# The real reasons player population is declining **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [January 16, 2018, 5:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517 "2018-01-16T17:54:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 54
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 5:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1081 "2018-06-11T17:45:20Z")
> [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > Calm down failed ag general, I’m a bit worried about your blood pressure. Where did I actually fail? I had a 40% save rate in doing something loaded against us, and I have never lost a ship to you lot and added to the cost of each gank as and act of resistance with two T2 logi, if that is failing I wonder what winning is like. I decided that the game play was stale and boring and not worth my time so went back to nullsec and I am winning all the time there. 😛 > [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > Grow up man. My blood pressure is perfectly fine, but yours does not seem to be, calm down gankbear. > [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > The only thing I always say about injectors (and I said that in the very first thread they announced them) is that they are a really dumb addition but that I have no problem abusing the shite out of them. They pay all my accounts which I have more than ever since they are basically free now. The injectors benefit my play-stile especially and still I’m against them because I think they are bad for the game. I know this must somehow completely break your brain, hence the childish “your whining about injector”. You are whining about it, how noble to think of CCP but I am so unimpressed… They have the data on their clients, they made their decision with data that you do not have. By the way something that you throw around at others, you have no idea what the impact is, you assume it is bad for them. I have seen a lot of people having more fun because they inject and get better content, but that is an observation, same as you observing your SP farm and saying lots of people are doing this so their revenue will be down… They decided on balance it was a good thing for the game, I also noticed them doing injectors which are rewarded for active game play at different times, did you notice that? So throwing grow up at me is rather amusing, the growing up is needed by you in understanding that you are making an observation which is worth jack, an emotive response to your own feelings… ---
**Author:** ![000Hunter000](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/000hunter000/32/465654_2.png) [@000Hunter000](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/000Hunter000)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1082 "2018-06-11T18:57:28Z")
Want more players? That’s easy! Just make declaring war in hi sec harder! 🤷‍♂️ I know, i know, carebear bla bla bla, but you know it would work, newbies won’t get shot out of the sky, won’t lose their expensive toy, which they weren’t prepared to lose and will remain in the game longer. Will this turn EVE into WOW? Maybe… I dunno… ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1083 "2018-06-11T18:58:57Z")
Noobs and carebears would still find a hundred other things to cry about… ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 7:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1084 "2018-06-11T19:07:20Z")
> [@000Hunter000](#): > > Want more players? That’s easy! Just make declaring war in hi sec harder! 🤷‍♂️ No, what you need to do is leave it to the players, allow any entity to do max 4 wars, then all other wars are tied to their citadel where an agent of CONCORD is available to them. If the citadel is destroyed then all war decs but 4 are lost. An incentive to fight and there be consequences in terms of war decking more muscular alliances. It would work quite well IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 8:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1090 "2018-06-11T20:03:53Z")
What insults Draccie? Are facts insulting to you now? 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 8:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1091 "2018-06-11T20:24:42Z")
> [@Dom\_Arkaral](#): > > Are facts insulting to you now? 🙄 What facts, just your normal purile insults. Anyway flame away I am off to cuddle up to the wife. o7 ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 8:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1093 "2018-06-11T20:30:19Z")
Do quote where I so savagely insulted you in my last replies. From the looks of it, it feels like some animal attacked you or something. Anyway, population is stable, and unless CCP does something omegalul worthy, numbers won’t go back up ---
**Author:** ![Clockwork\_Robot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/clockwork_robot/32/13535_2.png) [@Clockwork\_Robot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Clockwork_Robot)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 10:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1094 "2018-06-11T22:33:34Z")
You know, I really should have told you that I agree with your sentiments earlier than now. Sorry for the lateness. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 7:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1095 "2018-06-12T07:00:18Z")
@Ima_Wreckyou You seem a bit mad with your thin skin and always need to get personal, does calling people white knights or the gud guy give you a boner? It does not bother me at all, just makes you look even more desperate. Every time you post that I chuckle, it is so sad, it does not work… You asked why Clockwork Robert was playing the game if it is full of bullies, after he had already given the answer which is that people can feel pride at being able to hack it. He also detailed the toxicity of people like you: > [@Clockwork\_Robot](#): > > I will however, have to point out that the culture that EvE produces, is one of treating the person you’ve killed like an absolute feckless ■■■■■■■ moron, and doing literally whatever you can in and out of game to piss them off, enrage them, and produce those all coveted “tears.” > [@Clockwork\_Robot](#): > > I think you are going to be hard pressed to get people to login to be a helpless lamb so you can kill them. That last point is important, in fact what has happened is that you have got to the people now who either know what they are doing or are so rich that they just go so what, which is why you get this type of post: > [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > Personally, I think Eve’s issue with stagnation comes from too much wealth and safety for veterans, Yes, many of us don’t give a flying fig about the losses from freighter ganking, an allied freighter pilot lost a freighter with a Vindi and a Widow among others, he just shrugged and said oh well back to carrier ratting. Must break you little hearts that reaction. Not that you lot are any good at it in terms of impacting me, I always played with the attitude to be hard to kill and at teh end of the day I find you lot pretty poor content relying on a naff mechanic to be successful. All that time I spent in hisec, in T2 logi, repping freighters and not one loss, all those DST’s moved all those freighters and Orca’s moved and not a single successful gank on me. Sad aren’t you… You mention Knowledgeminer who is a very effective killer of miner gankers, he does it because it is hard and a challenge and he is very good at it. My fight on mining ships was to get CCP to give options on the ships after they buffed the destroyer DPS. Mining ships are in the right place now, there is a choice between tank and yield and ease of use, players have options. As far as I am concerned you can gank away to your little hearts content on those miners who don’t use a Skiff or a Procurer, you are not up to those are you? My sole issue with ganking at this moment is the bumping mechanic making it too easy and boring, it needs adjustment, if that gets adjusted then gank away with my blessing. But you so want to get personal to make **you** feel better, but your whine on injectors was at the level of the worst carebear, you little gankbear and your yapping lap dog. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 10:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1104 "2018-06-12T10:22:26Z")
> [@Dom\_Arkaral](#): > > Do quote where I so savagely insulted you in my last replies. Still waiting @Dracvlad Unless ofc you pulled that out of your bum ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 11:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1105 "2018-06-12T11:01:18Z")
> [@Dom\_Arkaral](#): > > Do quote where I so savagely insulted you in my last replies. Never used the word savagely, that is your invention… ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 11:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1106 "2018-06-12T11:32:01Z")
As are those _insults_ you keep crying about 10/10 ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 12:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1107 "2018-06-12T12:42:58Z")
> [@Dom\_Arkaral](#): > > As are those _insults_ you keep crying about That’s basically the only thing those guys are good at, playing the victim and crying on the forums about it. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 12:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1108 "2018-06-12T12:50:47Z")
> [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > That’s basically the only thing those guys are good at, playing the victim and crying on the forums about it. Never been a victim, so have no idea what you are wittering on about, but do continue. ---
**Author:** ![Seraphia](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/seraphia/32/78346_2.png) [@Seraphia](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Seraphia)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 1:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1109 "2018-06-12T13:27:12Z")
I agree with you entirely about “fairness”. The basic problem is that the PvP griefer needs only get it right once, the non-PvP player has to get it right EVERY TIME. The basic problem is I don’t know when there’s going to be a fight, I might be in a mission, I might be mining, I might be transporting goods, who knows. the griefer knows when there is going to be a fight-- he’s going to start it. As a result he will have optimal fit and fittings and come at me in a situation where there really isn’t much of a chance. 99% of my PvP in EVE has been in the form of being engaged with no realistic chance to fight back. This means that the game ultimately dis-incentivizes trying to DO things, because people that do nothing but sit around and try to stop people from doing things have the advantage over them EVERY. LAST. TIME. How to fix that? well, I’m not so sure. Giving every ship in the game a realistic chance of fighting and beating any other given ship would be a titanic undertaking, but would ensure that risk/reward was balanced out. But it’s clear something has to be done, to me. EVE puts you in too many situations where skill and flying ability don’t matter, you’re going to lose the moment you’re locked up. Even in 1.0 space, they can bring more suicide destroyers than your barge can tank, sure they lose them all, but you lose your ship and they consider that a fair trade. Ideally, a better-flown ship should be able to survive any encounter with proper planning and perhaps a bit of luck. At the very least they need to fix the fact that 1.0 sec space is no safer than null if someone really wants to kill you. Sticking to hi-sec is turning off your PvP flag, it’s stating that you don’t want to engage in PvP-- as a result EVE nerfs the hell out of the rewards you can gain, missions pay less, ratting can’t make 50k an hour, planetary interaction is nerfed to the point it would take a year to pay off the base parts, you can’t moon mine, you can’t run L5 missions or harder scan sites… So why would anyone ever suffer all those penalties and limited experiences? Because THEY DON’T WANT TO PVP. But sadly, they’re not protected even for all they give up. ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 1:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1110 "2018-06-12T13:31:55Z")
> [@Seraphia](#): > > At the very least they need to fix the fact that 1.0 sec space is no safer than null if someone really wants to kill you. Did you ever get suicide ganked in a 1.0 ? Please link the killmail. ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 1:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1111 "2018-06-12T13:38:13Z")
So don’t put yourself in a situation to get ganked in the first place. It’s that simple… ---
**Author:** ![Seraphia](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/seraphia/32/78346_2.png) [@Seraphia](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Seraphia)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 1:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1112 "2018-06-12T13:38:17Z")
my most recent was in a .6, but I have been before, this was some time ago but AFAIK they still hold that “event” where they hunt barges in hi-sec every year. ---
**Author:** ![Seraphia](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/seraphia/32/78346_2.png) [@Seraphia](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Seraphia)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 1:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1113 "2018-06-12T13:39:19Z")
That’s EXACTLY MY POINT. People stopping people from “doing” are always going to outgun the ones that want to do tthings… and that’s why people leave the game. Actually these days I hang out in Null and it’s actually SAFER than hi-sec in my experience. Which is just terrible game design. ---
**Author:** ![QuakeGod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/quakegod/32/480339_2.png) [@QuakeGod](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/QuakeGod)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517/1114 "2018-06-12T13:41:09Z")
No one is stopping you from doing anything. No one put a gun to your head and made you transport 30 billion ISK worth of cargo to Jita. That’s your choice. Making yourself less of a target is easily achieved. Don’t want to get ganked in a paper thin barge? Fly a max tanked Skiff. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517.md?page=53) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-real-reasons-player-population-is-declining/51517.md?page=55)