# Tackling hate speech, fostering mutual respect and countering the tyranny of the majority **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [April 21, 2020, 3:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390 "2020-04-21T03:52:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Liana\_Corfax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/liana_corfax/32/184606_2.png) [@Liana\_Corfax](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Liana_Corfax)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/21 "2020-04-21T07:12:56Z")
and trolls will often go to extreme lengths to establish what a person’s personal weakness is and then to exploit that to cause maximum personal harm to that person. ---
**Author:** ![Sen\_Isu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sen_isu/32/388091_2.png) [@Sen\_Isu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sen_Isu)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/22 "2020-04-21T07:15:31Z")
Honestly @Wadiest_Yong, I think we agree with each other on a basic level. > [@Wadiest\_Yong](#): > > Managing a community can be hard work in the beginning, but once the rules you set are crystal clear and are enforced by the one responsible, the community starts to police itself because most of them will be like minded. This is entirely true, but we just need to expand that mentality to all of our communities, on and offline. I know this is going to come around again to “What should we not allow?” and I’d just like to reiterate that, at least in my opinion, there are some things that we should all agree is offensive and shouldn’t be accepted, such as those I listed earlier. ---
**Author:** ![Sen\_Isu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sen_isu/32/388091_2.png) [@Sen\_Isu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sen_Isu)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/23 "2020-04-21T07:19:15Z")
> [@Wadiest\_Yong](#): > > Undeniably so, if the level is high enough, like blatant racism, extreme ideology, etc. However, not every single individual’s feelings can be used as a basis for rule making. It boils down to this, the tyranny of the majority vs. the tyranny of the individual (yes, the latter form exists too and is equally vicious). When is an individual’s feeling significant enough to create a rule or law that affects every other individual ? I mean, you hit it on the head yourself - blatant racism, discrimination, harassment, etc - shouldn’t be allowed. If a single person complains about a particular behavior, no, that’s not sufficient to act. If a lot of people complain about it, maybe we should take a look. I feel like we’re splitting hairs here though - I think it’s pretty clear we’re talking about high-level issues like racism. ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/24 "2020-04-21T07:23:55Z")
> [@Sen\_Isu](#): > > but we just need to expand that mentality to all of our communities, on and offline. That already happens inside those communities. Advocating that all communities should apply the exact same rules is unwise. There should of course be a variety of communities, to let any individual find his or her spot. And that is NOT the same thing as saying there should be freedom to have communities that allow hate speech etc. ---
**Author:** ![Sen\_Isu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sen_isu/32/388091_2.png) [@Sen\_Isu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sen_Isu)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:24am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/25 "2020-04-21T07:24:24Z")
Right, well, I’m not suggesting that all communities should have the exact same rules. ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/26 "2020-04-21T07:25:12Z")
Then we agree on all points 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Sen\_Isu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sen_isu/32/388091_2.png) [@Sen\_Isu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sen_Isu)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/27 "2020-04-21T07:27:47Z")
But let me ask you: how should we act when those communities start merging together, such as corps on this forum? Should we respect the way they conduct their community, even if they condone discrimination or other such behaviours? ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/28 "2020-04-21T07:28:31Z")
### Remain respectful of other members at all times All posts should be professional and courteous. You have every right to disagree with your fellow community members and explain your perspective. However, you are **not** free to attack, degrade, insult, or otherwise belittle them or the quality of this community. It does not matter what title or power you hold in these forums, you are expected to obey this rule. ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/29 "2020-04-21T07:31:55Z")
You sketch a hypothetical, compounded situation with a number of vague suppositions. Impossible to answer unless starting from facts. ---
**Author:** ![Sen\_Isu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sen_isu/32/388091_2.png) [@Sen\_Isu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sen_Isu)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/30 "2020-04-21T07:32:14Z")
Let me clarify on some things I’m **not** suggesting: - that we have a ratified Code of Conduct that every corp has to follow - that we take action based on a single individual being “offended” - that we seek out and attack communities of people we disagree with What I **am** suggesting is that we don’t just ignore or accept offensive/degrading behaviour when it comes up - an attitude that is very prevalent on the internet, and a toxic one in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Sen\_Isu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sen_isu/32/388091_2.png) [@Sen\_Isu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sen_Isu)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/31 "2020-04-21T07:32:48Z")
Uhhh that’s rather dramatic. I asked you a question regarding the situation we’re actually talking about - how the community acts as a whole, not in closed-door communities in-game. ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/32 "2020-04-21T07:34:25Z")
There is no “situation”. I stand by my answer 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Sen\_Isu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sen_isu/32/388091_2.png) [@Sen\_Isu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sen_Isu)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/33 "2020-04-21T07:34:55Z")
Right, so you’re wilfully ignoring the heart of the argument at this point, gotcha. ---
**Author:** ![Liana\_Corfax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/liana_corfax/32/184606_2.png) [@Liana\_Corfax](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Liana_Corfax)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 7:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/34 "2020-04-21T07:47:10Z")
so far I’m pleasantly surprised with the overall tone of the debate. The Eve community is a cut above the rest isn’t it? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 8:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/35 "2020-04-21T08:33:43Z")
I would try to role play a certain way on these forums and in game, but if I ever went to an eve event I would be just like a normal human being. In New Eden I born a Minmatar Brutor who is a self funded Bootlegger / Miner and is yet to find a calling. ---
**Author:** ![Lugburz](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lugburz/32/486230_2.png) [@Lugburz](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lugburz)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 9:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/36 "2020-04-21T09:01:04Z")
> [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > I hear casual racism, I hear homophobia, I hear misogyny. It disgusts me. Welcome to the wonderful world of humans. This will never change, but i would venture to say at least it is on a game and not the real world. I’m not sure what your attempting to achieve here… > [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > life can often be brutal and hateful, Ye, thats why most of us are here… in a video game. > [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > it is important to remember that you are not in the “locker room” with all your friends that are the same ftfy But technically most ARE in that same room, its called a corp. > [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > Most people are not like you. It is not funny or appropriate to speak of other races or nationalities disrespectfully. You would be wrong, most people over the world DO actually find comedy in those items, some because they are awful people, others because y’know… sarcasm and satire. > [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > Do you know of any groups in Eve that make a point of managing this issue in a responsible way and are looking for corp members that are willing and able to respect others Yes, there are some groups. > [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > hateful speech Is a point of view. For example many black people (certainly in the US and UK) constantly refer to them selves and their friends using what many sjw folk would term as rascist and inappropriate language; if you truly wish to > [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > respect others First you really need to get to know them in many cases, your sat at the other end of a black screen “how dare you assume what gender/race/orientation/sex we are” > [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > all RESPECTFUL opinions on this. Assumptive of you, your not wrong in many ways but you yourself set the tone here. > [@Liana\_Corfax](#): > > the word rape It also has other definitions, though im not keen on using the word myself we cannot quite skirt around the use of words that define exactly what we mean simply because someone, somewhere, had a terrible incident; to be frank your in the wrong place for that - you should be somewhere else petitioning for harsher sentences - but your not are you? In essence YES people use foul language, but people on the whole are vile creatures; there is very little you can do about that, i would suggest blocking those type of people and moving on - report them if it is truly unacceptable and let the ‘authorities’ deal with it. ---
**Author:** ![Lugburz](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lugburz/32/486230_2.png) [@Lugburz](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lugburz)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 9:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/37 "2020-04-21T09:09:03Z")
Isn’t making the majority conform to the minority tyranny in and of itself? ---
**Author:** ![darkestkhan\_Eriker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darkestkhan_eriker/32/390091_2.png) [@darkestkhan\_Eriker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/darkestkhan_Eriker)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 9:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/38 "2020-04-21T09:42:15Z")
> [@Sen\_Isu](#): > > What I **am** suggesting is that we don’t just ignore or accept offensive/degrading behaviour when it comes up - an attitude that is very prevalent on the internet, and a toxic one in my opinion. You do know you can report such cases, right? ---
**Author:** ![Aphrodite\_Sexy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aphrodite_sexy/32/420261_2.png) [@Aphrodite\_Sexy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aphrodite_Sexy)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 10:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/39 "2020-04-21T10:39:43Z")
1. Title: how is it tyranny if it is the majority? TACKLING hate speech… LOL 2. Hate speech: don’t post it in the forums. If you don’t like hate speech the forums is the worst place to be. It’s like asking someone to meet at Tama gate (this actually happened). 3. It’s funny how you replied to the first person with 3 paragraphs and the fourth with an uncapitalized sentence. Back to your point. I believe racism is wrong, but it doesn’t mean we get to ban them, or even try to stop them on a group level. You can call out racists and condemn them personally, but trying to ban racism just because it is “wrong” isn’t itself right. You shouldn’t ban something because it’s wrong, because none of use can know who is wrong. Banning racism justifies banning flat earth theory, and justifies the banning of voices that say “Men and women are the same” because we’re not. If people don’t like it, call it out, tell people, tell stakeholders, refute them, or troll them, and though you shouldn’t, you can curse at them and use all of those slurs you try to ban on them. If someone is trying to “harm you as much as possible”, that at least justifies some kind of violent response. If people are hurting others, they won’t make much friends. CCP is making a decision. Normal hate speech=fine, trying to get others to commit suicide and bring bad press to EvE and lose a monthly PLEX=not fine. If you don’t like someone’s actions, do something. If words are as potent as a weapon as you say, take a sword and defend yourself, parry every strike, then counterattack, and not hide behind a shield, which will break anyways. Or more like: If you don’t like Lowsec life, GIT GUD, because there’s suicide gankers in highsec and big corps in Nullsec, so Lowsec is your best bet. Shoot anyone that shoots you while at it. (edit) Become a troll hunter. You could shrug away insults: good. You found some trolls, good at identifying trolls: check. Now, go out and insult trolls. You can insult their insults: “The only people I know who use the word “rape” out of context are rapists, and rapists are rapists because they’re too ugly to find someone to ■■■■.” Good, you just insulted some troll, they’d hopefully get some empathy and never do it again. ---
**Author:** ![MyLoudVoice](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/myloudvoice/32/167265_2.png) [@MyLoudVoice](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MyLoudVoice)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 10:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390/40 "2020-04-21T10:46:27Z")
This is Eve…you don’t like how someone talks? Hunt him. Kill him. All the rest is nonsense. 💥 If you can’t be bothered doing that, it will not have been that bad. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tackling-hate-speech-fostering-mutual-respect-and-countering-the-tyranny-of-the-majority/234390.md?page=3)