# The Rise and Fall in Bitcoin Value **URL:** \ **Category:** Out Of Pod Experience\ **Created:** [January 18, 2022, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290 "2022-01-18T13:41:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 110
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 4:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2225 "2022-12-03T16:46:34Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > you agree with my argument but can’t attack it, Very wrong again! You don’t even have a real argument, just an uninformed opinion about basically anything. You are indeed very consistent! ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 4:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2226 "2022-12-03T16:54:50Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > I’m not getting any satisfaction from speaking with you Yeah, you can’t quote me but keep saying I wrote that. What a nice way to ignore all your mistake… burying your head in the sand. > [@Aaron](#): > > As I said earlier, people require more than “it’s a scam” in order to take you seriously. It’s the opposite. People need to be proven it’s not a scam, by people who actually have an idea what a scam is. Otherwise any investment is a scam by default. Only deluded people or children would believe people telling them to invest in a new tech that “is the future”. So there is no conversation with you because you already assume it’s not a scam, which is a stupid way to start a discussion about an investment. Now you will say “but I’m not talking about investment”. Yes you are : prove me you can talk about the technologies without it needing a constant investment. If you can’t, then you are actually talking about the investment and already starting to prove it’s a ponzi. Even if you are genuinely only interested in the technologies and never thought about getting money from this, you still are the useful idiot of people creating ponzi schemes bazed on that technology. Like that guy you just post videos of. When he was making money, it was thanks to YOU for making people believe that BTC was not a ponzi. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 5:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2227 "2022-12-03T17:35:37Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Bitcoin on the other hand is 100% electrified and can be done anywhere in the world where there is cheap and otherwise useless energy. Cheap and useless energy only suffices for short time. At some point there is no cheap and useless energy. You can see what is more important later. Heating bills or fake internet money. There are priorities at some point and BTC may be left without sufficient infrastructure and media, adoption going nowhere. Price not holding. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 6:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2228 "2022-12-03T18:04:08Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Now you will say “but I’m not talking about investment”. Yes you are : prove me you can talk about the technologies without it needing a constant investment. Ok, I can accept this point, yes we are talking about investment, but we are also talking about people who can afford investment, like a 10 to 20 year investment where all investors are fully aware that it will go up and down over the years and it will take a long to to be profitable due to the low genuine users of BTC. So yes, even if we are talking about the tech part it will need investment in design of apps and hardware equipment, again this must be invested in by people who have the money to do so and aware they could lose it, This investment really isn’t for the 40 year old who has 30k life savings with no experience in crypto or trading. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 7:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2229 "2022-12-03T19:33:13Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > but we are also talking about people who can afford investment, Hmm no ? People who know about investment don’t need our opinion on the topic. The only people whom our opinion can affect, are those that don’t know about investment and are lured by the promises of high return rate. Those who can’t differentiate between a genuine investment opportunity and a ponzi … like you. Because let’s be honest, this is not a forum made for investment experts. Moderators can’t detect scam adds either. And since you still have no idea what a ponzi is, just like you had no idea that UDP could replace TCP , just like you had no idea that the checksum in the tcp stack is used to check validity, just like you have no idea encryption is used in eg https to validate the data… You actually have no idea what BTC actually is. You are the bearer of scammers’ propaganda, a vessel made from pure ignorance and delusions. Abusing abstract terms like “it’s the future” or the idiotic “it’s a immutable ledger” (it’s not) to make a scam look legit. Over emphasing worthless features that other technologies took time to get rid of. Going one way and the other as you see fit about the properties. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 7:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2230 "2022-12-03T19:59:48Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > People who know about investment don’t need our opinion on the topic. Exactly, they know more than us and are in a position to invest effectively. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > The only people whom our opinion can affect, are those that don’t know about investment and are lured by the promises of high return rate. Which is why since I joined this thread I have been clear that people who don’t understand BTC shouldn’t invest. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Those who can’t differentiate between a genuine investment opportunity and a ponzi … like you. From your perspective then most people on the planet are unable to differentiate between a genuine investment opportunity and a ponzi… You’re not going to make any progress on this part of the topic quit already. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Because let’s be honest, this is not a forum made for investment experts. Moderators can’t detect scam adds either. Most people in this threat have tried to be honest about what BTC is or what they think it is. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > And since you still have no idea what a ponzi is, just like you had no idea that UDP could replace TCP TCP can’t replace BTC like you originally claimed this view does not comply with the OSI model. Don’t bother to try and change the nature of the conversation. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > just like you had no idea that the checksum in the tcp stack is used to check validity, just like you have no idea encryption is used in eg https to validate the data… Same as above. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > You actually have no idea what BTC actually is. You are the bearer of scammers’ propaganda, a vessel made from pure ignorance and delusions. Abusing abstract terms like “it’s the future” or the idiotic “it’s a immutable ledger” (it’s not) to make a scam look legit. Over emphasing worthless features that other technologies took time to get rid of. Going one way and the other as you see fit about the properties. Overall you have no clue what you’re talking about, this is not any kind of rational explanation for why BTC itself is a scam or why the features of BTC aren’t useful. Of course certain features aren’t going to be useful to you because you’re not a person who regularly transfers large sums of money abroad for example. Accept it or not but there are people in the world doing exactly this and the possibility is that they might benefit from lower fees using the BTC network and their coins as a type of bearer token to indicate a trusted exchange. The sender has signalled his intention to pay by transmitting a secure token to a receiver, where when the receiver bears this token to a crypto exchange they fulfil a promise to exchange it for fiat. The Token (BTC) has a value to a crypto exchange because it can be used to bear value, So when one buys BTC they are only buying something that bears value. I am aware that when it does kick off properly (when billions of people use the BTC network for genuine transactions) the investors you see today holding BTC hope to “bear” their BTC to a crypto exchange and receive a high fiat value. So what has become clear to me is that it is in a crypto exchanges interest to buy and hold BTC and possibly even limit the sale of it for the purpose of it being available to carry value among crypto exchanges. Due to crypto exchanges struggling badly we may se a buy out by Coinbase for example, they might buy and rebrand every crypto exchange in the world if their investors are onboard with this plan, then they buy all the BTC they can and then charge their customers to “lease” BTC. So overall BTC really might be a simple trusted communication to say “pay xxxxx xxxx amount in fiat because we received xxxxx amount of the token” These are some of the reasons why I think it’s amazing, because it may be a corporate type of investment that spans over 20 to 30 years, many can go ahead and push the view that it’s a shorter term investment but i would disagree. It’s like investing in BTC is investing in a planetary asset where the profit lies 50 or 60 years from now simply because that’s how long the adoption of a new (or additional) type of financial system takes. If this is true then many will have to eventually sell their BTC holding back to an exchange and go ahead and live their lives. A corporation can actually survive time and serve the ancestors of early investors. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 8:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2231 "2022-12-03T20:36:11Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > From your perspective then most people on the planet are unable to differentiate between a genuine investment opportunity and a ponzi… And that’s why scammers have an easy way. Indeed from my _experience_ in economics, most people need to be _educated_ before they actually have a knowledge. This goes for any field. This is basic definition : when you have no experience in a topic, YOU ARE TALKING ■■■■. Just trying to play with it a little does not give you experience. It gives you some knowledge about what is required to make it work, and that’s it. It’s like you try a car and then pretend this car is better than others you did not try - and it’s not a scam ! You are a simplistic idiot, to believe you are able to grasp a field with mere experiments. There is a reason you need 5 years full-time to understand it. What an arrogance to pretend you can understand in one year of a part-time hobby what other people took several full-time years, and then claim that other people have no idea on the topic. > [@Aaron](#): > > You’re not going to make any progress on this part of the topic quit already. What progress are you talking about ? Funnily you did not even address my arguments. Only making strawman. YOU are not going to make any progress on any topic quit already. > [@Aaron](#): > > Most people in this threat have tried to be honest about what BTC is or what they think it is. Prove it. You are dishonest yourself when you pretend you can quote me on something, but don’t do it when asked. It’s already a proof that you don’t care about being honest. > [@Aaron](#): > > TCP can’t replace BTC like you originally claimed Quote me on that. You can’t, because that’s a plain lie. > [@Aaron](#): > > Don’t bother to try and change the nature of the conversation. That’s what you’re doing, pretending I wrote things I did not. > [@Aaron](#): > > Same as above. Yes just the same, you have no idea what I am talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 8:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2232 "2022-12-03T20:44:19Z")
> [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > Cheap and useless energy only suffices for short time. At some point there is no cheap and useless energy. You can see what is more important later. Heating bills or fake internet money. You are mistaken, there is always wasted energy simply because of how electricity works and how production and demand always have to be balanced. The more weather dependent renewable there are on the grid, the more waste energy there will be, and the more demand for highly flexible consumers like Bitcoin there is. The effect on the bills is also the complete opposite of what you are predicting. If you have consumers that actually pick up the waste energy, that makes the renewables more profitable and it will with time even lower the price for regular consumers. If you produce 100 of something but you can only sell 60% of it, the buyers of the 60% will pay for the full 100 because you have to make back the costs. If someone now comes in and is capable of buying the remaining 40%, maybe at a cheaper price because no one else can use it, that will still reduce the price for the 60% of regular buyers. > [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > There are priorities at some point and BTC may be left without sufficient infrastructure and media, adoption going nowhere. Price not holding. That may be your perception looking in from the outside, but adoption is happening in many areas and it’s coming fast. Maybe not for you in your everyday life, but behind the scenes we will see rapid uptake and integration into a lot of services relatively rapidly now. The ECB is shitting their pants so hard right now they are in full propaganda mode against Bitcoin. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 8:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2233 "2022-12-03T20:54:20Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Bitcoin and gold are not promises to something else, they are the thing of value. 1kg of gold is around $60k, so creating would cost 48.6MWh to mine. 1kg of gold is around $60k, so creating would cost 31.3MWh to ‘recycle’. Unlike Satoshi’s Schemecoin BTC There is zero electricity required to store it. 1 unit of BTC is around $20k, and creating would cost 1,449 kilowatt hours (kWh) Only when BTC values around $596,296, it would be anywhere near comparable. But not, it has been and still is just an extreme waste of energy. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Securing gold also requires far more energy than Bitcoin. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > "Really, just trust us bro” No, I won’t trust you guys, I’ll go look it up and see that yet again all your claims are just jokes. Anyways, people have lost millions with that attitude. lol. Look at the top ten hacks. > **[The biggest cryptocurrency hacks of all time](https://techmonitor.ai/technology/cybersecurity/biggest-cryptocurrency-hacks-of-all-time)** > > Crypto hacks worth hundreds of millions of dollars reveal an industry that is learning lessons in cybersecurity the hard way. If you scroll up there is that article about that “kewl dude” who threw away his bitcoin harddisk. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 8:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2234 "2022-12-03T20:59:07Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > but adoption is happening in many areas and it’s coming fast. Many companies tried and walked away from it. You know it, I know it, you know I know and and yet you keep repeating your lies. Kinda sad, thousands of posts and you are still on the sinking Bitcoinic technology while many countries are developing their own CBDC. Why replace all countries “central banks” by one single “decentralized” workbank owned by Satoshi? Most central banks have more than one serverroom, so in your theorem they are decentralised… You should talk more about how governments are pure evil and Mr. Satoshi isn’t because “Trust me bro.” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2235 "2022-12-03T21:04:57Z")
looks like some rats are slow to leave the sinking ship… Or maybe he had more investment in that topic. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2236 "2022-12-03T21:11:03Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Unlike Satoshi’s Schemecoin BTC There is zero electricity required to store it. Yes, because it is not electrified like Bitcoin. Was this just a cheap attempt to get around the argument I made how Gold has to be secured physically with saves, concrete, steel, guns and armies. In fact every separated pile of Gold has to be secured separately. Meanwhile all of the Bitcoins are secured by the same hash power that piles on work on top and makes it near impossible to change the history. It is a much more efficient system to store and secure value. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > Only when BTC values around $596,296, it would be anywhere near comparable. Oh we will get there and beyond. And people like you will still claim it’s a ponzi. But by that time, 100% of the energy that is utilized to secure energy will be waste energy that could not be utilized otherwise. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > it has been and still is just an extreme waste of energy. On the contrary, it turns waste energy into security and property rights for everyone > [@Aedaxus](#): > > No, I won’t trust you guys, I’ll go look it up and see that yet again all your claims are just jokes. What claims did I make that turned out to be a joke? ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2237 "2022-12-03T21:11:48Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > looks like some rats are slow to leave the sinking ship… As I’ve said many times, I will still buy a small amount of it for my adhoc transactions regardless of if BTC is worth £30 each or £3,000 each many others will also do the same this is 100% an undeniable fact so there is a massive flaw in what you are saying. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2238 "2022-12-03T21:14:09Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > looks like some rats are slow to leave the sinking ship… > Or maybe he had more investment in that topic. Or he hopes it will go to over 1 billion. Aaron just mines BTC, then sells it as fast as possible, he mentioned this a while ago. He has some ‘profitable’ setup with a bunch of miners. Karak said he didn’t believe he was making a profit. But if you have a company, and maybe you randomly find money on teh street you can use it in that company. He did shut it down and claims now he’s using it to heat his home with it. Doesn’t clearly mention if it’s profitable but hey, he’s got to keep the mold out. So yeah, why not. I’m just baffled why he’s here claiming things about BTC while he has no real understanding of it and probably mentions things he got into arguments about on BTC forums? Karak… well he is more into the science and likes opens source. Not sure if he makes any profit either but he does have a more technical understanding of teh BTC and lightning protocols. Somehow both seem to have a blind spot for all the serious social, economical and environmental issues created around BTC and crypto. Things don’t always work out the way we envision them; [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/a/3/8/a381159f76cd3d6da8336e3401c2b871b868ed16.jpeg "What Will Future Homes Look Like? Filmed in the 1960's - Narrated by Walter Cronkite") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ivp442RLS8) ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2239 "2022-12-03T21:14:59Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Aaron just mines BTC, Nope, wrong, I rent out GPU processing power and am paid in BTC. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2240 "2022-12-03T21:16:57Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Many companies tried and walked away from it. You know it, I know it, you know I know and and yet you keep repeating your lies. No actually I’m pretty sure you did not understand what I was talking about and you talk about something completely different. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > Kinda sad, thousands of posts and you are still on the sinking Bitcoinic technology while many countries are developing their own CBDC. The first of them are already trashing them because no one uses them. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > Why replace all countries “central banks” by one single “decentralized” workbank owned by Satoshi? Most central banks have more than one serverroom, so in your theorem they are decentralised… There are many aspects of decentralization and the central bank clearly fails at all of them while Bitcoin covers them all better than any other system in human history. We can go into the details, but I don’t think you care anyway, so I’m not wasting my time explaining it. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > You should talk more about how governments are pure evil I don’t think that > [@Aedaxus](#): > > and Mr. Satoshi isn’t because “Trust me bro.” 😃 I don’t think that either. Satoshi gave us Bitcoin and vanished, an important part of the decentralization process. It does not matter who or what he is, Bitcoin is open source and verifiable, it works better without a leader. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2241 "2022-12-03T21:18:13Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > What claims did I make that turned out to be a joke? The following one. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > On the contrary, it turns waste energy into security and property rights for everyone You forgot a " ~~badum tisss~~" or “drumroll” after that statement. My post just linked to a website that made a list of the 10 largest BTC heists caused by insecurities related to BTC, yet you simply claim the opposite and your proof it is secure, which it isn’t as those examples show, is completely wrong. See, I refuted that and they you just post like I didn’t mention it, which is so funny. You should make another “No one can refute our claims!” post. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2242 "2022-12-03T21:19:43Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > looks like some rats are slow to leave the sinking ship… Leaving? I’m buying quite aggressively right now. Guess we will see in a couple years who was right, lol ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2243 "2022-12-03T21:20:44Z")
![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/1/2/0/120abff0a51075d417effa11aadfe113cf1f8415.jpeg) 😃 Epic. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2244 "2022-12-03T21:21:55Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > My post just linked to a website that made a list of the 10 largest BTC heists caused by insecurities related to BTC, I don’t think it’s too difficult to hack a username and password associated to a website who happens to have blockchain access. They might also be able to trick someone into giving out their 2 factor authentication code, In many cases I don’t think they are hacking the blockchains directly just the user accounts that already have access to the blockchain. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=109) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=111)