aren’t where they used to be, but 30k concurrent users is nothing to scoff at for a niche MMO. Yes, EveO is a NICHE game. It always has been, and likely will always be one. It’s not a AAA title that’s going to drag in the millions. It’s hard, it’s brutal, it’s unforgiving. Those are the traits that make Eve the best social simulation you can participate in. ---
**Author:** ![Sabus\_Narian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sabus_narian/32/147677_2.png) [@Sabus\_Narian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sabus_Narian)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 9:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/205 "2020-02-28T21:05:46Z")
> [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](#): > > Please continu to confirm you’re an idiot. Lol insulted by a newbie hater 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![Sabus\_Narian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sabus_narian/32/147677_2.png) [@Sabus\_Narian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sabus_Narian)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 9:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/206 "2020-02-28T21:08:09Z")
> [@Th0rG0d](#): > > These kind of posts have been around since I started in 2008. The short answer is Eve isn’t for everyone. The whole “alpha” clone F2P thing is circumventing a huge barrier to entry that Eve vets had to overcome. If I didn’t have to pay for my first 5M sp, I would’ve likely quit. Keeping my subscription going heavily incentivized me to continue my journey learning the game. I participated in null sec fleet ops as a frig tackler, low sec roaming and scouting in t1 frigs, and when wormholes were introduced, moved into exploration. For everyone 1 of that there are 100 that say “I have to pay 4 years to actually play screw that I’m out” > Eve has been “dying” for over a decade, and CCP has always been “ruining the game”. Yet here we are, having the same conversations, but the game is more robust and exciting as ever. I’ve come back from a very long break, and have enjoyed it. Sure, the peak numbers aren’t where they used to be, but 30k concurrent users is nothing to scoff at for a niche MMO. Still there are MMO with millions of players, I personally would love to see the online numbers be at 100k, versus 30k. > Yes, EveO is a NICHE game. It always has been, and likely will always be one. It’s not a AAA title that’s going to drag in the millions. It’s hard, it’s brutal, it’s unforgiving. Those are the traits that make Eve the best social simulation you can participate in. Not really, you have highsec which is a good zone for those who hate pvp. Also a lot of other things eve has that give it advatange, will it be as popular as fortnite? probably not, but it certainly can have millions of players. ---
**Author:** ![Chan\_aar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/chan_aar/32/377560_2.png) [@Chan\_aar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Chan_aar)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 9:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/207 "2020-02-28T21:15:57Z")
> [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > “I have to pay 4 years to actually play screw that I’m out” How did all the vets start? If everyone thought like that no one would have ever started to play in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Sabus\_Narian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sabus_narian/32/147677_2.png) [@Sabus\_Narian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sabus_Narian)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 9:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/208 "2020-02-28T21:30:25Z")
> [@Chan\_aar](#): > > How did all the vets start? If everyone thought like that no one would have ever started to play in the first place. I care about increasing the numbers of players that stay in the game, vets complaining that “oh dear I had to do that in 2005 that’s not fair” I could care less about. Make it easier for the newbies so they stay in the game is my stance. ---
**Author:** ![Chan\_aar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/chan_aar/32/377560_2.png) [@Chan\_aar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Chan_aar)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 9:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/209 "2020-02-28T21:37:58Z")
> [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > that’s not fair I did not mention anything being fair or unfair. Its about the attitude of > [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > “I have to pay 4 years to actually play screw that I’m out” First you don’t have to pay at all to play and second Eve is a long term game your character grows as you play. That is the experience of Eve Online, trying to short cut that means the player misses out on so much. Jumping ahead doesn’t help you if you haven’t learnt the game. Injectors are actually BAD for new players because what they really do is allow rich vets to insta-train alts for specialist roles … before injectors those specialised roles went to new players. ---
**Author:** ![Sabus\_Narian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sabus_narian/32/147677_2.png) [@Sabus\_Narian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sabus_Narian)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 9:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/210 "2020-02-28T21:39:31Z")
> [@Chan\_aar](#): > > I did not mention anything being fair or unfair. Generally the people I argue with mention it, my bad if you did not. > First you don’t have to pay at all to play and second Eve is a long term game your character grows as you play. of course, but remember CCP wisely allowed skill extractors/injectors to allow you to accelerate your growth. much of the content is stagnant, we need more content for different styles to help rejuvenate the game. ---
**Author:** ![Chan\_aar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/chan_aar/32/377560_2.png) [@Chan\_aar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Chan_aar)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 9:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/211 "2020-02-28T21:50:11Z")
> [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > much of the content is stagnant, we need more content for different styles to help rejuvenate the game. That I will agree on. This > [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > CCP wisely allowed skill extractors/injectors to allow you to accelerate your growth I can’t. Did you not read my previous reply? here it is again. > [@Chan\_aar](#): > > Injectors are actually BAD for new players because what they really do is allow rich vets to insta-train alts for specialist roles … before injectors those specialised roles went to new players. Trying to catch up doesn’t help you if all the roles are taken by veteran player alts. Skill injectors mean that there is nothing for the new, lower skill player to do because the rich vets just inject alts. What is the point in accelerating your growth if there is nothing to do when you get there? ---
**Author:** ![Sabus\_Narian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sabus_narian/32/147677_2.png) [@Sabus\_Narian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sabus_Narian)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 1:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/212 "2020-02-29T01:50:11Z")
> [@Chan\_aar](#): > > That I will agree on. > > This 🙂 > Skill injectors mean that there is nothing for the new, lower skill player to do because the rich vets just inject alts. What is the point in accelerating your growth if there is nothing to do when you get there? Hate to break it to you but the vets already have everything. We need a game that you can still win vs the trillionaires with all skills at V by having more numbers than them. For that you need more newbies not quitting the game because the NPE is a disaster. ---
**Author:** ![Foggy\_Bernstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/foggy_bernstein/32/407887_2.png) [@Foggy\_Bernstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Foggy_Bernstein)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 3:45am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/213 "2020-02-29T03:45:50Z")
> [@QuakeGod](#): > > This reeks of “gimme gimme gotta have it now, it’s not fair that they are ahead of me” instant gratification… This reeks of “I had to walk to school six miles in the snow every day so you should too”. Either way, it’s whiny entitlement at it’s finest and the whole lot of you should find something other than a constantly rehashed 10 year old argument to work yourselves into a lather over. Maybe start a nice EVE is dying thread. ---
**Author:** ![Xuxe\_Xu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuxe_xu/32/464660_2.png) [@Xuxe\_Xu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuxe_Xu)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 5:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/214 "2020-02-29T05:58:35Z")
> [@Foggy\_Bernstein](#): > > A pile of crap. What a pile of crap. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 9:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/215 "2020-02-29T09:46:24Z")
> [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > Make it easier for the newbies so they stay in the game is my stance. The ui is better than before and high sec has never been safer. New players start with more sp than ever before. It’s never been easier for newbies than it is today. But they stay less now than before. What they are missing isn’t a safe and easy game, but engaging content and people to enjoy it with. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 10:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/216 "2020-02-29T10:35:37Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > It takes a long time, or thousands of dollars in plex to get new players to be able to effectively participate in strat ops. AKA pay 2 win > [@The\_Charon](#): > > Second, I would make the effective falloff for injectors less strict prior to 100m sp. And your answer is more pay 2 win? ---
**Author:** ![Ugren\_Okaski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ugren_okaski/32/181459_2.png) [@Ugren\_Okaski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ugren_Okaski)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 10:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/217 "2020-02-29T10:42:17Z")
> [@Sabus\_Narian](#): > > basically pure newbie nerf. Which part of it? First one is a straightforward highsec buff, since it allows to use in highsec all ships usable in nullsec. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 11:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/218 "2020-02-29T11:00:40Z")
> [@Daichi\_Yamato](#): > > and high sec has never been safer. And what makes you think that? ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 11:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/219 "2020-02-29T11:10:57Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > And what makes you think that? The current mechanics. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 12:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/220 "2020-02-29T12:00:05Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > And what makes you think that? Besides my own observations and the observations of the majority other players on the forums, the implications from ccp about too much safety and over farming etc? Besides that? Probably the situation where the only people i know who disagree don’t have a great track recorded of supporting their arguments and have a tendency to be dishonest… > [@Do you want more protection from people in highsec, or less?](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176): > > Protection, for example… Instant CONCORD, or opting out of combat/getting ganked/etc., can-theft causing GCC instead of suspect state, the inability for people to enter your mission space or sites in general, scams (as in: should be reversed by GMs or banned completely), making mistakes in general … you get the point. [poll](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/1) Now let’s talk about vote rigging for a bit. Thanks @Salt_Foambreaker. slight_smile Update, 04.01.2019, … [https://forums.eveonline.com/u/b4rg4in\_hunter](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/b4rg4in_hunter) read around 50 po… [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930.md?page=10) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930.md?page=12)