# The cost of suicide ganking is too low **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [November 17, 2017, 4:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033 "2017-11-17T16:12:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 39
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/783 "2017-11-27T13:17:58Z")
If you didn’t read, how you know off topic? HAVE ALREADY DISCUSSED YOUR IDEA Just in case it was all TLDR: @Fabulous_Rod Your idead of a 50m isk module to equip ‘ward of expensive gank’ is a ■■■■ idea And demonstrates you don’t understand the game and how it all works ‘together’ as a game It also makes you look like a cry baby. Concise enough? ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/785 "2017-11-27T13:24:55Z")
Logic and rationality don’t care You’re the only one that disagrees in this case ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/786 "2017-11-27T13:28:18Z")
The last time someone agreed with him he started on her, too. ---
**Author:** ![Aergri\_Evingod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aergri_evingod/32/116437_2.png) [@Aergri\_Evingod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aergri_Evingod)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/787 "2017-11-27T13:30:00Z")
> [@Dom\_Arkaral](#): > > Logic and rationality don’t care > > You’re the only one that disagrees in this case this whole discission is similar to one with a political white knight. amusing but mr white knight saviour of his assumed human kind may never backs down from the duel he started. ---
**Author:** ![yellow\_parasol](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yellow_parasol/32/10455_2.png) [@yellow\_parasol](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/yellow_parasol)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/788 "2017-11-27T13:30:13Z")
> [@Fabulous\_Rod](#): > > Nice walls of text that nobody intelligent will read because it is you making them. I read them. My intellect is _far_ superior to yours. Most people’s is… around here, at least. It’s not even hard. One just needs to look through people’s posting history to confirm this. And compare it to yours. You’re embarrassing yourself, like a teenager in front of grown ups. There. I said it. Never stop posting. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Rhalina\_Sedai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rhalina_sedai/32/57980_2.png) [@Rhalina\_Sedai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rhalina_Sedai)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/789 "2017-11-27T13:36:03Z")
To the OP, when you have Freighters transferring billions flying towards a big pay day in Jita. You are going to be a target, that’s the nature of Eve. The only thing CCP can do as far as i am concerned is to remove concord from the game, then people can shoot first ask questions later so to speak. ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/791 "2017-11-27T13:38:58Z")
Exactly! Let him never stop. 2 people think they might play eve and come to these forums first, this thread is the first they see - One person thinks @Fabulous_Rod has a point, and everyone else (pretty much) is trash, so they leave, and don’t even install - One **_actually thinks_** , learns something about the game, and its written and unwritten codes of conduct, just as one must whenever one enters a new ‘social space’, and they remain and ‘play with us’ not just for themselves and their own ego. @Fabulous_Rod’s existence on the forums, as demonstration and performance complete- missing no nuance or aspect of the ‘problem’- provides a far better vaccine against further inanity and selfishness, than anything anyone could actually speak or write. @Fabulous_Rod is himself both the question, and the proof. EDIT: @Fabulous_Rod, @yellow_parasol doesn’t TELL me anything, we have discussion as we are fully grown up, plus I don’t think his motives are transparently vain and petty as yours are? ---
**Author:** ![yellow\_parasol](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yellow_parasol/32/10455_2.png) [@yellow\_parasol](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/yellow_parasol)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/792 "2017-11-27T13:39:58Z")
Can you point at these “everyone”? I don’t see these posts you talk about. 🙂 Do you understand what “everyone” actually means? Do you not know even _that_ ?? Or are these posts in your head? Do you hear voices too? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Fabulous\_Rod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fabulous_rod/32/34799_2.png) [@Fabulous\_Rod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fabulous_Rod)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/793 "2017-11-27T13:41:46Z")
Everyone seems to have missed it, but the newest idea is a 50 mil isk module that enables ganking in high sec. How many of you will continue to fail to discuss the relevant topics of the OP? Ready? Go ---
**Author:** ![yellow\_parasol](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yellow_parasol/32/10455_2.png) [@yellow\_parasol](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/yellow_parasol)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/794 "2017-11-27T13:45:01Z")
It’s been discussed. You’re wrong. You don’t like it, but that’s all there is to it. Would you prefer if we mass flag it for closure? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 1:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/795 "2017-11-27T13:47:04Z")
> [@Fabulous\_Rod](#): > > How many of you will continue to fail to discuss the relevant topics of the OP? Well you for a start. You are obsessed with calling people stupid and your idea of a 50m isk gank shield is irrelevant to the OP because it has nothing to do with the cost of ganking other than your perception of it. In short; it would do nothing. Isk is irrelevant in such piddly small amounts. ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 2:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/796 "2017-11-27T14:03:43Z")
It does seem that the OP has been answered. I can also tell @Fabulous_Rod did not like the answer he got. I am perceptive like that! Problem- If thread is closed due to off topic etc, will he just make another, as in the past? Solution, I don’t care but I am sure I will enjoy it. Perhaps someone could make a thread: `Of 'suicide' ganking, That it exists` And link to all @Fabulous_Rod’s posts on the topic ---
**Author:** ![Aergri\_Evingod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aergri_evingod/32/116437_2.png) [@Aergri\_Evingod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aergri_Evingod)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 2:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/797 "2017-11-27T14:08:18Z")
> [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](#): > > Perhaps someone could make a thread: > > `Of 'suicide' ganking, That it exists` that discussion although interesting may end up with calling names. perhaps a buddhistic approach of it exist therefore it is good yet how to - switching to westerner view - bring it inline and integrate it into the game as viable style? ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 2:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/798 "2017-11-27T14:11:16Z")
Well it would be a demonstration of the futility of trying to prove the validity of a mechanic, when the existence of your argument depends upon the existence of a game world which relies on that mechanic to function and balance the economy, and has done so since it’s inception. Hence my sly reference to Descarte’s proof for the existence of God. So rather than a discussion, I was just thinking a compendium of @Fabulous_Rod’s threads, in the form of links, with all the discussion and digression forming part of the demonstration ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 2:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/799 "2017-11-27T14:12:01Z")
> [@Aergri\_Evingod](#): > > bring it inline and integrate it into the game as viable style? Ah so make it more worthwhile to pirate? Agreed. The topic is now The Cost Of Suicide Ganking Is Too High 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Aergri\_Evingod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aergri_evingod/32/116437_2.png) [@Aergri\_Evingod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aergri_Evingod)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 2:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/800 "2017-11-27T14:29:18Z")
> [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](#): > > Well it would be a demonstration of the futility of trying to prove the validity of a mechanic, > when the existence of your argument depends upon the existence of a game world which relies on that mechanic > to function and balance the economy, and has done so since it’s inception. > > Hence my sly reference to Descarte’s proof for the existence of God. > > So rather than a discussion, I was just thinking a compendium of @Fabulous_Rod’s threads, in the form of links, with all the discussion and digression forming part of the demonstration I had to find a formulation for game which is logical and as jesse schell points out in his book lense does not exist, to profe you wrong or right. we might stumble upon one if using simulation as arhumentation entry point. so far ccp is like many game designer testing out jus that they mau have learned to back check for. so far we only know that eve seems to be comstructed on the broken window fallacy. what we also have is the definition if market as in supply and demand making the price. what also seems obvious that there is a need and a want at place here and gamers react to catering to need and want positively. one side wants a kill and needs easy targets the other side needs an flight window and wants lower losing cost imho. eve is a game then again it might be observed as a market-combat-social simulation. ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 2:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/801 "2017-11-27T14:32:51Z")
EVE is a submarine simulation game ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 2:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/802 "2017-11-27T14:42:53Z")
> [@Aergri\_Evingod](#): > > one side wants a kill and needs easy targets the other side needs an flight window and wants lower losing cost imho. except this is over simple, and ignores the reality, as there are no real ‘sides’ Person A may do SG (henceforth for suicide ganking) PVP, not care about the cost as this is their ‘fun’ activity, and grind for their isk. Many pvp players do this, for some hauling nd mining are there ‘grinding’ activities. They may prefer ‘harder’ targets, or they may want ‘easy kills’. Person B may do SG for profit- it is their main income stream- thus they must do cost/benefit analysis as indy players do. Person C may ‘haul’ for their income and main activity in the game, and may welcome SG as it kills those of their competition who do the same activity, but who do so thoughtlessly. They may not want lower losing costs and greater flight time generally, because they use the current mechanics well, and the existence of SG to kill those who do not, is their reward for playing the game well. as they rarely lose a ship to an SG, and when they do they have factored it into their business costs and will first ask ‘why?’ not ‘why me?’. Person D may not understand the game, that all activities in eve involve PVP, and may assume that we have on the one side, those who PVP by shooting things and like killing, and on the other side, those who do PVE and who are innocent as they do not ‘kill’. Though killing is the _least effective way of hurting someone when we are all immortal space gods._ This fundamental confusion as to the nature of the game. and their own impact on the sandbox, is a kind of blindness, that causes posts like the OPs. As it _assumes_, in advance, that this dichotomy exists, and that something must be done. But as you say > [@Aergri\_Evingod](#): > > eve is a game then again it might be observed as a market-combat-social simulation. No one is innocent in New Eden, though one can strive to be good or bad or not care either way. EDIT: THIS! > [@Dom\_Arkaral](#): > > EVE is a submarine simulation game ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 3:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/803 "2017-11-27T15:44:14Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > Don’t makje the mistake to double click the freighter thoug. I did it once and didnt understand why my freighter was not in warp. Well, I bumped him instead of warp him 😕 :DDDD ---
**Author:** ![Jenn\_aSide](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jenn_aside/32/384682_2.png) [@Jenn\_aSide](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jenn_aSide)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 3:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/804 "2017-11-27T15:52:23Z")
“I want it balanced” is a lie. And a common one that happens in real life too , in the form of “well, I don’t want it banned, I just want it better regulated!”. (“it” being a lot of things that we can’t talk about here because of the prohibition on talking about RL politics) The people who say this are people who really do want the thing they dislike to go away (and they want the people who do it punished). But they know they don’t have the power and popular support to do away with it. So they pretend to be all moderate on the issue, mainly because they know that if they show their rue colors, actual reasonable people will see what they are. If CCP changed suicide ganking mechanics tomorrow to require 1 billion isk ships, people would still get ganked (isk is easy to come by in EVE, and lots of ganking is done for tear generation so profitibilty takes a back seat), and the people who claimed to want to see ganking ‘balanced’ would then renew their calls for “more balance, in the name of the innocent new players!!!”. Because no one on earth just half-hates something, if they don’t like soething, they want it gone, period. No one says “I don’t want cancer cured, I just want it to be better balanced”. – As I’ve said before, if you don’t like ganking, teach people to be hard targets, teach them to play smart, make it harder for gankers to find rubes to gank, and watch the gankers cry and suffer over it. Thinking that CCP can make mechanical changes that will punish people you don’t like is foolish, time and time again gankers just adapted to the mechanics. They can’t adapt to smart players. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033.md?page=38) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033.md?page=40)