# Suggestion for new player acquisition and retention **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [February 24, 2020, 10:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930 "2020-02-24T22:11:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![The\_Charon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_charon/32/187468_2.png) [@The\_Charon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Charon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 12:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/61 "2020-02-25T00:51:10Z")
It would work here for the same reason it works everywhere else. A catch-up mechanic removes some of the road block for attaining higher end goals, like piloting dreads, carriers, orcas, titans, fax, rorquals etc. When you make that easier, you give people more opportunity, while still training for those higher end goals, to experience the community and playstyle of the video game. It’s like the carrot on a stick. Putting an 18 foot stick in front of a donkey doesn’t work as well as putting an 8 foot stick in front of the same donkey. If the carrot seems too far away, you’re less likely to try for it. Simple psychology. Not only would it benefit the EvE community, as far as having more bodies playing, you have to look at the overall profit of CCP. with more players on, you have a higher percentage of players that will consider buying plex. It’s all profit. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 12:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/62 "2020-02-25T00:54:42Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > A catch-up mechanic removes some of the road block for attaining higher end goals, like piloting dreads, carriers, orcas, titans, fax, rorquals etc. When you make that easier, you give people more opportunity, while still training for those higher end goals, to experience the community and playstyle of the video game. Thanks for defining what a catch up mechanic is. Please show me the proof that these improve new player retention. > [@The\_Charon](#): > > It’s like the carrot on a stick. Putting an 18 foot stick in front of a donkey doesn’t work as well as putting an 8 foot stick in front of the same donkey. If the carrot seems too far away, you’re less likely to try for it. Simple psychology. This is hilarious and I’m going to ignore it since there’s nothing worth discussing here. > [@The\_Charon](#): > > Not only would it benefit the EvE community, as far as having more bodies playing, you have to look at the overall profit of CCP. with more players on, you have a higher percentage of players that will consider buying plex. > It’s all profit. YET AGAIN. You still haven’t shown us the connection between your idea and actually improving new player retention. Do you have numbers or polls or anything to show that new players are joining, and then quitting because they can’t participate in strat ops? Do you have anything to prove that they’re quitting because they don’t want to spend thousands of dollars on PLEX for skills? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Charon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_charon/32/187468_2.png) [@The\_Charon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Charon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 12:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/63 "2020-02-25T00:57:26Z")
Strat ops is just one example of gameplay that has some skill based limitations. I would expect someone with your intelligence to be able to extrapolate that. You’re intentionally ignoring basic information in order to drive your annoying stance of, “nuh uh” without offering anything of value to explain why it would not work. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 12:59am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/64 "2020-02-25T00:59:15Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > Strat ops is just one example of gameplay that has some skill based limitations. TEST Alliance Please Ignore, arguably one of the top 5 largest nullsec alliances has programs to get new players into strat ops within an hour. So to many of the other major nullsec alliances. Your point is moot. > [@The\_Charon](#): > > You’re intentionally ignoring basic information in order to drive your annoying stance of, “nuh uh” without offering anything of value to explain why it would not work. The burden is on YOU to provide evidence why it would work. You’re the one proposing a change. We just need to say, “the status quo is fine”. It’s not our burden to disprove your argument. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Charon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_charon/32/187468_2.png) [@The\_Charon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Charon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:04am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/65 "2020-02-25T01:04:49Z")
Actually, I would argue that your point is moot. Just because those alliance have ways to get people into t1 ships and use them as cannon fodder does not help a player get into any of the shiny ships they see and want. Those take months of training, even if they don’t take much actual skill to fly. I have been successful with my jump freighter, and rorqual even though I was told not to use either since I wasn’t at the skill level they demanded in those alliances. Player skill doesn’t take long to develop, while in game it takes months or years. I have provided evidence of why my suggestions would work, and used other companies as reference. That is all I need to do to feel secure that my suggestions would be beneficial for this game and the company that runs it. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/66 "2020-02-25T01:06:17Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > Just because those alliance have ways to get people into t1 ships and use them as cannon fodder does not help a player get into any of the shiny ships they see and want. Now you’re just moving goalposts. Instead of strat ops, it’s now “shiny ships”. Are you going to argue an actual point or just move goalposts whenever each gets called out? > [@The\_Charon](#): > > I have provided evidence of why my suggestions would work, and used other companies as reference. You’ve only cited world of warcraft, but you didn’t even explain what mechanics they use. You use said “catch up mechanics” as a broad and general term. ---
**Author:** ![Xuxe\_Xu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuxe_xu/32/464660_2.png) [@Xuxe\_Xu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuxe_Xu)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/67 "2020-02-25T01:08:19Z")
i.e. - “we’ve got to burn the village down to save it” No thanks. At least you intend well…I think…but I disagree with your ideas very much. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Charon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_charon/32/187468_2.png) [@The\_Charon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Charon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/68 "2020-02-25T01:08:35Z")
successful strat ops depend on certain shiny ships. I’ve also reference capital ships and super capital ships. Perhaps you need to focus on reading retention instead of my topic for player retention. Many games have catch-up mechanics, to include faster leveling, more experience per kill, more currency per completion of goals, lower requirements for entry to raids etc… I expect more from your apparent intelligence. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/69 "2020-02-25T01:09:31Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > New players come here because of various youtube videos depicting the legendary battles of old. All games show end game raiding in their ads, many players never see those bosses on those difficulty modes. That doesn’t mean new players should skip everything the game has to offer. You seem to be a bad influence on new players! ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/70 "2020-02-25T01:10:58Z")
Under 100m is not a new player scenario. Lets make it under 10m. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/71 "2020-02-25T01:17:48Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > I expect more from your apparent intelligence. I find this ironic since you seem to not have the first clue about the differences between a skill based sandbox and a leveling merry go round game. ---
**Author:** ![FairyTail\_Omaristos](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fairytail_omaristos/32/145000_2.png) [@FairyTail\_Omaristos](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/FairyTail_Omaristos)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/72 "2020-02-25T01:22:06Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > It takes a long time, or thousands of dollars in plex to get new players to be able to effectively participate in strat ops. Wrong. And stupid. Not even going to bother reading the rest cos I can see where this will go. You’re obviously an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![Salt\_Foambreaker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salt_foambreaker/32/280119_2.png) [@Salt\_Foambreaker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salt_Foambreaker)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 1:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/73 "2020-02-25T01:33:11Z")
> [@QuakeGod](#): > > It’s not our, nor CCP’s, fault that the current generation of gamers have the attention span and patience of a toddler. They want the big shiny ship, but don’t want to put in the time or effort required to obtain and pilot said shiny ship. That’s the root of the issue… Then when they lose big shinny ship the come to the forums and whine about mean lowlife gankers and quit. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Charon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_charon/32/187468_2.png) [@The\_Charon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Charon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 2:40am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/74 "2020-02-25T02:40:59Z")
it’s already under 10m. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Charon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_charon/32/187468_2.png) [@The\_Charon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Charon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 2:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/75 "2020-02-25T02:44:56Z")
> [@Salt\_Foambreaker](#): > > I find this ironic since you seem to not have the first clue about the differences between a skill based sandbox and a leveling merry go round game. Regardless of the method for gaining xp or sp, the point remains. Trolls like yourself are going over the same things and trying to pick my topic apart without offering anything constructive. Successful games find ways to make catching up to the veteran player base possible. This game does not. So far, i’ve seen insults and fail circle logic that does nothing to address the situation. The point remains that new players must pay thousands of dollars for plex, or wait for years to be able to compete with veteran players. ---
**Author:** ![Kezrai\_Charzai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kezrai_charzai/32/394578_2.png) [@Kezrai\_Charzai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kezrai_Charzai)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 2:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/76 "2020-02-25T02:47:29Z")
It seems to me that engaging and retaining new players would hinge more on creating more situations where they can do something fun and effective with the skills and ships they have access to. Rather than targeting accelerator drops for them intended to get them into bigger and more expensive ships that they don’t have the knowledge or experience to fly yet. EVE needs more early game, solo/small gang/cheap (relatively) fit options. That attracts and engages newer players. Not “here’s a shortcut to help you rush to the end-game” kludges. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 2:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/77 "2020-02-25T02:47:34Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > Eve made the news primarily for the massive player engagements. Eve was unique back then. It isnt now. Simply isn’t true though is it? Eve made news more for controversial gameplay like scams, economy, theft and player killing in high-sec as well as big battles. Whilst it has lost some of it’s more controversial uniquness, it’s still making news for being the only full time pvp sandbox with a player driven economy on a single shard. The more this thread goes on the more it looks like you just have an idea and will make any fallacious argument to push it through and hope people are too ignorant to see the bull ■■■■. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 2:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/78 "2020-02-25T02:50:42Z")
I don’t know why the suggestion stops where it does if the idea is that easier progression helps new player retention. Why even propose any limit? Surely that is just designing to keep a limit on retention. Scrap skill points all together. Alpha = Limited access to the game. Omega = access to everything. Surely by the logic of outlined in the thread, that must provide the best experience for new players. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Charon](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_charon/32/187468_2.png) [@The\_Charon](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Charon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 2:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/79 "2020-02-25T02:52:10Z")
> [@Daichi\_Yamato](#): > > > [@The\_Charon](#): > > > > Eve made the news primarily for the massive player engagements. Eve was unique back then. It isnt now. > > Simply isn’t true though is it? > > Eve made news more for controversial gameplay like scams, economy, theft and player killing in high-sec as well as big battles. > > Whilst it has lost some of it’s more controversial uniquness, it’s still making news for being the only full time pvp sandbox with a player driven economy on a single shard. > > The more this thread goes on the more it looks like you just have an idea and will make any fallacious argument to push it through and hope people are too ignorant to see the bull ■■■■. Scams, economy, theft and player killing in highsec arent limited by skillpoints. Piloting any of the t2 or bigger ships is. Player skill develops faster than character skill. My point still remains valid, regardless of the few trolls on here trying to make this about me, rather than the point of this thread. So far, i’ve seen 1 comment that even remotely offers a fair suggestion, and that is about more low end content. Even that doesn’t address the obvious and frequent desire to fly higher end ships. Simply put, you few are trying to derail this thread and offer no sound critique or suggestions. Insulting me is not a valid critique of the topic or refinement of the suggested changes. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2020, 2:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930/80 "2020-02-25T02:53:44Z")
> [@The\_Charon](#): > > So far, i’ve seen 1 comment that even remotely offers a fair suggestion Go ■■■■ your self righteous attitude. As a discussion forum, others are able to post counters, without needing to post suggestions that just agree with you. You are no more entitled to an opinion than anyone else is, and other opinions are just as fair. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930.md?page=3) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/suggestion-for-new-player-acquisition-and-retention/221930.md?page=5)