# The CSM 13 Winter Summit Minutes are out **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** csm\ **Created:** [October 2, 2018, 8:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726 "2018-10-02T20:37:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![nomadd79](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nomadd79/32/318737_2.png) [@nomadd79](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/nomadd79)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/161 "2018-10-03T11:05:01Z")
> [@Tora\_Bushido](#): > > Not broken, but there are many things that could be improved. Disagree. I think wardec mechanics **are** totally broken. I think war decs need to be changed in a way to force the aggressors to actually fight, not just camp gates and undocks waiting for easy pickings. Right now there is no real way for a defender to fight back and even when they do, there’s no way to _“win”_ the war declared against them. When defenders do form up a proper fleet, there is no incentive for the attackers to take the fight and they normally just melt away until the fleet leaves. The whole thing is ridiculous and something **has to** change. ---
**Author:** ![Warrior\_Xena](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/warrior_xena/32/173536_2.png) [@Warrior\_Xena](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Warrior_Xena)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/162 "2018-10-03T11:08:22Z")
“Wormholers feel that the citadels are very anti capital in wormholes and should be changed to make it more viable to destroy citadels in wormholes.” and nothing about citadels being totally useless against sub-caps ? and you call that balancing. ---
**Author:** ![Norian\_Rever](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/norian_rever/32/99362_2.png) [@Norian\_Rever](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Norian_Rever)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/163 "2018-10-03T11:09:42Z")
Another fruitless CSM Summit. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:11am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/164 "2018-10-03T11:11:43Z")
> [@Norian\_Rever](#): > > Another fruitless CSM Summit. Not really, it helped making nullsec carebearing safer. That’s something. ---
**Author:** ![Norian\_Rever](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/norian_rever/32/99362_2.png) [@Norian\_Rever](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Norian_Rever)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/165 "2018-10-03T11:12:39Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > > [@Norian\_Rever](#): > > > > Another fruitless CSM Summit. > > Not really, it helped making nullsec carebearing safer. That’s something. Great. Just what EVE needed more of. Wonder which CSMs political interests that was in. ---
**Author:** ![Tora\_Bushido](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tora_bushido/32/382053_2.png) [@Tora\_Bushido](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tora_Bushido)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:16am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/166 "2018-10-03T11:16:01Z")
I have the same issues when I try to kill a big nulsec alliance. It’s too hard, nulsec must be broken? Just deal with it and HTFU. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Marek\_Kanenald](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/marek_kanenald/32/257788_2.png) [@Marek\_Kanenald](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Marek_Kanenald)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/167 "2018-10-03T11:21:25Z")
> [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > That’s for them to figure out. But the bottom line is the amount of ratting isk entering the game is unsustainable. It’s off the charts. How about they make anomalies something that you can not clear solo while afk. ---
**Author:** ![Mingja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mingja/32/50857_2.png) [@Mingja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mingja)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/168 "2018-10-03T11:22:40Z")
> [@Marek\_Kanenald](#): > > How about they make anomalies something that you can not clear solo while afk. congratz, you now annihilated any means of generating ISK for newbros, while leaving the problematic ratting untouched. Super/Carrier ratting is not even remotely AFK. It is probably one of the highest APM activities in Eve. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/169 "2018-10-03T11:23:55Z")
We are repeating it all, all of it is nothing new. All what was said here was in thread about carrier changes when CCP wanted to nerf carriers DPS because of too much bounties flowing into the system. 😞😞😞😞😞 ---
**Author:** ![Marek\_Kanenald](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/marek_kanenald/32/257788_2.png) [@Marek\_Kanenald](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Marek_Kanenald)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:24am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/170 "2018-10-03T11:24:04Z")
> [@Mingja](#): > > congratz, you now annihilated any means of generating ISK for newbros, while leaving the problematic ratting untouched. Super/Carrier ratting is not even remotely AFK. There should be easy and hard anomalies. Easy anomalies should pay less and should be a solo activity. And carrier ratting is still solo, the highest paying anomalies shouldn’t be something you can do solo without any risk. ---
**Author:** ![nomadd79](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nomadd79/32/318737_2.png) [@nomadd79](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/nomadd79)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:24am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/171 "2018-10-03T11:24:52Z")
LMAO. I’ve been part of a few fleets that formed to take on HS wardeccers but you guys tend to run away. Maybe it’s y’all that need to HTFU, take a break from killing haulers and _actually take fights_?? ---
**Author:** ![Mingja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mingja/32/50857_2.png) [@Mingja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mingja)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:24am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/172 "2018-10-03T11:24:55Z")
> [@Marek\_Kanenald](#): > > And carrier ratting is still solo, the highest paying anomalies shouldn’t be something you can do solo without any risk. If you only have a problem with solo, then don’t say clear solo while AFK. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/173 "2018-10-03T11:25:50Z")
CCP admitting that they have problems for a lot of time. Doing nothing about it. Its the end folks. ---
**Author:** ![Marek\_Kanenald](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/marek_kanenald/32/257788_2.png) [@Marek\_Kanenald](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Marek_Kanenald)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/174 "2018-10-03T11:26:03Z")
> [@Mingja](#): > > If you only have a problem with solo, then don’t say clear solo while AFK. I have a problem with both. AFK VNI ratting is also BS. ---
**Author:** ![Mingja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mingja/32/50857_2.png) [@Mingja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mingja)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/175 "2018-10-03T11:26:47Z")
> [@Marek\_Kanenald](#): > > I have a problem with both. AFK VNI ratting is also BS. then please remove Fleet PvP as well. It has similar APM’s as roaming and F1 Monkeying. I don’t disagree that AFK is not the best thing to handle it, but some people actually prefer more relaxed playstyles. I have 0 problem with something being semi-afk’able aslong as it doesn’t pay too much. It’s a huge problem if AFK is more profitable than active. Which isn’t the case for VNI ratting. ---
**Author:** ![Sade\_Musana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sade_musana/32/93959_2.png) [@Sade\_Musana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sade_Musana)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/176 "2018-10-03T11:28:04Z")
Does fleet PVP generate Isk? ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/177 "2018-10-03T11:28:32Z")
Mine will be, likely, a poor imitation. But it’s still very tasty 😁 ---
**Author:** ![darkestkhan\_Eriker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darkestkhan_eriker/32/390091_2.png) [@darkestkhan\_Eriker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/darkestkhan_Eriker)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/178 "2018-10-03T11:29:34Z")
> [@gregora\_mai](#): > > Bevore doing something in war System do something against all these Gankers around. Did CCP check the KB and how many Ganks are going dayly? gankers come blow up and go… nothing needs changing here. Wardec can stay for _months_. Try doing anything with extensive wardec going on… other than going afk or dropping corp. ---
**Author:** ![Norian\_Rever](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/norian_rever/32/99362_2.png) [@Norian\_Rever](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Norian_Rever)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/179 "2018-10-03T11:31:01Z")
Great. CSM and CCP exchanging recipes at Summit. Totally worth it. ---
**Author:** ![Mingja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mingja/32/50857_2.png) [@Mingja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mingja)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726/180 "2018-10-03T11:31:51Z")
> [@Sade\_Musana](#): > > Does fleet PVP generate Isk? that argument is a can of worms tbh. Mine was more about Semi AFK playstyles. if you want to open the can of worms of isk per time spent than by all means stop all market activites ASAP because traders have by far the most ISK per time spent. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726.md?page=8) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-csm-13-winter-summit-minutes-are-out/110726.md?page=10)