# The Rise and Fall in Bitcoin Value **URL:** \ **Category:** Out Of Pod Experience\ **Created:** [January 18, 2022, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290 "2022-01-18T13:41:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 102
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2065 "2022-11-28T13:14:46Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Every transaction on BTC is public domain. LOL. Literally. Yes, Good luck trying to link a transaction to a person or home address. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2066 "2022-11-28T13:37:43Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Yes, Good luck trying to link a transaction to a person or home address. Why would I care? YOU are the one who is the person who complains that “His privacy has been infringed upon!”. Then again, you did inform your ISP about your name and location. Then you chose to browse the Internet and post about where you live. Then you chose to make youtube videos. Then you choose to show your face in those videos… one day you might even buy a smartphone! Right? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2067 "2022-11-28T13:42:28Z")
You’re the one typing on a forum thread that doesn’t concern you. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2068 "2022-11-28T13:43:19Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Yes, Good luck trying to link a transaction to a person or home address. Ok, you must be right… oh wait, LOL. > **[Record-high seizure of $4bn in stolen Bitcoin](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60310783)** > > Two suspects allegedly conspired to launder the money after it was stolen by a hacker in 2016. > **[Two Arrested for Alleged Conspiracy to Launder $4.5 Billion in Stolen...](https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/two-arrested-alleged-conspiracy-launder-45-billion-stolen-cryptocurrency)** > > Two individuals were arrested this morning in Manhattan for an alleged conspiracy to launder cryptocurrency that was stolen during the 2016 hack of Bitfinex, a virtual currency exchange, presently valued at approximately $4.5 billion. Thus far, law... Am man, that privacy invading google is helping me to make you look like a clown. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2069 "2022-11-28T13:44:40Z")
Yes, when they steal crypto I believe they target websites of exchanges, presumably to learn login credentials. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2070 "2022-11-28T13:45:56Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > You’re the one typing on a forum thread that doesn’t concern you. It does, I play EVE Online. Also I am quite entertained by your answers that are quite the parody on crypto addicts. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2071 "2022-11-28T13:48:04Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > It does, I play EVE Online. Also I am quite entertained by your answers that are quite the parody on crypto addicts. Lol, is this your best argument for why crypto is a scam? ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2072 "2022-11-28T13:48:44Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Yes, when they steal crypto I believe they target websites of exchanges, presumably to learn login credentials. Okay, I will rephrase it just for you : You said “link a transaction to a person or home address” is not possible. Those posts just say the exact opposite and it’s not just those two, there are many people who think crypto (which is 100% traced) can’t be traced back to them. Clear? ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2073 "2022-11-28T13:48:44Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > new system governed by clear unchangeable rules, that are the same for everyone and is completely independent. Heh, that definitely fits chinese system description. China will just buy whole countries when they default. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 1:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2074 "2022-11-28T13:49:35Z")
Ok cool, feel free to show me an example of where this happened. If there is no evidence to support this then what’s the point of taking it as gospel? ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 2:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2075 "2022-11-28T14:41:40Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > It is like arguing that gold could be a good currency, but every time somebody gets robbed, you tell them that they should have kept their gold buried somewhere that nobody knows about. > > Keeping Bitcoin on some cold-storage wallet/vault is kind-of the opposite of what money is for. There are different forms of storage for different forms of usage, non of them require an exchange or a third-party service. For example I have coins in cold-storage, which is my hardware wallet. Takes a bit of time to make a transaction, but the keys never touch an online device and hence it has relatively high security. Think about this like your savings account, just without a bank. Then I have some money to use in my Lightning wallet. Mine is a dedicated node with a remote app on the mobile phone, but there are also some that run entirely on the phone. This is for purchases, just like with your regular payment app, you scan a QR and push the pay button. This is a hot wallet, the keys are under your control, the app actively uses them to sign stuff on your behalf, but they are on an online device in memory. Think of this as your debit card or payment app. Then I also have a NFC card that can authorize small payments from a limited sub account on my node. You can just tap the card and pay. Just like the tap function on your credit/debit card. Non of this requires an exchange. All of this stuff runs on my own hardware and I’m in full control. All of it works without a bank or any centralized service. I had to ask no one to run it and I did not have to make an account anywhere. And all of it is open source. The whole financial sector including all the exchanges could burn down and it would still work. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 2:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2076 "2022-11-28T14:50:47Z")
These other two options aren’t really a solution for the masses. Sure, YOU can compile open source software and run your own node. But when Joe Sixpack tries something similar, he is still going to be exposed to getting hacked and ripped off, because he isn’t going to implement it 100% right. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 3:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2077 "2022-11-28T15:05:30Z")
You don’t need to compile open source software to run any of that. The reason why it is important that anything that has to do with security has to be open source is that it can be interdependently audited. Not by you directly, but by people who can do that. Obviously all this options are on a spectrum, from full self sufficient setup with a full node to the wallets that depend heavily on third party services. You don’t even have to be a tech wizard to run the self sufficient version. You can just run a pre-built [Umbrell](https://umbrel.com/) or [Raspiblitz](https://shop.fulmo.org/raspiblitz/), or install that software on an old Laptop with an additional 1T disk But that is just the current situation. We already have experimental setups that run a full node including a lightning node in a browser 🤪 . As hardware increases to get better it will eventually be easy to run a Bitcoin node on a phone, as the load to run one isn’t increasing and the blockchain data is only growing linearly (hardware performance increase is exponential). Even if you use a wallet that relies on an external node for information, it’s still way more independent that anything you get in the current financial system. Also to add: Non of that is actually intended for mass adoption. It doesn’t actually scale to a global audience. There will be other technologies that build on this that are intended for regular people, that doesn’t require them to have an elaborate backup strategy for their keys and where you can recover access to accounts. All still without central authorities, but will for sure have some trade-off, there always are. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 3:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2078 "2022-11-28T15:33:25Z")
I will await that future day. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 3:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2079 "2022-11-28T15:39:50Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > These other two options aren’t really a solution for the masses. BTC, It’s not for the masses, it’s for people who want a higher level of privacy when performing a transaction. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 4:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2080 "2022-11-28T16:01:17Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Ok cool, feel free to show me an example of where this happened. If there is no evidence to support this then what’s the point of taking it as gospel? I just googled it. You can keep repeating your lines but apparently what you say is a scam. > **[Two Arrested for Alleged Conspiracy to Launder $4.5 Billion in Stolen...](https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/two-arrested-alleged-conspiracy-launder-45-billion-stolen-cryptocurrency)** > > Two individuals were arrested this morning in Manhattan for an alleged conspiracy to launder cryptocurrency that was stolen during the 2016 hack of Bitfinex, a virtual currency exchange, presently valued at approximately $4.5 billion. Thus far, law... Good news is that reading comprehension will no longer be a requirement to enter Harvard and Yale university. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 4:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2081 "2022-11-28T16:03:33Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > BTC, It’s not for the masses, Make up your minds here; > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Bitcoin brings nondiscriminatory equal access to a monetary network **to everyone on the planet that has internet and a smartphone** (which are a lot of people that don’t even are banked otherwise). And it removes the power over money which by the way is constantly abused to finance wars out of the few that hold it and gives it back to the people Every day the definition of what BTC is changes with you… ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 4:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2082 "2022-11-28T16:31:01Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Every day the definition of what BTC is changes with you… That is kinda true, but not in the simplistic term you mean it 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 6:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2083 "2022-11-28T18:22:22Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Ah, so you acknowledge that there is an issue with regards to privacy. No. Another complete nonsensical post. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2022, 6:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2084 "2022-11-28T18:33:07Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > You’re free to believe that, but it’s purpose is supporting private transactions where a 3rd party isn’t needed. So if Person A sends 1 BTC to Person B… who gets the transaction fee? The ‘middleman’ that in your lies does not exist, Person C, who mines… like you… therefor 3rd party is involved in the transaction and even gets a fee. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=101) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=103)