# The cost of suicide ganking is too low **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [November 17, 2017, 4:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033 "2017-11-17T16:12:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 9:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/81 "2017-11-18T09:25:06Z")
I think the aspect of my post you quoted was wholly relevant to your reply, And it was a great quote. Not aggressive, as you did not try to make me say anything I did not want to say. You might call it a ‘friendly’ bump- rather than an interdiction. One of the things I wanted the guy I replied to consider was just the fact that this is a game - And that the gankers motivation will rarely be 'just to hinder the progress of another’ Fun is a great reason to play a game! Nor can we assume that all members of an entity play for the same reasons. The poster assumed a deal, I hope he can reconsider these assumptions. Thank you for taking the time to read and reply to my post. ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 9:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/82 "2017-11-18T09:39:47Z")
No, it would be up to GMs to decide if it was harassment, they would look at all the evidence and make a decision, they would not be able to share all the evidence with you, though if you lost a ship and were reimbursed you could infer they agreed, they may also have just erred on the side of caution. For instance it is legitimate gameplay to follow someone around and gank them repeatedly and curtail their ability to play the game, if the sole purpose of this activity is not just to harass, but to curtail their impact on the sand box. Perhaps you war deced their corp because they were an ass in local, they dropped to npc corp and hid in high sec, and so you had to rely on bumping and ganking to ‘shut them down’ which is valid pvp. One can also hire a Merc group to take on a player, with the contract fulfilled once the character is biomassed and the name becomes available again, the Merc group in this case would be engaging in legitimate gameplay, doing pvp for profit, and the originator of the contract would not be instigating harassment, if they could show in game reasons for desiring the loss of this character. Now running a player out of the game would be something else, though can still be achieved without harassment Just look at the judge and his full set of hands! Never be a GM in eve if you want an easy life I guess. Ps. Get out their on the pipe in a cheap destroyer and just try some pvp, prep the grid with tacs first, know the system, set your targets to orange so they show in local and to distinguish from the red flashies you can engage without risk, join AG see if they will teach you some stuff, hell join CODE if they will have you. Lots to learn, no need for ‘soulbound coat of gank expense’ x fly safe(ish its eve) ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 10:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/83 "2017-11-18T10:09:30Z")
This may need review after the upcoming Alpha changes. Gankers seem to be of the opinion it “wont change much” in their activities, but I take that with a punch of salt. Especially since the change makes a T1 gunned Tornado an option for an Alpha. Cba to run the numbers of how much they will be able to output at what cost efficiency, cos I neither gank nor fly cargo/bling ships. PS: Anyone know if the new Alphas can use polarized weapons? Edit: NVM, did research and polarized weapons require T2 weapon skills. ---
**Author:** ![Reaver\_Glitterstim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/reaver_glitterstim/32/302298_2.png) [@Reaver\_Glitterstim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Reaver_Glitterstim)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 10:20am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/84 "2017-11-18T10:20:48Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Especially since the change makes a T1 gunned Tornado an option for an Alpha. With battleship artillery? Or cruiser artillery? Because there’s a very important difference between the two. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 10:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/85 "2017-11-18T10:21:10Z")
The cost of not being suicide ganked is even lower. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 10:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/86 "2017-11-18T10:22:11Z")
> [@Reaver\_Glitterstim](#): > > > [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > > > Especially since the change makes a T1 gunned Tornado an option for an Alpha. > > With battleship artillery? Or cruiser artillery? Because there’s a very important difference between the two. Definitely with Large/BS size projectiles, as that is what it is bonused for and has PG for. Bit of a silly question, bro. T2 artillery ammo is pretty crap anyways, so not much lost in using T1/faction ammo. ---
**Author:** ![Reaver\_Glitterstim](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/reaver_glitterstim/32/302298_2.png) [@Reaver\_Glitterstim](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Reaver_Glitterstim)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 10:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/87 "2017-11-18T10:51:16Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Definitely with Large/BS size projectiles, as that is what it is bonused for and has PG for. > > Bit of a silly question, bro. Not a silly question. Are you telling me that alphas can use battleship turrets? I’ll admit I’ve been away a while but that sounds retarded and unlikely. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 10:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/88 "2017-11-18T10:54:11Z")
New changes to Alphas were recently announced. Thats what hes talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Teckos\_Pech](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teckos_pech/32/375283_2.png) [@Teckos\_Pech](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teckos_Pech)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 11:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/89 "2017-11-18T11:02:51Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > This may need review after the upcoming Alpha changes. > > Gankers seem to be of the opinion it “wont change much” in their activities, but I take that with a punch of salt. > > Especially since the change makes a T1 gunned Tornado an option for an Alpha. > > Cba to run the numbers of how much they will be able to output at what cost efficiency, cos I neither gank nor fly cargo/bling ships. Why? A player can only log in one Alpha. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 11:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/90 "2017-11-18T11:35:53Z")
> [@Reaver\_Glitterstim](#): > > Are you telling me that alphas can use battleship turrets? I’ll admit I’ve been away a while but that sounds retarded and unlikely. Yes, after the proposed changes, Alphas will be able to not only fly BS, but also fit Large modules. Its slated for Dec/Jan. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 11:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/91 "2017-11-18T11:37:24Z")
> [@Teckos\_Pech](#): > > Why? A player can only log in one Alpha. And? Thats been the norm ever since Alphas where introduced. Did you have a point? ---
**Author:** ![Teckos\_Pech](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teckos_pech/32/375283_2.png) [@Teckos\_Pech](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teckos_Pech)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 11:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/92 "2017-11-18T11:39:22Z")
Yes, Alpha’s will still have minimal impact on ganking. Nobody is going to log in a fleet of Alphas…unless they have a fleet’s worth of players. Nothing has changed here. Now run back to the PLEX thread and talk to yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 11:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/93 "2017-11-18T11:41:35Z")
Oh man, you are so mad cos I wrecked your math. Alphas will be able to fly Tornadoes after the change. Fact. Alphas will he able to fly BS after the change. Fact. Change is gonna happen. Fact. Emergent gameplay will result. Fact. This has nothing to do with being only able to fly one Alpha at a time, which has always been the case. You dont have any point, whatsoever, certainly not one relevant to my post. ---
**Author:** ![Salah\_ad-Din\_al-Jawahiri](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salah_ad-din_al-jawahiri/32/172034_2.png) [@Salah\_ad-Din\_al-Jawahiri](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salah_ad-Din_al-Jawahiri)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 1:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/94 "2017-11-18T13:07:02Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Oh man, you are so mad cos I wrecked your math. > > Alphas will be able to fly Tornadoes after the change. Fact. > > Alphas will he able to fly BS after the change. Fact. > > Change is gonna happen. Fact. > > Emergent gameplay will result. Fact. > > This has nothing to do with being only able to fly one Alpha at a time, which has always been the case. > > You dont have any point, whatsoever, certainly not one relevant to my post. Why the attitude, man? He’s not wrong. A T1 Nado will cost you 70-80 million, if I remember correctly, plus an additional 10 million per gank for tags and sec status repair fees. Not exactly entry level. Tornado gankers are professionals - there are better and cheaper ways to gank if you’re doing it just for lulz. Besides, unlike destroyers, the Tornado takes a while to train along with all the supporting skills, _and_ you’ll need to upgrade the character to Omega to do that. Sustaining an Omega account with SP ejection will cost you 200 m/mo, give or take. If you can afford to burn Nados on a consistent basis, you sure can afford to maintain a dedicated account for your ganker, which also gives you additional benefits, like the ability to multibox legally. Some joker undocking a Tornado to randomly shoot something for the fun of it? Sure, that will be happening sometimes. A couple of friends setting up an _ad hoc_ fleet once in a blue moon? Possible. But Alpha nado genkers on every highsec gate? Not gonna happen. ---
**Author:** ![Agondray](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/agondray/32/414989_2.png) [@Agondray](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Agondray)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 1:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/95 "2017-11-18T13:07:58Z")
yes but its so easy to avoid, I can sit on a game -10 with no local response, as well as prealign to my next target off of a citadel right after concord kills my ship ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 1:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/96 "2017-11-18T13:22:25Z")
> [@Salah\_ad-Din\_al-Jawahiri](#): > > A T1 Nado will cost you 70-80 million Nowhere near that. Im not saying Tornados will supplant Destroyers entirely. Nobody suggested that. Just that they will be available as an Alpha option with a very significant alpha damage which may or may not cycle fast enough to seriously augment a gank fleet inside of CONCORD reaction times vs EHP of target. As to the 20mil SP change, there are innumerable accounts that already default to that as an Alpha, such as one of mine. I can fly a full dps stat Alpha Tornado, the second this change occurs. Tornados cost more (atm), but also mean the gank fleet requires less ships/players. ---
**Author:** ![Teckos\_Pech](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teckos_pech/32/375283_2.png) [@Teckos\_Pech](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teckos_Pech)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 4:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/97 "2017-11-18T16:54:52Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Oh man, you are so mad cos I wrecked your math. No dipthong. You are using exactly the same type of calculations in that thread that I used you fool. Exactly the same. The thing is, I gave up because you were playing idiotic games. No matter what number I picked you’d respond with, “LOLWUT, you are retarded I meant this number.” Then you did exactly that. The only thing you “wrecked” is your own reputation. ---
**Author:** ![Teckos\_Pech](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teckos_pech/32/375283_2.png) [@Teckos\_Pech](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teckos_Pech)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 5:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/98 "2017-11-18T17:08:59Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Nowhere near that. See you are doing it here. They guy wrote, “It will cost X, if I remember correctly.” And you focus on that little detail as if it really matters when ganking given that people often hand out ships for this. > [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Tornados cost more (atm), but also mean the gank fleet requires less ships/players. This is true now, with the only difference being the odd Alpha here and there. And who cares if Alpha’s gank or not? Oh, and I wouldn’t be surprised if people who gank with alts…use those alts as SP farms to pay for their accounts to be _Omega_ which also reduces the number of people needed to gank given their higher SP let them do more damage no matter the ship. Edit: BTW he is off by about 10 million ISK _or so_. Not like it is a huge error, especially given that ganking is often done with a pretty decent profit. ---
**Author:** ![Galaxy\_Pig](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/galaxy_pig/32/374625_2.png) [@Galaxy\_Pig](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Galaxy_Pig)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 5:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/99 "2017-11-18T17:30:41Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > so to take the P I used to move stuff through the choke points and as I got through safely I would post Gankers fail again, was hilarious to see their reaction. What a sad and pathetic narrative you tell yourself. #Draclivesmatter #Gameunfair #Dracplayswithhimself ---
**Author:** ![Anjyl\_Took](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anjyl_took/32/31967_2.png) [@Anjyl\_Took](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anjyl_Took)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033/100 "2017-11-18T18:06:03Z")
> [@Do\_Little](#): > > And heed the words of wisdom from Einstein: > ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/d/d/ddd6a9913640b6fd6a7ab7474e45d7b4b778c19c.jpg) How many times have you shared this advice? What kind of results do you get in sharing it? [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033.md?page=4) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-cost-of-suicide-ganking-is-too-low/40033.md?page=6)