# The Rise and Fall in Bitcoin Value **URL:** \ **Category:** Out Of Pod Experience\ **Created:** [January 18, 2022, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290 "2022-01-18T13:41:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 111
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2245 "2022-12-03T21:22:17Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Guess we will see in a couple years who was right, lol I know the “two weeks!” meme, but I guess you BTC guys go for the long run, “two years!” meme. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2246 "2022-12-03T21:22:19Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Was this just a cheap attempt to get around the argument I made how Gold has to be secured physically with saves, concrete, steel, guns and armies. I have a few golden jewels. There is no concrete around them. Therefore, you are a liar. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Meanwhile all of the Bitcoins are secured by the same hash power that piles on work on top and makes it near impossible to change the history. It is a much more efficient system to store and secure value. Well yes if I can get your password I literally have access to the value you have. So it’s exactly the same… except BTC has no value. Also your BTC are not secured. That in itself is a plain lie. You have no way to prove that they are secured. (reason is : 1. you can’t prove there is no algorithm that can use a lot of energy to hash a lot of passwords to find yours. protip : BTC block validation is exactly such an algorithm ; and 2. BTC is subject to 50% attack, which is bound to happen since it’s a ponzi) > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > What claims did I make that turned out to be a joke? The question is more, what claims did you make that were not stupid to start with. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > but I don’t think you care anyway, so I’m not wasting my time explaining it. Yes you are only wasting your time making up claims and insults. I see. What a nice example of dishonesty. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Leaving? I’m buying quite aggressively right now. You forgot to add “trust me bro”. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2247 "2022-12-03T21:23:57Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > I don’t think it’s too difficult to hack a username and password associated to a website who happens to have blockchain access. They might also be able to trick someone into giving out their 2 factor authentication code, In many cases I don’t think they are hacking the blockchains directly just the user accounts that already have access to the blockchain. Indeed, and it’s much more difficult to hack a _centralized_ bank than a _decentralized_ database. By definition. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2248 "2022-12-03T21:25:30Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Indeed, and it’s much more difficult to hack a _centralized_ bank than a > _decentralized_ database. By definition. Right so they hack the actual customers instead and phone up pretending to be the bank and succeed. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2249 "2022-12-03T21:25:36Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > I don’t think it’s too difficult to hack a username and password associated to a website who happens to have blockchain access. They might also be able to trick someone into giving out their 2 factor authentication code, In many cases I don’t think they are hacking the blockchains directly just the user accounts that already have access to the blockchain. Well, maybe, just maybe that’s an issue? LOL. What kind of infantile reply is that even? Imagine people not guarding Fort Knox and 10 ton gets stolen and they are like " **Shiiiiiit** , **dude** , how can we protect the fort if people keep walking in and taking gold out? What do you expect us to do? Invade their privacy and ask their names? **Fuuuuuggg!**" Your replies are hilarious. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2250 "2022-12-03T21:28:07Z")
this is literally the same thing they can do with BTC. Scam. More even so, as BTC IS already a ponzi. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2251 "2022-12-03T21:29:16Z")
It fine that you think it’s a ponzi, I just can’t see your reasoning for that view. Every type of electronic method can advance or change and possibly become cheaper. I personally see a great relationship between a user, a miner, and a seller of BTC (crypto exchange) ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2252 "2022-12-03T21:33:07Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > I just can’t see your reasoning for that view. It’s fine as long as you understand that just because you can’t understand why, does not mean it’s not. I won’t explain, as I already said I spent too much time already on that part and you seem to be fanatic of BTC so there is no explanation that can reach you. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2253 "2022-12-03T21:33:55Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > It’s fine as long as you understand that just because you can’t understand why, does not mean it’s not. Mostly because you don’t really seem to explain much. but hey you’ll disagree and that’s fine. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > you seem to be fanatic of BTC I’m a fanatic of progress and interested in how tech can play a part. A remote transaction between two people that requires no 3rd party and actually works is progress weather you like it or not. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2254 "2022-12-03T21:40:34Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > My post just linked to a website that made a list of the 10 largest BTC heists caused by insecurities related to BTC Most of that is some crypto stuff completely unrelated to Bitcoin, and the only ones mentioning Bitcoin are exchanges. Let me guess, you still think exchanges have something to do with the security of Bitcoin? This isn’t traditional finance where Banks are the base layer system and are responsible for it’s security of it. Bitcoin does not require this companies to work, it does not require banks, and the security of Bitcoin is not contingent on any unrelated third-parties offering services on top of it. This main function of this exchanges are gambling, they are shitcoin casinos built by gamblers. This is essentially saying the internet is just trash because there exists facebook. Come again when you actually find any security issues on the Bitcoin protocol > [@Aedaxus](#): > > Karak… well he is more into the science and likes opens source. Not sure if he makes any profit either but he does have a more technical understanding of teh BTC and lightning protocols. I bought my Bitcoin 2.5 years ago (apart from the ones I’m buying right now), so you tell me if I made profit and how much. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2255 "2022-12-03T21:41:57Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Mostly because you don’t really seem to explain much. I actually made very simple explanations. Even the dumb-level explanation I gave, you distort them as a way to protect your dogma from reality. as I wrote, I won’t waste time with someone who lacks the ability to understand my words. > [@Aaron](#): > > I’m a fanatic of progress and interested in how tech can play a part. There is a huge gap between being a fanatic and being interested in. Being a fanatic means you want to keep your opinions. Being interested implies you can change your opinion given sufficient proof. Being a fanatic means you don’t care about being honest. Being interested in, allows you to take things with a rock of salt. > [@Aaron](#): > > A remote transaction between two people that requires no 3rd party and actually works is progress weather you like it or not. It’s not progress. Because the reality is not as good as you pretend it is. Because BTC actually uses Nth parties, and each has to be paid just to accept the transaction. At this level it’s a plain lie to pretend that BTC is “A remote transaction between two people that requires no 3rd party” ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2256 "2022-12-03T21:54:41Z")
I had some free time and made a meme : ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/6/c/9/6c99fbae32606aba31a7eda60cfe9a987469ffea.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 9:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2257 "2022-12-03T21:57:19Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > I have a few golden jewels. > There is no concrete around them. > Therefore, you are a liar. Until they get stolen, in that exact moment I become a prophet? > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Well yes if I can get your password I literally have access to the value you have. So it’s exactly the same… The security is the vault you store your valuables in. Obviously there has to be a way to access the value which can be compromised. Lol at the password. It is possible to have quite complex schemes to secure your access to your Bitcoin. A hardware wallet with a secure element is just the start. You can have multiple of them, you can create “N out of M” multisig wallets that will only release your coins if you sign with N of them. And all of this becomes easier and more accessible all the time. So no, it’s not the same, it’s far more elaborate and secure. > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > (reason is : 1. you can’t prove there is no algorithm that can use a lot of energy to hash a lot of passwords to find yours. protip : BTC block validation is exactly such an algorithm Stop mashing words together in an attempt to make it look like you actually say something. I know what they mean and in the arrangement you presented they make zero sense. Also it’s still not passwords, lol > [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > 1. BTC is subject to 50% attack, which is bound to happen since it’s a ponzi It’s a 51% attack. Do you actually know what that is and what it can possibly cause. Probably not. Also what has that to do with a Ponzi. I bet you don’t know that either, it just sounded coll or something. This is so ridiculous. lol ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 10:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2258 "2022-12-03T22:03:57Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > This is essentially saying the internet is just trash because there exists facebook. It is, for the most part. The other part are my posts, they are even worse. So yes, I blame the Internet but not only that, I also blame the TCP/IP stack that makes it possible for packets to travel around the world, where unsuspecting Internetizens minding their own business come across my posts. But at least the Internet is regulated unlike the Wildcat Banks style BTC has. And then we aren’t even talking about the energy waste. Which you keep denying and claiming “it’s all waste energy those private miners are using” but it’s not lol. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 10:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2259 "2022-12-03T22:08:24Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > So no, it’s not the same, BTC is a far more elaborate scam. Corrected that for you. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 10:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2260 "2022-12-03T22:17:14Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > I bought my Bitcoin 2.5 years ago (apart from the ones I’m buying right now), so you tell me if I made profit and how much. Crypto prices are falling across the board on Nov. 21 as fallout from FTX and Alameda insolvency continues to roil the entire crypto market. Damn, don’t even need a 51% attack, just a bunch of “Straight outta ~~compton~~ eh… U.S. University…” kids 😃 PS: It isn’t that bad, BTC went down 36.741,00 (68,45%). But hey, you don’t care about money. Be careful not to turn into another SBF. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 10:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2261 "2022-12-03T22:19:50Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > But at least the Internet is regulated unlike the Wildcat Banks style BTC has. The internet protocol isn’t regulated, the same way the Bitcoin protocol will not be regulated, because it makes no sense at all. Companies utilizing one or the other are and should be regulated. Probably more so with Bitcoin because it’s money and not just data. But you do know that FTX was regulated right? Credit Swiss is regulated too, so is Deutsche Bank and Lehman Brothers. I somehow trust a transparent open protocol more than this regulated companies. But feel free to continue to trust them with your wealth you worked your whole life for. Fingers crossed you did not pick a bank that will gamble with it. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > Which you keep denying and claiming “it’s all waste energy those private miners are using” but it’s not lol. No it isn’t, but it will be and I have good reasons to believe that ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 10:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2262 "2022-12-03T22:24:29Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > PS: It isn’t that bad, BTC went down 36.741,00 (68,45%). But hey, you don’t care about money. Be careful not to turn into another SBF. Yeah it also went up 700% before that. Look, I wont lie and tell you it isn’t heart breaking to think I could have sold at 69k and now buy back 3x now and simultaneously take out the 2x the investment. But hey, at least I’m still 60% up from where I bought them. How are your stocks doing? ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 10:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2263 "2022-12-03T22:25:35Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > The internet protocol isn’t regulated, the same way the Bitcoin protocol will not be regulated, because it makes no sense at all. It’s open source, but you are missing a small point. Satoshi OWNS 20% of the “monopoly money”. No government is giving 20% of the world economy’s value to some scammer. See, your comparison to TCP/IP is funny, because it’s childish and wrong. Completely like someone typing on _Quaalude_. Don’t drive your Ferrari… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2022, 10:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2264 "2022-12-03T22:29:05Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Yeah it also went up 700% before that. Look, I wont lie and tell you it isn’t heart breaking to think I could have sold at 69k and now buy back 3x now and simultaneously take out the 2x the investment. > > But hey, at least I’m still 60% up from where I bought them. How are your stocks doing? My stocks are doing well. 4.36% divident. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=110) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=112)