# The Rise and Fall in Bitcoin Value **URL:** \ **Category:** Out Of Pod Experience\ **Created:** [January 18, 2022, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290 "2022-01-18T13:41:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 125
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 5:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2531 "2022-12-14T17:16:40Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > The right to privacy **IS** the law According to art. 36, restrictions are possible, subject to the existence of public interest, a specific legal basis and the respect of the principle of proportionality. In that context, privacy and freedom of the press can come into conflict and require a necessary weighing up of the private and public interests in presence. Under Swiss law, constitutional rights apply only in the relation between the State and the citizen (including private entities). Therefore, **the above-mentioned provisions cannot be directly used in a complaint against another citizen or a private entity.** In such a context, one has to apply the below-mentioned criminal and/or civil law provisions. You don’t know much about the Swiss law apparently. Not that I didn’t assume that was the case as you needed ‘private transactions’ out of the control of the “ebil justice department”. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 5:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2532 "2022-12-14T17:26:39Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Of course it is to you because you have a narrative, Non sequitur does not depend on the opinion. The sentence I quoted makes no sense. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > If you are too lazy to go look at the context of the discussion If you are too lazy to give facts that you claim exist then don’t attempt to claim them. I bet you have nothing intelligent to add anyway. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > The right to privacy **IS** the law That’s what criminals say. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 6:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2533 "2022-12-14T18:07:57Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > And if you need to make sure the justice department cannot find out what you do with your (or other’s) money then that your issue too. Trying to make it look legal is hilarious. I would love to have a actual discussion about privacy vs. security. But I don’t think we can have that, since you are already completely drowned in the toxic idea that a just society is only possible if there is 24/7 surveillance of everyone and everything. Fact is, and history and psychology have shown this unmistakably, that a totalitarian surveillance state will lead to a lot of torment and suffering for most people. But apparently people like you need to first live trough that to understand. Have it your way and suffer to eventually reach the same conclusion I did. I’m staying out if it as good as I can. Again good luck. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 6:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2534 "2022-12-14T18:11:37Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Ignore? Yes, some of the lawmakers featured in that video want it ignored and banned. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > They are making a CBDC just like you and Karak told them to do. I didn’t. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > I keep on referring to reality whil you guys keeps talking about dreams and how the world will be. Someone not wanting their privacy infringed upon is a dream? If you bothered to watch that video you would see some of the law makers understand crypto and they can see what problems it solves in society, they blatantly say so. Blockchains have and will continue to assist law enforcement in fighting dangerous crime if it is understood better. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > You can keep on saying the opposite and you can be angry as your scheme is failing, I’m not angry about anything here, in fact I am excited about the possibilities and the way it could help society. The only scheme is one that offers a legal alternative to current financial systems such as payments without 3rd party. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/2/e/e/2ee4b8ba228db6a51765c046f1d70c637e9ebfa1.jpeg "WATCH: Congressional Hearing on the FTX Collapse - LIVE") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myRf-tVbZ-s) This is the full congressional hearing regarding FTX I’m half way through and finding it interesting, Many seem to be working hard to reverse what SBF has done, they do seem to be trying to understand it better so they can regulate it in the US. They are also starting to come to the conclusion that SBF and his FTX colleagues are at fault and not crypto in it’s self. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 6:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2535 "2022-12-14T18:33:33Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > But I don’t think we can have that, since you are already completely drowned in the toxic idea that a just society is only possible if there is 24/7 surveillance of everyone and everything. Where exactly did we say that ? ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 7:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2536 "2022-12-14T19:14:11Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Where exactly did we say that ? Your arguments are crap. So crap that you don’t even have an argument you’re just typing. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 7:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2537 "2022-12-14T19:22:41Z")
So asking source of what you affirm is crap… What a failure of an argument you have. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 7:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2538 "2022-12-14T19:25:37Z")
You’d rather bicker about nonsense than discuss issues like privacy and how it could be infringed. that’s my argument with you. the fact you don’t have an argument lol. There are laws against the infringement of privacy. all you want to do is criticise groups of people who want to pursue this legally. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 7:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2539 "2022-12-14T19:56:22Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > You’d rather bicker about nonsense than discuss issues like privacy and how it could be infringed. that’s my argument with you. It’s the opposite. I want to discuss but when people use straw men instead of sourcing their claims, there is no discussion possible. So I ask : where exactly did we say that. And still you won’t answer this, like a dishonest liar you are. Like the last time you distort my post to pretend I claim something I did not. And repeatedly do that even when told you are wrong. And AGAIN you keep insulting me rather than answer honestly. Error humanus, persevere diabolicum. > [@Aaron](#): > > all you want to do is criticise groups of people who want to pursue this legally. One more personal attack. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 8:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2540 "2022-12-14T20:25:53Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > I want to discuss but when people use straw men instead of sourcing their claims, there is no discussion possible. No you don’t, I even posted an entire congressional hearing on the SBF matter where they also speak about crypto in general, I’ve made similar points to the video yet you say they are strawmen. You really should stop typing if you enjoy being so difficult to speak with. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 8:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2541 "2022-12-14T20:29:18Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > No you don’t Yes I do. > [@Aaron](#): > > I even posted an entire So what ? Again it’s a non sequitur. > [@Aaron](#): > > I’ve made similar points to the video yet you say they are strawmen. Where exactly ? You really should stop typing if you can’t even read what I actually wrote. All the time you make straw men because you don’t read what I ACTUALLY write. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 8:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2542 "2022-12-14T20:35:49Z")
Bye stef. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2022, 8:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2543 "2022-12-14T20:36:35Z")
Indeed, all you wrote was wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Keara\_the\_Reaver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/keara_the_reaver/32/344828_2.png) [@Keara\_the\_Reaver](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Keara_the_Reaver)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2022, 10:11am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2544 "2022-12-15T10:11:17Z")
Yet another fraudster behind bars. I hope they throw the book hard at this one. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/6/5/9/65995cfa370b59edab81f167a3bc62e9ec012d13.jpeg "Sam Bankman-Fried Faces Fraud Charges, Lawsuits Tied to FTX Collapse | WSJ") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oALv48BicV0) ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2022, 10:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2545 "2022-12-15T10:53:18Z")
Yes, from the very beginning he was mixing customer funds and trying to make it look like FTX was earning lots and lots of profit to get more investors onboard. I expect there will be more arrests as his colleagues would have been doing the same thing. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/0/2/3/023902c3c9b506f52c1fd2459d8f9c3d2cc25acc.jpeg "FTX Exec Warned Regulators of Possible Misuse of Funds") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4RkdHKkfxo) This video below is a good conversation; [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/3/5/9/359ab842c57d13686882a9628e98c9ecd003ad77.jpeg "Scam of the century? Cryptocurrency and the collapse of FTX • FRANCE 24 English") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ra7L4y2bzs8) ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2022, 11:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2546 "2022-12-15T23:14:10Z")
It isn’t fraud, it is a feature. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2022, 7:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2547 "2022-12-16T07:43:35Z")
Of centralised fiat constructs, indeed. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2022, 12:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2548 "2022-12-17T00:02:03Z")
[![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/f/d/7/fd781cbc5e1a97d3ed19cbab85cfd9baa8350f7d.jpeg "Kevin O’Leary Exposed! A BIG Liar Who Support Fraud” Binance CEO CZ Reveals") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIEShRiyikU) ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2022, 4:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2549 "2022-12-17T16:51:08Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > > [@Aedaxus](#): > > > > They are making a CBDC just like you and Karak told them to do. > > I didn’t. Yes, you did. You said anyone can make a currency. > [@Aaron](#): > > all you want to do is criticise groups of people who want to pursue this legally. Like the "privacy cartels who used to put USD in dufflebags and drop them over the border from their ‘private jets’. Lots of privacy there. 😃 > [@Aaron](#): > > Bye stef. Bye? Does the person asking about crypto expose to much of your Satoshi Scheme? Do they need to dissapear now? Or bye like an “exchange run”? Those appear more frequently than the so called bank runs. Ironically. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2022, 5:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/2550 "2022-12-17T17:44:01Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > You said anyone can make a currency. Yes they can, but it might get completely ignored and fail. As long as they are prepared to accept this it’s fine. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > Like the "privacy cartels who used to put USD in dufflebags and drop them over the border from their ‘private jets’. Lots of privacy there. 😃 Go ahead and pretend that money laundering and criminals using fiat wasn’t present long before BTC, it was. As far as I can see law enforcement seem to be doing okay in their effort to catch criminals who use crypto. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > Bye? Does the person asking about crypto expose to much of your Satoshi Scheme? Do they need to dissapear now? > Or bye like an “exchange run”? Those appear more frequently than the so called bank runs. Ironically. Yes, every point I make he will just say it’s not the logical progression of the convo which is a very silly way to talk. He’s not looking to accept anything like crypto solves the issue of centralization for example, he’s not even interested in gaining a full understanding of what crypto is before he writes an essay on it. By all means he can go ahead and ignore everything but he should never expect whoever he is talking with to follow in that delusion where everything is ignored. I can see this attitude within the lawmakers in the US on the congressional hearing videos, a good hand full of them really aren’t bothered to find out what crypto is, one of them even claimed transactions could be changed on blockchains. People always tend to look at things with their perspective, but I understand that generations move on and as I said earlier BTC and crypto will be totally normal to anyone being born today, these same people will grow up to be our lawmakers and will help to create laws to stop people using crypto for sinister means and protect investment customers. So yes, yourself and Stef can ignore it or pretend only criminals use it but intelligent people who have taken the time to have a good understanding wont agree. I like honest convo and I can see clearly I will not get that from yourself or Stef. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=124) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=126)