# The Rise and Fall in Bitcoin Value **URL:** \ **Category:** Out Of Pod Experience\ **Created:** [January 18, 2022, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290 "2022-01-18T13:41:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 29
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 12:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/561 "2022-05-20T00:21:28Z")
> [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > Its just that they know how to fool people, some better, some worse. I guess so, Although I will say the way Do Kwon talks was always concerning, Many reporters and specialists talked about his ventures and many had the exact concerns that it would fail if there was ever a bad economy. He was extremely rude to them and said he didn’t have to talk to poor people, If this is who people were prepared to invest their life savings with then i’d say the Lunatics fooled themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Emotional\_Support\_Clown](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emotional_support_clown/32/310422_2.png) [@Emotional\_Support\_Clown](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emotional_Support_Clown)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 5:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/562 "2022-05-20T05:14:12Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > everybody on the ballot is the same sort of stooge Election times ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/c/9/c/c9cdf620cca91c729f9a37c39e1de3a227d6e2b8.gif) ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/7/c/4/7c4c07f731f6ba5fd06c3c880da8845c032b58c0.gif) _Prepping_ is not so much a fringe ideology now is it 😏 You did stock up on medicines too (as well as food)? Most are made in China or India and other countries are cutting exports to fend for their own. The _great leap forward_ 2.0 is in progress, this time it’s your turn to take the leap. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 7:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/563 "2022-05-20T07:17:49Z")
Indeed buddy, I find it strange when people ignore all of what you said and are more concerned about Bitcoin being the problem in the economy. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 7:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/564 "2022-05-20T07:26:28Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > If 1Kwh of electricity costs $1 to “buy” and ANYONE can make $2 from it… do you understand the economical joke? There isn’t much difference to a factory. The owner manufactures things, so lets say whatever they are manufacturing costs £1 for materials, electric and labour once the product is made they sell them for £2 each. Why is the manufacturers process not an economical joke? and why is my mining operation an economical joke? Essentially we are both generating a product that has value. I’m an economic joke for providing processing power to a miner and being paid in BTC. ok. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 7:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/565 "2022-05-20T07:41:05Z")
> [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > Sell at that price? 😆 Yes, You’re right, Do Kwon would have brought the BTC at around 40k each so the loss would be around £16k per BTC if he cashed out and refunded. It might be best to just give the Lunatics the BTC and go back to the drawing board. At least they will have something and they can wait for the price of BTC to get higher before cashing out and getting back their life savings. Do Kwon’s idea has failed and it will fail again if he wants the Lunatic community to invest a lot in one of his schemes. He should create a scheme which caps the amount each investor can put in to £2k and just assume the economy will always be bad. What he will find is that investors won’t cash out because the initial investment was small which will encourage more investors to get onboard, I could be wrong but I think this is how you create a stablecoin. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 7:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/566 "2022-05-20T07:53:06Z")
> **[Investor who lost $2.3 million terrifies crypto founder’s home in alleged...](https://news.yahoo.com/investor-lost-2-3-million-223538273.html)** > > A man who claims to have lost up to 3 billion won (approximately $2.37 million) following the collapse of the cryptocurrency Luna has been questioned by South Korean police after allegedly trespassing into the apartment building of the... Do Kwon best be careful someone doesn’t do him harm, people will do some desperate things when they’ve lost millions. I pray he refunds them with BTC to avoid any unfortunate event. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/4/2/d/42df32fe24bf8c6bf2632bef271170a5765ddb64.jpeg "Wu-Tang Clan - Careful (Click, Click) (Official Video)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUz5_UlvqQ8) ---
**Author:** ![Emotional\_Support\_Clown](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emotional_support_clown/32/310422_2.png) [@Emotional\_Support\_Clown](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emotional_Support_Clown)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 7:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/567 "2022-05-20T07:57:50Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > people will do some desperate things when they’ve lost millions From the article… > He then rang Kwon’s doorbell, which his wife answered. > The man asked if her husband was home before running off, according to reports. So he’s a doorbell ringer and runner off like a cowardly child. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 8:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/568 "2022-05-20T08:01:59Z")
> [@Emotional\_Support\_Clown](#): > > So he’s a doorbell ringer and runner off like a cowardly child. That’s just the start buddy, I certainly wouldn’t want to deal with 200,000 people who are angry with me and have nothing to lose. This is dangerous territory. What if one of the investors become suicidal and do something bad to Kwon before…you know. According to reports many investors in Luna have already taken their life. it’s very sad. I can’t lie, I’d be terrified if such people rang the buzzer and my wife answered and I wasn’t there. wouldn’t you? ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 11:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/569 "2022-05-20T11:31:50Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Boy will you be surprised when you find out how fiat is created I’m okay with the last 40 years that I have been using it. Can’t say that of Bitcoin. Also I told you Bitcoin forked and it’s forks are still around and having a value although you told me it was not. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > You think I did not claim that. I told you it would not solve the issue, to teh contrary, it would be even worse as countries can’t stop > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Listen to the podcast from Saifedian above. I will check it out, as an “anarchist” I don’t think he can be of any use as I don’t see how “worldwide anarchy would work”. But because you insist, I’ll go take a look. We have opposite opinions an crypto but I do respect your knowledge and effort to explain it to all who are interested. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > If you make posts like this where you deliberately pick some arbitrary points to make it look like it’s loosing value over time It has been loosing value from the first moment I posted a 1 year to date, on each random occasion I did it, and yes, I was surprised it didn’t even jump exceptionally compared to last year. It’s extremely dishonest to claim I’m picking arbitrary points. I make a check on each moment I post, compared to the value of last year and clearly stated you could do exactly the same, yet here we are. It’s -4.650,63 (14,00%) down, so all the poor people you wanted to make rich in El Salvador still wait and don’t blame that on my “evil scheming datapoint picking”. Meanwhile in El Salvador, the truth comes out… [El Salvador's plan to create the first Bitcoin-powered nation is tanking the economy—and is a mess by every measure | Fortune](https://fortune.com/2022/01/19/el-salvador-bitcoin-economy-distressed-debt/) Dear Dictator is making good money with the overseas transfers, worse than Western Union. Kinda like the discussion about that we had, but now… your points are moot, proof is on the table. > [@Aaron](#): > > The economical joke is that the people elected to govern countries are a bunch of muppets who have no clue what they are doing and don’t think rules apply to them. That’s a weak defense. There is a system in place, you propose a new system. I see disadvantages you say “Your leaders are muppets”. Not sure, I like the Muppet show, I know my leaders aren’t the best but crypto will not solve that. Please explain me (and everyone reading this tread) how it would. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 11:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/570 "2022-05-20T11:36:22Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > are more concerned about Bitcoin being the problem in the economy. It’s not the solution, don’t invert the issue. Let me try and not point at crypto. Explain how we can solve the economical crisis by printing more MGM Grand casino tokens. Ok, physical but still, proove me. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 11:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/571 "2022-05-20T11:50:11Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > Why is the manufacturers process not an economical joke? and why is my mining operation an economical joke? Essentially we are both generating a product that has value. > > I’m an economic joke for providing processing power to a miner and being paid in BTC. ok. You take a sharp turn here. Let me correct you, no factory turns bulk electricty into anything. A factory uses energy as one of the many resources to make certain physical objects. The only ‘factory’ that would do anything near what you claim would a a company that creates software solutions. But that would be absurd to assume electricty is the main component of software, the programming code created is the real value anbd product. What you do is buy materials (PC, components), employ yourself employed as manager and maintenance guy “for free”, don’t need an accountant -as taxes are for people who don’t know how to do economy right- and use it to repay a loan. I assume you have other sources of income which I can understand you don’t declare due to the ‘evil banks’ that would like to get a share before you. So, it’s a nice way for you to pay off a debt. By all means, but that does not make it into a good (or scalable) business. Nor will it make crypto replace other forms of valuables/currencies. I understand that you are proud of what you accomplished, and me too, I applaud your hard work combined by cunning to get this to work and you put some money on the line for that too. What I do see is the persistence of an EVE Player making a “not so good solution” actually work for him. But that doesn’t make crypto a good alternative to any currency. Maybe if our economy is completely destroyed, then it could be used to scam some people out of money, but even then it would not work due to the cost versus profit isn’t positive, in so many ways. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 12:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/572 "2022-05-20T12:40:00Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > But that would be absurd to assume electricty is the main component of software, the programming code created is the real value anbd product. Electricity is an ESSENTIAL component to ANY tech related business, without it nothing is possible. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > It’s not the solution, don’t invert the issue. Are you 100% sure? From my perspective I can see that BTC has created lots of administrative jobs which is good for an economy, it has created lots of sole traders and tech related jobs, many people invest in BTC as sole traders. Nobody is saying BTC is the complete solution, what I will say is that BTC helps economies go in a good direction. The streetfood seller in El Salvador will adjust the cost of his food and increase the amount of BTC needed to buy food from him if the value of BTC goes lower. all other traders and businesses will do the same. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 1:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/573 "2022-05-20T13:28:22Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > Also I told you Bitcoin forked and it’s forks are still around and having a value although you told me it was not. Nah, this is a lie. I told you they lose value and and fade into insignificance. They will probably always have some remaining value as a collectable. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > I did not claim that. I told you it would not solve the issue, to teh contrary, it would be even worse as countries can’t stop Then tell me the mechanism by which Bitcoin will make war more likely. You are just making empty claims and don’t even bother to motivate them. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > I will check it out, as an “anarchist” I don’t think he can be of any use as I don’t see how “worldwide anarchy would work”. I don’t get anarchism either, although I listen to quite many podcasts of them explaining their position, I don’t think that works. I also don’t think Bitcoin leads to anarchism or that Bitcoin is anarchistic or political at all. > [@Aedaxus](#): > > Kinda like the discussion about that we had, but now… your points are moot, proof is on the table. That article reads like some opinion piece by an old fart who is really not amused by Bitcoin and has actually no idea what it is and how it works was asked about El Salvadors adoption and now unloads how rant about why they didn’t ask him. And you read that and take it as actual information. Are you serious? We will see in a couple years how this plays out. Meanwhile a lot more countries will join El Salvador, and there is nothing the western cry babies can do about it. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 2:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/574 "2022-05-20T14:34:58Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > We will see in a couple years how this plays out. I’m onboard with this, El Salvadorians have to think long term and Bukele is doing just that. I’ll be really happy for them when the value of BTC increases and is in high demand. Can’t wait to see how it looks in a few years. ---
**Author:** ![Aedaxus](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aedaxus/32/393915_2.png) [@Aedaxus](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aedaxus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 2:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/575 "2022-05-20T14:48:50Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Then tell me the mechanism by which Bitcoin will make war more likely. Bitcoin is not controlled by governments but small corporations ran by anarchists. Their goal is reduce governmental power. pit two governments against each other, get your assets locked away. Imagine a world where that “internationalist” will say "Nah, I’ll keep my power and watch two countries burn. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > Nah, this is a lie. [Bitcoin Gold USD (BTG-USD) Price, Value, News & History - Yahoo Finance](https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/BTG-USD/) $19 this is clear proof there are 21 million coins that are ‘forked’ from the original limit thus PROOVING there IS NO LIMIT AT ALL and bitcoin printer goes brrrr. I should go and look for the picture I made with the “bitcoin printer goes brrrrr…” with doc from Back 2 The Future. It’s sad you say I’m lying. I’m not. Everyone can find it. Maybe redefine crypto and say no one is allowed to look beyond BTC and lightning as it would fit your narratiove but regrettable the truth is out there as Mulder would say. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > And you read that and take it as actual information. Are you serious? ([El Salvador and the Potential for Low-Fee Crypto-Remittances – Institute for Business in the Global Context](https://sites.tufts.edu/ibgc/el-salvador-and-the-potential-for-low-fee-crypto-remittances/)) Depending on the service, it can be _more expensive_ to send in cash from the U.S. to a bank account in El Salvador (versus cash pickup). Even more liars! [https://finance.yahoo.com/news/remittances-el-salvador-cheaper-without-144325716.html](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/remittances-el-salvador-cheaper-without-144325716.html) But, how do they fake those data? And you can actually replicate this! Please elaborate how they faked the transactions of your holy ledger! > [@Aaron](#): > > Can’t wait to see how it looks in a few years. > [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > We will see in a couple years how this plays out In two years we’ll still be using banks. In two years there will still be governments. In two years countries will still have their regional/national currencies. Feel free to quote me on that when I’m wrong. Still waiting for the day Bitcoin would actually make a profit in a year. I’m actually surprised it keeps on tanking. With a sucker born every day, you guys aren’t doing a good job promoting “the magical currency that will make everyone rich”. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/d/a/d/dad6a4cabbc9892522aa9412a145eeceab7f2126.jpeg "Blake's 7 - Orac's Prediction") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T21j3kwv6Hk) ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 2:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/576 "2022-05-20T14:49:05Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > long term They will have to pay their bills and fines with something tho, in that long time that have to pass. And there is no guarantee where bitcoin will be in few years. I wonder what would happen if all salvadorans would have to use only bitcoin in internal transactions, without loans in any currencies or anything like that. That would be funny to watch. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 4:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/577 "2022-05-20T16:52:52Z")
Anarchism would never work. It would be like having a world without lawyers . . . someday a lawyer would be born and he would be able to take everybody’s stuff without any resistance from other lawyers! ---
**Author:** ![Emotional\_Support\_Clown](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emotional_support_clown/32/310422_2.png) [@Emotional\_Support\_Clown](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emotional_Support_Clown)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 5:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/578 "2022-05-20T17:10:22Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > someday a lawyer would be born and he would be able to take everybody’s stuff That’s exactly what the US are attempting to do right now (watch a few bills get passed to enable that), except the blowback is disasterous to themselves further down the line, consequence of state sanctioned piracy is, nobody’s property is safe and the notion of ownership and private property is over (also note that’s what the WEF want). They also want a world controlled and structured like a corporation (company towns are back again, just on a planetary scale, they do this already at the nation level with revolutions, societal distruptions and puppet leaders). It’s a zero sum game to them, winning by any means is everything, and it’s a long game. ---
**Author:** ![Aaron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaron/32/379788_2.png) [@Aaron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaron)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 5:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/579 "2022-05-20T17:18:02Z")
> [@Aedaxus](#): > > I’m actually surprised it keeps on tanking. With a sucker born every day, you guys aren’t doing a good job promoting “the magical currency that will make everyone rich”. More nonsense, why do I need to promote Bitcoin? I think you’re confusing BTC with ponzi schemes like TerraUSD and Luna, they seriously aren’t the same thing, that fact will not change just because you think you’re right. Some people use BTC on an ad-hoc basis, so they will only buy it when they want to complete a private legal transaction and where the retailer only accepts BTC. If you asked me for advice I would tell you not to buy any BTC. I would tell you to go and read more about it and develop an understanding. ---
**Author:** ![Emotional\_Support\_Clown](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emotional_support_clown/32/310422_2.png) [@Emotional\_Support\_Clown](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emotional_Support_Clown)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2022, 5:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290/580 "2022-05-20T17:19:36Z")
> [@Aaron](#): > > why do I need to promote Bitcoin? Bitcoin is self-promoting, no need to do anything, the money printers (central banks) do the promotion work. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=28) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/the-rise-and-fall-in-bitcoin-value/346290.md?page=30)