# The CSM 13 Winter Summit Minutes are out **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** csm\ **Created:** [October 2, 2018, 8:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726 "2018-10-02T20:37:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Jeremiah\_Saken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jeremiah_saken/32/266740_2.png) [@Jeremiah\_Saken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jeremiah_Saken)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/241 "2018-10-03T12:45:06Z")
“CSM is a players representatives” they are surprised that HS players have problems with wardecc… I can’t even count how many threads about wardecc I’ve seen over the years, how many I participate and how many solutions I’ve seen, wrote by hs mercenaries even. CSM memeber is surprised…because all they care is NS. ---
**Author:** ![Norian\_Rever](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/norian_rever/32/99362_2.png) [@Norian\_Rever](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Norian_Rever)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/242 "2018-10-03T12:45:18Z")
> [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > CCP is in a dire need of a Gordon Ramsay kind of personality to put them back on their legs. So they will start hiring and delivering instead of showing CSM how bad it is, as if we didnt knew already. Salvos Rhoska would have been that, but look what happened to that. Mountains of trolling in 8days, including by seated CSM, and a forum ban. ---
**Author:** ![Cyber\_Fight\_r](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cyber_fight_r/32/167707_2.png) [@Cyber\_Fight\_r](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cyber_Fight_r)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/243 "2018-10-03T12:46:03Z")
Content != Shooting Retrievers. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/244 "2018-10-03T12:47:24Z")
It surprised me (though it shouldn’t have) that nullsec CSM members were focusing on something which is primarily a High Sec issue. Which is what I said in my post. ---
**Author:** ![Norian\_Rever](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/norian_rever/32/99362_2.png) [@Norian\_Rever](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Norian_Rever)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/245 "2018-10-03T12:50:47Z")
> [@Steve\_Ronuken](#): > > It surprised me (though it shouldn’t have) that nullsec CSM members were focusing on something which is primarily a High Sec issue. > > Which is what I said in my post. YOU’VE ATTENDED 7 SUMMITS! To my knowledge, that is the most any CSM ever has, and still you are surprised? Did you sleep through them all or just not care? PS: CSM have NOT cared about the HS wardec issue, for years, especially **“nullsec CSM members”** (your words) so your “surprise” is triple disingenuous. ---
**Author:** ![Jeremiah\_Saken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jeremiah_saken/32/266740_2.png) [@Jeremiah\_Saken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jeremiah_Saken)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/246 "2018-10-03T12:51:07Z")
🙄 what nullsec CSM memebers? You supposed to backend players of all security spaces. I didn’t see distnguish marks on your portraits who you will lobby for. This is getting better and better. Problem didn’t occur yesterday. CCP losing players all the time because of this. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/247 "2018-10-03T12:51:08Z")
Have fun talking about yourself in the third person, like yours not just posting on an alt account? You insulted a bunch of the sitting CSM members. , and were advocating for the removal of the csm as a whole. While refusing to answer any questions about your opinions on any other matter. It’s indicative of how you would behave if you had somehow managed to hoodwink enough people to vote for you. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/248 "2018-10-03T12:53:36Z")
We shouldnt be fighting now here, we should want a clear answer to a question. When wardec changes CCP? DATE! ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/249 "2018-10-03T12:53:42Z")
Nullsec CSM members: people elected to the csm, primarly by their nullsec alliance. The ones accused of only caring about nullsec, by the majority of people who complain about the csm. My point is, they tend to care about more than just their little corner. ---
**Author:** ![Tora\_Bushido](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tora_bushido/32/382053_2.png) [@Tora\_Bushido](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tora_Bushido)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/250 "2018-10-03T12:54:38Z")
Made a calculation, on how much isks Marmites spend on war dec fees the last 5 years. Seems the number of isks spend on war dec fees is only getting lower. Does that mean the problem is also got smaller? [https://evestats.webbrar.com/stats](https://evestats.webbrar.com/stats) 2013 : 356 B 2014 : 704 B 2015 : 633 B 2016 : 276 B 2017 : 219 B About 2,2 trillion in war dec fees. ---
**Author:** ![Norian\_Rever](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/norian_rever/32/99362_2.png) [@Norian\_Rever](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Norian_Rever)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/251 "2018-10-03T12:54:57Z")
> [@Steve\_Ronuken](#): > > and were advocating for the removal of the csm as a whole. Which you are demonstrating as something that should be done. ---
**Author:** ![Engelious\_Angelion](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/engelious_angelion/32/100486_2.png) [@Engelious\_Angelion](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Engelious_Angelion)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/252 "2018-10-03T12:55:26Z")
It just means more war happens in low or null sec were they dont care to dec it,. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/253 "2018-10-03T12:56:40Z")
Steve there is an issue, I was doing AG anti-freighter ganking stuff about two years ago, I decided not to continue as it was too unbalanced, then we had the there has to be a limit to bumping, many people were great and we waited and waited and waited and then we find that someone told the developers not to bother as there was no need for it? Seriously? So many HS players were like what the hell! I have a better idea for bumping now, which is a module that only freighters can fit which enables them to warp at any speed, so they can warp to BM’s or fleet mates in the direction of the bump, and it also creates zero mass so it gets to the point where the Macherial struggles to bump it when the module is activated. So bumping can still occur to a degree and there are fitting choices and stuff. If you can do this for HIC’s to satisfy one community why not for this? Anyway I digress, but the thing is who the hell said there was no demand for it? I would love to know that. I could guess, but… ---
**Author:** ![Norian\_Rever](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/norian_rever/32/99362_2.png) [@Norian\_Rever](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Norian_Rever)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/254 "2018-10-03T12:56:49Z")
> [@Steve\_Ronuken](#): > > Nullsec CSM members: people elected to the csm, primarly by their nullsec alliance. Who do you think elected you, and kept you as an ineffective stooge on the panel for years on end? They roll right over your passivity on the panel. ---
**Author:** ![Jeremiah\_Saken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jeremiah_saken/32/266740_2.png) [@Jeremiah\_Saken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jeremiah_Saken)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/255 "2018-10-03T12:57:55Z")
Again problems were reported for years, where have you been? Now you wrote that you care? Because CCP gave you data that confirm all that wardecc threads? Steven don’t take an example from Brisc and don’t turn yourself into politician. ---
**Author:** ![Engelious\_Angelion](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/engelious_angelion/32/100486_2.png) [@Engelious\_Angelion](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Engelious_Angelion)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/256 "2018-10-03T12:58:46Z")
Toxic much, be nice to steve… he has done more for eve than most. And shouldnt we try and stay ontopic… i u whant a thread about no CSM go make it. i partly agree its not the best system, but this aint the place to debate it. ---
**Author:** ![gnshadowninja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gnshadowninja/32/160500_2.png) [@gnshadowninja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/gnshadowninja)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 12:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/257 "2018-10-03T12:59:27Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > I am glad to see that you have moved your position a bit, good to hear it. 20 is too high, I wanted to push people towards more targeted war decs as small and solo entities and five looks about right to me in terms of gathering intel etc. Remember that they do not have the locator logon intel that the Concord agent in a citadel would give them under my suggestion. So they have to be on top of what their prey is doing. My positions always been the same mate, I don’t mind suggestions as long as its not stupid like 99% of them made by people who zero experience in this gameplay and believe they can make players what they aint. In POH we had around 20-30 wars, Devil’s used to run similar numbers and be able to sustain decent content within the old hunting system. From conversations I’ve had in the past within the community if CCP introduce limits through structures then out of protest we were going to insure no one could put down structures meaning everyone would be limited to whatever the limit was. I am open to change within the system but it has to be thought through, I think alot of people forget that any change **will** effect the game dramatically, mainly economy (The trillions killed by merc’s do make a difference). Safer high sec, less deaths, less sales, less building and so forth… Honestly alot of us have been making trail alts just to do ganking, less cost, less effort, less avoidable. ---
**Author:** ![Norian\_Rever](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/norian_rever/32/99362_2.png) [@Norian\_Rever](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Norian_Rever)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 1:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/258 "2018-10-03T13:00:14Z")
> [@Engelious\_Angelion](#): > > he has done more for eve than most. He doesnt done squat except enjoy a paid vacation to Iceland twice a year, for 6 years, and sit at the table nodding his head between napping at whomever happens to be speaking at that moment. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 1:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/259 "2018-10-03T13:00:14Z")
> [@gnshadowninja](#): > > Honestly alot of us have been making trail alts just to do ganking, less cost, less effort, less avoidable. Can I quote you on that? Something the CSM should also note about hisec! I like the war dec system, I really do not like it used as it is now for kilboard farming as such in pipes and around hubs as a sort of shooting gallery. Perhaps I am wrong, but it seems to be poor content in the main now But I appreciate the answer o7 ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 1:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/260 "2018-10-03T13:00:39Z")
Its rather that there is not as much to wardec now. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726.md?page=12) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726.md?page=14)