# Surgical Strike and Conflict Promotion **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [April 24, 2020, 1:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186 "2020-04-24T13:42:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2020, 5:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/64 "2020-04-26T17:02:47Z")
> [@Torg\_Jupiter](#): > > Because you can shoot down a ship many times the value of your cheaply fitted gankboat Then how about people stop being terrible at EVE and stop flying expensive ships that can be profitably ganked? ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2020, 5:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/65 "2020-04-26T17:25:17Z")
in the old days bling were for noobs t2 was the weapon on choice for real players this days bling apear to be integral part of the meta im fine with that but people make their ships loot pinatas them complain in the forum thats not fine btw i have a providence and i hauled a LOOOOT of stuff from amarr ( o dear amarr) to jita it seems to me that a fully tanked provi with no moar than 500/600 mil in the cargo is ok if you make some money you can even insure the thing and get a bil + back in case of gank but then again people like to carry 14 bil cargos , them cry here ---
**Author:** ![Ferro\_Geffit](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ferro_geffit/32/194724_2.png) [@Ferro\_Geffit](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ferro_Geffit)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2020, 10:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/66 "2020-04-29T10:52:41Z")
Originally yes - was designed as a troll thread. But also wanted to see thoughts on conflict promotion. Wasn’t sure I was going to get it, but I am pleasantly surprised. I don’t think anything will truly get resolved, everyone has their own ideas on the game and how it should be played. I think the game is great but I am not happy about the Nerf bat coming out for so long. Would be nice to pay for a game that is increasing in value rather then decreasing. ---
**Author:** ![Elle\_Mendez](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elle_mendez/32/297262_2.png) [@Elle\_Mendez](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elle_Mendez)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2020, 11:16am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/67 "2020-04-29T11:16:42Z")
It’s an open world sandbox game, how many hands do you want to hold yours? ---
**Author:** ![Darlo\_Kubika](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darlo_kubika/32/178136_2.png) [@Darlo\_Kubika](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Darlo_Kubika)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 8:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/68 "2020-04-30T08:39:15Z")
It’s no sandbox…according to some here it is a pvp only game. And the status ‘pvp only game’ and ‘sandbox’ are mutally exclusive. THIS is what some people here are not able to understand. ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 8:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/69 "2020-04-30T08:42:26Z")
> [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > And the status ‘pvp only game’ and ‘sandbox’ are mutally exclusive. Weirdly they aren’t. Sandboxes have rules, and one of those rules can be ‘Open world PvP everywhere’ That doesn’t make it not a sandbox, it just makes it a PvP Sandbox. ---
**Author:** ![Elle\_Mendez](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elle_mendez/32/297262_2.png) [@Elle\_Mendez](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elle_Mendez)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 8:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/70 "2020-04-30T08:56:13Z")
The game is “open world” i.e. you can go where you want and in what order you like and “sandbox” i.e. you can manipulate the environment e.g. Stations, Markets, Sovereignty. PvP isn’t really a factor in these definitions but perhaps an inevitable outcome. ---
**Author:** ![Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nicolai_serkanner/32/358049_2.png) [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nicolai_Serkanner)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 9:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/71 "2020-04-30T09:46:46Z")
> [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > And the status ‘pvp only game’ and ‘sandbox’ are mutally exclusive. Bollocks. ---
**Author:** ![Darlo\_Kubika](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darlo_kubika/32/178136_2.png) [@Darlo\_Kubika](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Darlo_Kubika)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 9:59am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/72 "2020-04-30T09:59:12Z")
> [@Elle\_Mendez](#): > > The game is “open world” i.e. you can go where you want and in what order you like and “sandbox” i.e. you can manipulate the environment e.g. Stations, Markets, Sovereignty. PvP isn’t really a factor in these definitions but perhaps an inevitable outcome. Well… It is if the only possible way to play this game is either doing pvp yourself or are forced to constantly avoid said playstyle. I will never get why it is so hard to understand for some people that a safespot(high) without those crap will NOT kill the game but expand it into a game that actually will play MORE people,simply because the ones that don’t WANT those competion BS would have a place where they can do their thing. The question is a simple one. What is the better alternative,actually having MORE people ingame with some playing in a safe spot without others being able to disturb them OR a game which all those people simply leave after their first 30 day lately? This would not transform the game into wow as some bittervets say,it would -as said before- EXPAND it to a better one… Not for all,but for the majority. All those bittervet whiners are simply to ignore. ---
**Author:** ![Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nicolai_serkanner/32/358049_2.png) [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nicolai_Serkanner)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/73 "2020-04-30T10:02:13Z")
> [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > I will never get why it is so hard to understand for some people that a safespot(high) without those crap will NOT kill the game but expand it into a game that actually will play MORE people,simply because the ones that don’t WANT those competion BS would have a place where they can do their thing. Everybody understands what you’re so desperately trying to get across. It is just not true what you say and most people do know and understand that very well. ---
**Author:** ![Darlo\_Kubika](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darlo_kubika/32/178136_2.png) [@Darlo\_Kubika](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Darlo_Kubika)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:03am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/74 "2020-04-30T10:03:20Z")
> [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](#): > > Everybody understands what you’re so desperately trying to get across. It is just not true what you say and most people do know and understand that very well. Your bubble must be cozy and warm. Reality on the other hand is different. And you are not answering to my question. > [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > What is the better alternative,actually having MORE people ingame with some playing in a safe spot without others being able to disturb them OR a game which all those people simply leave after their first 30 day lately? ---
**Author:** ![Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nicolai_serkanner/32/358049_2.png) [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nicolai_Serkanner)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/75 "2020-04-30T10:08:04Z")
> [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > Reality on the other hand is different. Show me. ---
**Author:** ![Elle\_Mendez](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elle_mendez/32/297262_2.png) [@Elle\_Mendez](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elle_Mendez)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/76 "2020-04-30T10:12:10Z")
> [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > I will never get why it is so hard to understand for some people that a safespot(high) without those crap will NOT kill the game but expand it into a game that actually will play MORE people,simply because the ones that don’t WANT those competion BS would have a place where they can do their thing. I understand it. Sounds like you want to separate the game into areas which will limit the options for players and play styles - my gut feel is always to resist this. Also how does a competitive market work where one segment has limited to no risk to operate? ---
**Author:** ![Darlo\_Kubika](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darlo_kubika/32/178136_2.png) [@Darlo\_Kubika](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Darlo_Kubika)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/77 "2020-04-30T10:15:37Z")
> [@Elle\_Mendez](#): > > I understand it. Sounds like you want to separate the game into areas which will limit the options for players and play styles - my gut feel is always to resist this. Also how does a competitive market work where one segment has limited to no risk to operate? The ‘sandbox’ status of this game ended the moment this game went live and pvp was favored like crazy in this game as i already said on multiple occasions. Maybe the ‘sandbox’ was a plan in alpha but was never really realized and EVERYBODY knows this. The bittervets desperately defending this illusion just shows that they also know,but don’t want to admit it. ---
**Author:** ![Elle\_Mendez](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elle_mendez/32/297262_2.png) [@Elle\_Mendez](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elle_Mendez)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:20am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/78 "2020-04-30T10:20:15Z")
> [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > The bittervets desperately defending this illusion just shows that they also know but don’T want to admit it. I’m not a bittervet so I wouldn’t know 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Darlo\_Kubika](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darlo_kubika/32/178136_2.png) [@Darlo\_Kubika](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Darlo_Kubika)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/79 "2020-04-30T10:22:06Z")
> [@Elle\_Mendez](#): > > I’m not a bittervet so I wouldn’t know Nobody would admit being one until revealed 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/80 "2020-04-30T10:29:42Z")
> [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > EVERYBODY knows this. Given how many people disagree with you this is clearly a lie. > [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > What is the better alternative,actually having MORE people ingame with some playing in a safe spot without others being able to disturb them OR a game which all those people simply leave after their first 30 day lately? I would rather have people who can’t cope without that safe spot leave the game. Because giving them a safe spot has several effects. 1. It turns into Farmville for those people, they can just collect assets with no value which means they interfere in the market for everyone else. This can be seen in most MMO’s by the hyper inflation that occurs as people hit max level and start entering massive farming states. 2. If a person is playing in a safe zone, they aren’t interacting in a meaningful way with people, other than causing inflation on the market. This means that functionally they don’t exist for the purposes of interaction, and thus may as well not exist at all. 3. There is no way to prevent their messing with the market due to their safe spot, which means that if they are having a negative impact there is no way to fight back at it. So, taking all of the above into account, I would rather a lower player count all of whom actually exist as entities I can interact with if I wish to do so. Because 1% of 10 million is less than 100% of 500,000. And the number of entities I can meaningfully interact with is the actual relevant number, not the total number of entities who I can’t interact with in any direct way. That’s why you are wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Darlo\_Kubika](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darlo_kubika/32/178136_2.png) [@Darlo\_Kubika](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Darlo_Kubika)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/81 "2020-04-30T10:33:38Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > Given how many people disagree with you this is clearly a lie. Many? Actually it’s always the same dozen people and maybe the one or the other alt of those dozen. They are exactly doing what they accuse me of…having multiple alts. They state something wrong and answer themselves to support their wrong post and if someone supports MY point it MUST be an alt of me…surely,without ANY doubt. They know this because they do it themselves and cannot think in another way someone does it…so anybody that supports me MUST be an alt of me. And the rest of your post is just pointless,nonsense and not relevant. ---
**Author:** ![Jayce\_Fitzpatrick](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jayce_fitzpatrick/32/383289_2.png) [@Jayce\_Fitzpatrick](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jayce_Fitzpatrick)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/82 "2020-04-30T10:36:21Z")
An illustration of the interaction in this thread. ![talking_to_a_wall](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/f/e/fe779365a9b096fd3f92b1c9f30e93ca698f54c9.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Elle\_Mendez](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elle_mendez/32/297262_2.png) [@Elle\_Mendez](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elle_Mendez)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2020, 10:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186/83 "2020-04-30T10:36:27Z")
> [@Darlo\_Kubika](#): > > They state something wrong and answer themselves to support their wrong post and if someone supports MY point it MUST be an alt of me…surely,without ANY doubt. You’ve had a number of well laid out replies to your points - why not answer these rather than resort to conspiracy theories? [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186.md?page=3) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/surgical-strike-and-conflict-promotion/235186.md?page=5)